Orvis Announcement

[Bamboozle]

95 percent fishing gear is made to catch fisherman not fish. Companies have to come up with new products to stay in business. Most people think the higher the price the better the product, that's not always the case.

When the higher price offers REAL performance improvements it's justified even if you don't want to or feel the need to pay the higher price.

However, fly fisherman seem to be the most susceptible to paying more for nothing gained.

For example:

I make no secret that I also fish conventionally. For decades I have chuckled at fly anglers (myself included) who readily pay hundreds of dollars for a reel with one gear that does nothing but hold line. In the meantime, for a lot less money I can buy a conventional reel with a zillion moving parts, meshing gears, a real drag and technology out the a$$.

I recently bought a new spinning reel for the cost of a pretty decent fly reel. The difference in performance between this new reel and my old reel (which was a higher end reel at the time) is like night & day. It also cost about 4 times more than my old spinning reel.

With my fly fisherman hat on I could also buy a NEW Hardy LRH or a new Orvis CFO for 4 times more than the LRH or CFO I bought DECADES ago and other than the newer versions being machined, they are identical with ZERO performance upgrade...

...for 4 times more money...

I guess someone could claim the machining and anodizing costs more, but that doesn't equate to something that actually WORKS better?

Bottom line - A lot more often than people want to admit, you DO get what you pay for...

 

[rancid waders]

Well I am glad to see someone figured out how to make it stronger at least. Now if they made a zero wt...then I may eyeball one.

 

[kbobb]

A white label wouldn't/doesn't bother me. I honestly never look at my fly rod while fishing unless it's to clear a tangle or something. I'm focused on the water, where I want to cast, and are any fish taking my fly.
To me it's a tool, looking at it while fishing is like looking at your hammer while trying to pound nails.

 

[BradFromPotter]

I never understood the white label hate!! It looks pretty cool to me. As far as price range, a rod is personal…. It’s what speaks to your casting stroke. I always think it’s crazy when people buy a rod online without casting it first. I own a r8 core and a cheap Cabela’s prime glass rod for $50 and several between those price points and can’t say one is “better” than the other. It’s all personal preference.

no hate just plain ugly!

 

[DomR]

With my fly fisherman hat on I could also buy a NEW Hardy LRH or a new Orvis CFO for 4 times more than the LRH or CFO I bought DECADES ago and other than the newer versions being machined, they are identical with ZERO performance upgrade...

...for 4 times more money...

I guess someone could claim the machining and anodizing costs more, but that doesn't equate to something that actually WORKS better?

And that is why companies like Orvis and Hardy (and others) have sustainable profit margins. They supremely market a "need" driven not by high tech performance but by paradigm and perception. Psychologically fascinating case, it also speaks to a time tested design, I mean how much tech can you have on a click and pawl.

BTW - I'm a HUGE fan of both my vintage LRH and newer CFO. Oh that sound.....

 

[rancid waders]

It's all about what the consumer market will bear as final price on how well it goes on this one.

 

[Tigereye]

This thread was made for silent ocelot, wheres he at, haha

Been missing a while. Haven't heard from him in a few months. Hope he's ok.

 

[krayfish2]

Different tools for different uses.

Can you fish an 8 foot 4wt Redington CT in most places in PA? Of course. Would it work throwing a #12 march brown? In many cases, yes. Is it the correct set up for throwing a #12 fly into the wind 65' to a bank feeder you've spent 40 minutes stalking? Nope, not even close to the right tool. In that case, you may only get one shot at that fish of the year and need to make it count. Higher end / performance rods win that battle easily. As an angler that looks for difficult fish and long distance casts, some higher end rods do make a huge difference. My problem is I'm somewhere between being a cheapskate and a broke azz. 😂

Conversely, you don't need an Asquith or H4 to toss #16 EHC to 9" stockers at the run in boiling springs. In that case, those performance rods are making the task more difficult.

If you've got money to burn and want to best of the best.... you do you. Nothing wrong with it. If you suck at fishing and think buying a $2000 will make you better, you're a fool. Some anglers get all hyped up by the fly shop guy and end up with high priced stuff ill suited for their needs. I do feel sorry for those guys though.

 

[a23fish]

I saw three new H4s in my local fly shop today. Although they do look different than almost all other fly rods displayed, they actually look pretty good to my eyes. The colors of the blank & logo are subdued but distinctive.

 

[wildtrout2]

If you've got money to burn and want to best of the best.... you do you. Nothing wrong with it. If you suck at fishing and think buying a $2000 will make you better, you're a fool. I do feel sorry for those guys though.

Agree.
This reminds me of a time a few years ago when I took a buddy fishing with me, which is a rarity. We both got set up and started fishing this somewhat tight stream. After a short while, maybe a 100yrds or so upstream, I see my buddy sitting on a big rock. I asked him why he wasn't fishing? He said "I'm just enjoying watching you cast". He told me he's used to bigger water, where it's easier casting.
This is a guy who has thousands of dollars worth of high end Sage and Orvis rods and can't cast to save his life. I did feel sorry for him. I ain't so much the stick, it's the user.

 

[Nymph-wristed]

 

[krayfish2]

Is that a Johnny Utah reference 🤣😳🤣🤣🤣

 

[bringthepain]

View attachment 1641234274

Haha, i say that to people all the time and no one gets it!!!

 

[6xAdams(Jones)]

If I'm not mistaken, accuracy is based on equipment and precision is based on ability. An accurate rifle will print a dime-size group on paper and a precision shooter will put a group from the same rifle into the 10-ring. I spent $75 on a used rifle in the 70s, which was accurate enough that my own abilities allowed me to kill deer and groundhogs with it. I can't even name a high-priced, custom-made tack driver.
None of the flyrods I have ever used cost more than about $200 (true, I'm going back 30+ years). I considered them all to be accurate enough for my precise-enough ability to allow me to catch fish, so I have no personal need to buy a rod for >$200.
Still the graphics that show the accuracy of the new $2000 rods look pretty cool to someone with some engineering experience. The rods look pretty nice too.

 

[Nocktavius]

can anyone actually explain what these graphs refer to?

 

[6xAdams(Jones)]

can anyone actually explain what these graphs refer to?

I found it in an article on hatchmag.com. Four different rods were tested on a "casting machine" including the H3F. The spirographs are less accurate than the straighter graphs. What Orvis should be selling is the casting machine. (Just kidding 🙃)

 

[PennKev]

can anyone actually explain what these graphs refer to?

Tip ocilation path?


I dunno. It really lacks context.

"4 times more accurate" could be referring a measurable, but very small realized gain.

 

[albatross]

Top competitor #1 looks pretty good to me, wonder what that one costs?

 

[6xAdams(Jones)]

Tip ocilation path?


I dunno. It really lacks context.

"4 times more accurate" could be referring a measurable, but very small realized gain.

Right... Competitors 2 and 3 appear to track "worse" than the H3 and Competitor 1. That doesn't mean that any of them are to be considered as unacceptable.

 

[afishinado]