The Spotburning Thread

[troutslammer]

Springer and john ,

I guess with age comes wisdom (hats off to you guys !!!) Not all people have the motivation to go out and find out for themselves. Instead they would rather be spoon fed as alot on this site are that way. It is time consuming and very expensive to explore or hit the streams when they are ideal for what we seek out. When you talk amongst friends face to face you know the audience and their intentions . When you type something on a stream report for thousands of people to see it you have no idea who the audience is. The lazy people support detailed reports and without the stream reports section i would say Dkiles numbers wouldn't look so good and he knows it ! This is one of the few sites that will allow detailed info to be given out on streams. If you want an expierience like mushmutt had on valley then do the exact smae thing he did "hey i caight 15 at valley on such and such a fly " then come back a week later and ***** u got crowded out !!! when you google about stream reports Pa Fly Fish comes right up ! So post Away and ***** later !!!!

 

[rrt]

Good heavens, am I posting under other screen names?

 

[TimMurphy]

Dear Board,

I'm only 52, but I am perpetually grumpy, I suppose that would qualify me for membership in your club as a Junior member?

The only trouble is, I have no interest whatsoever in joining your club.

I've spent years exploring and have found my share of honey holes and prime techniques and I have shared them all with people I felt were upstanding people who appreciated what I told to them. So far I've yet to discover a single instance where I made a poor choice.

So please feel free to continue to complain knowing you will have no effect at all on this guy or anyone else that he fishes with.

Regards,

Tim Murphy 🙂

 

[krayfish]

Reading some of this stuff reminds me of crap I'd hear come out of my old mans mouth. "I had to do xxxxxxxx when I was a kid, so you do xxxxxxx as long as you're my son". Blah, blah.

I had to look by myself, struggle, walk miles and do my own exploring, so all anglers deserve to do the same. ??? If you didn't ask someone for help, to share a technique or some stream information, that's your fault. Just because someone on the web asks for info on a stream doesn't make them lazy or spoon fed. If you are of a more independent mindset and you want to do it all on your own, awesome. Guess you won't be asking others for help. I'm guessing that the guys asking for stream info is lost in directions, lost in fishing know how, has limited time or are just a little less ambitious so let’s crucify them and call them names. Who’s with me? If you crap your pants 3 times a day, does that mean the rest of us should also crap our pants 3 times a day too?

Like Tim, I have yet to regret sharing info. Enough people did it with me when I was starting out and it was greatly appreciated. I also did plenty of exploring on my own and it is very satisfying when you stumble upon something quite special. Was it more satisfying than when someone took me to a secret spot? Not really.

If the problem is poaching, then the problem lies with the poachers and not the stream reports. People who are determined to break the rules will always find a way to do so and yes, they basically ruin it for the rest of us. I haven’t killed a fish of any species in 25+ years and anyone that fishes with me knows the unwritten rule: “All fish must be returned unharmed when fishing with me”. I don’t think I’ve ever said it out loud but it’s implied and has been adhered to. When fishing BS in the early 80’s, I met a kid that was maybe 12-13. He had some old beat up glass rod rigged with a PURPLE Dalhberg diver. I chuckled to myself. When he was leaving, I watched him pick up his stringer that had a 20”+ brookie on it. Was I mad at the kid for keeping the fish? Nope, it was trophy trout regs at that time and I couldn’t hold it against someone keeping a fish that was legal. I was mad at myself for thinking less of the kid for his beat up old outfit, tattered clothes and what I considered to be a hilarious fly selection. I was going to offer to help him out so that he could catch something but it looks like he was the one that should have been giving the pointers.

The end.

 

[springer1]

I've spent years exploring and have found my share of honey holes and prime techniques and I have shared them all with people I felt were upstanding people who appreciated what I told to them.

Me too.

So far I've yet to discover a single instance where I made a poor choice.

Me. neither.

The trouble with posting to every surfer with a computer and having the post available for as long into the future as the site is operative - is that it's impossible to limit or discern who I'm sharing with.

 

[DBNymph]

Well said Krayfish!

 

[DBNymph]

Anyone can go to a "Spot". Some catch, others don't. Knowing a "spot" doesn't mean a friggin thing.

 

[DBNymph]

However, some think that by walking into a stream and seeing someone in their "Spot" they have been wronged. I would have to say, unless you own the land on that "spot" then if you call it your "spot" YOU FISH IT TOO MUCH!

 

[Maurice]

DBNymph wrote:
However, some think that by walking into a stream and seeing someone in their "Spot" they have been wronged. I would have to say, unless you own the land on that "spot" then if you call it your "spot" YOU FISH IT TOO MUCH!

BANG!

 

[Phish_On]

My .02$....WHO CARES!

 

[afishinado]

troutslammer wrote:
Fadeaway started a thread me and another got skunked on valley and muchmutt caught 15 (or something like that ) So mushmutt puffs his chest out and writes up a nice report telling everybody how great it was . Well he then found out later as he said in his post approx. a week later that he got crowded while fishing there !! The title of his thread was labeled "chaos on valley " The mods deleted the thread because it made them look like monkeys because they all know the stream reports take away pressure not add it . I say to Mushmutt and others ...WELCOME TO PA FLYFISH !!! PS. you can't have your cake and eat it too !!!!

Troutslammer,

Here is the original post for this thread:


"Enough already! We are all getting a headache from reading dozens and dozens of spot burning admonitions in the stream reports and stream locations threads.

We are not Marxists on here - we all believe in free speech.........but a stream report is......a stream report, and bitchin about spot burning.... is bitchin about spot burning.

DO NOT POST SPOTBURNING TOPICS OR ANY OTHER TOPICS IN STREAM REPORTS OR STREAM LOCATIONS TO DERAIL THE THREAD. THIS HOLDS TRUE FOR ALL THREADS IN ALL FORUMS.

BE COURTEOUS, START A NEW THREAD IF YOU WISH TO COMMENT ON A SUBJECT DIFFERENT FROM THE ORIGINAL POST.

POSTS TAKING ANY THREADS OFF-TOPIC WILL BE DELETED.

POSTERS ATTACKING OTHER POSTERS WILL BE WARNED AND MAY BE BANNED.

I have started this thread so we can all know what the topic is, and we can choose to read or not read it.

All opinions about spotburning all welcome in this thread."



Switch to decaf, Dude! Read what other members have posted above, many of them have been on here for a long time (more than a decade) and have helped out anglers for at least that long.

You have guys on here like Heritage Ed, Old Lefty, Krayfish and many others that take their own free time to help people learn about fly-fishing and set up events for all members to attend. There are a whole lot of members like Sal, PCray and a many others that take time to explain things, post links, pics, etc. about all subjects related to fly-fishing. The site has turned into an amazing resource for both noobies and experts to discuss all things related to FFing.

Stream reports are really few and far between. There are over a hundred active threads and only a small handful of stream reports at any given time. And, nearly all of them are about streams that are known by all. If Valley Creek is the only place you fish, perhaps YOU should spend some time exploring.

In addition to many members on this site that spend time for the benefit of all, the Mods spend a lot own free time on this site, and spend time and effort setting up events for all the members to participate, all this to help fellow fly-fishers.

I enjoy all the time I spend on this trying to help fellow FFers. The only thing that is a drag is having to deal with a very small minority that is intent on disrupting this site.

We bend over backwards to allow everyone to post freely and have their voice heard, but when all you hear from a member is bitchin’, than it wears thin for everyone. I love to read everything and anything about fly-fishing, but if I want to hear bitchin’…..I’ll just go visit my mother-in-law.

 

[djs12354]

As with all arguments there is some level of "right" on both sides.

One thing that people lose sight of is the simple fact that while this is a publicly accessible forum, it is not the property of the members but the forum owner.
With that in mind, if you disagree with the philospy of the forum owner and their appointed moderators and cannot come to terms with their decisions about what is allowable, you have other choices:

1. Leave the forum

2. Accept the terms of the forum and enjoy the other posts and learn form them.

3. Don't go into the threads that upset you. Life's too short to be perpetually P.O.'d.

As it has been stated previously, most of what we all fish is public water on public land. We may not like when it's crowded, but it's not called public for nothing.

Just my thoughts. (And I'm crazy enough to be out fishing at this time of year.)

 

[JohnPowers]

I thought this was just a discussion between adults about a subject we all seem interested in. Now we have the rational adults telling us to cool down. So what's this forum for anyway? When a topic generates this kind of response I think it's a good thing.

 

[JackM]

A topic may be OK to discuss, but methods of "discussions" should not get personal or insulting. The main thing to understand is that the complaints are unlikely to change anything, tend to make publicity greater, and eventually are detrimental to this community, imo.

 

[Gone4Day]

Personally, I think fisherman cause stream reports, not the other way around. On any given trout stream, maybe 10% have even heard of this site. Of those, maybe 1 in 100 might write one.

Looking at a page of stream reports from back in May of 2011, there were 25 reports on 13 streams that generated 93 replies. Average number of views were just 706. The most was 1543 on a report with 15 replies and the least was 246 of a report with no replies. That includes everybody, anonymous, registered, repeats or somebody that looks it up years later.

It appears only a small percent of registered users, people that are actually interested in fly fishing, even bother to read them. That leaves precious little views for all the knuckle dragging, freezer filling Neanderthals some seem so worried about. They're not wasting their time reading stream reports on a fly fishing site, that's for sure.

 

[brookiesofpa]

Reading some of the spot burning posts....Some of those here need to take a vacation.....

 

[NJAngler]

Naming names does more harm than good so why do it? That will always be my reason for not doing it. I too have read stream names in the 'stream location' section and been like 'you have to be kidding'. Those who ask(publicly) should know better and anyone who does ask is just being lazy. This isn't 1970 where you'd have to use a Mobile road map and drive 3 hours to a blue line hoping it holds trout. You have many sources of info at your finger tips and can find/plan a trip to ANY stream in a matter of a few minutes.

 

[JackM]

I see a ton of good associated with naming streams and very little bad. See how that works? Most importantly, we are exposing the states vast resources and sharing information that will give another angler inspiration or information that will expand his or her "repretoire" of streams to visit. I see those things as the strongest reason to support openness on this site.

I have various motivations for making stream reports. Sometimes I am sharing my joy. Sometimes I am trying to show others how they might appreciate our resources even more. Sometimes I WANT to highlight a stream; sometimes I want to highlight an "experience" and the stream is just "one example" of where another angler might have a similar experience.

All in all, it should be a personal decision of the poster. I think it is clear that is how PAFF has always viewed it and I see no movement whatsoever that this is going to change. We all have differing opinions, but we know this has been beat to death. The only true effect that comes of these heated spot-burning debates is that some registrants are dissuaded from posting as much as they would like (guilty!). And, of course, this is what the anti-kiss-and-tell proponents want. So, they win, I guess if that effect is achieved. Nor are they unaware of this.

 

[troutslammer]

Hey jack , thanks for those 2 stream reports you gave in the last yr and a half it was real helpful . I wouldn't have found the little J without ya . Keep up the good work !

 

[JackM]

So what? As the champion of non-spot-burners you are going to criticise me for not posting more? All you have to do is go to the Stream Reports section and touch the category heading marked "Poster." You may need to do this twice to get the threads to sort in alphabetical order by Poster. Then page down to find ALL of my reports.

Then come back here and tell me what you found. I already know the answer and it is revealing and a shame I don't share as much any more. Looking at the last year and a half, there would be two reasons:

1. As noted, I have been bullied into posting less by vigillantes like yourself; and
2. I have not fished much in the last couple years as I did before that.

(Did you find the one on Roaring Run? That was just before the one on the Little J. If you bother, consider the variation in the streams I posted about. And consider this as well-- these are some of my favorite streams.)

Any attempt to cast me as hypocritical fails because I never have tried to bully people into revealing information about a stream. I have just defended those persons who wish to share from the bullying from people like you who want to impose their "morality" on others.