Ice dam along the W. Branch of Pine!

[lycoflyfisher]

There are likely thermal impacts below the dam and it blocks fish movement throughout pine. Wild fish certainly utilize pine and move around where they can, not to mention other species like american eel, suckers, etc.

 

[BradFromPotter]

Just....wow.

As I understand it, the dam was supposed to be an attraction for the town. I've been through there and stopped at the brick building sandwich shop 20+ times in the last decade. I don't remember seeing anyone using the pond crated by the dam. Do they think dredging it will change that situation?

Also, I don't understand the point of the fish ladder. There are plenty of feeder streams to Pine so trout can spawn. Correct me if I'm mistaken.

The will not be removed. No the borough does not think dredging the lake will change anything. The dam does not create the ice dams. It's the 2 bridges above the lake. I was talking with a friend who has lived here his entire life & said that this happens about every 5-10 years. He is in his late 80's.

The fish ladder & dredging are required by the fish commission.

I agree that there are plenty of feeder streams to Pine so trout can spawn.

What does not seeing anyone using the pond crated by the dam have to do with it?

 

[BradFromPotter]

There are likely thermal impacts below the dam and it blocks fish movement throughout pine. Wild fish certainly utilize pine and move around where they can, not to mention other species like american eel, suckers, etc.

Have you actually taken any water temps in the summer? Normal years the water below the dam is not much warmer then coming into the dam. I have caught trout all along rt 6 during all months of the summer. They do just fine. Except for 2 years ago!

 

[BradFromPotter]

Ref. Post #11: Wouldn't it be less expensive an better overall to remove the dam? It really seems to contribute nothing.

yes less expensive but not better.

 

[lycoflyfisher]

The will not be removed. No the borough does not think dredging the lake will change anything. The dam does not create the ice dams. It's the 2 bridges above the lake. I was talking with a friend who has lived here his entire life & said that this happens about every 5-10 years. He is in his late 80's.

The fish ladder & dredging are required by the fish commission.

I agree that there are plenty of feeder streams to Pine so trout can spawn.

What does not seeing anyone using the pond crated by the dam have to do with it?

I can all but guarantee you that the fish commission is not requiring the dredging.

Fish ladders do not have a good track record of success and often require frequent maintenance to remove debris.

In regards to temperature, you would need to deploy dataloggers above the influence of the dam and below the dam that collect data on regular intervals and ideally analyze that data over several summers.

I am aware of monitoring efforts on other similar structures in different watersheds and there were often 1-3 degree increases.

 

[BradFromPotter]

I can all but guarantee you that the fish commission is not requiring the dredging.

Fish ladders do not have a good track record of success and often require frequent maintenance to remove debris.

In regards to temperature, you would need to deploy dataloggers above the influence of the dam and below the dam that collect data on regular intervals and ideally analyze that data over several summers.

I am aware of monitoring efforts on other similar structures in different watersheds and there were often 1-3 degree increases.

Yes the fish commission is requiring the lake be dredged. I've been to the meetings over the last few years.
1-3 degree increases is what I have found. I thought you were talking about larger increases.

 

[lycoflyfisher]

If you are involved locally I would encourage your local officials to contact the fish and boat commission if that is the reason they plan to dredge the "lake". I can all but assure you there is no requirement from the fish and boat commission to dredge the lake. There is no ecological benefit of that activity.

There would be eclogical benefit in removing the dam.

 

[BradFromPotter]

If you are involved locally I would encourage your local officials to contact the fish and boat commission if that is the reason they plan to dredge the "lake". I can all but assure you there is no requirement from the fish and boat commission to dredge the lake. There is no ecological benefit of that activity.

There would be eclogical benefit in removing the dam.

I was going through most of the minutes from the Borough council meetings & cannot find that it stated that the fish commission requires that it be dredged. I stand corrected.

But the dam is staying put. It will not be removed.

 

[Fly-Swatter]

BFP: I don't doubt that the dam won't be removed. Why not?

 

[BradFromPotter]

BFP: I don't doubt that the dam won't be removed. Why not?

visual impact
centerpiece of Galeton
it's not all about the trout

 

[lycoflyfisher]

Why can't a flowing stream be the centerpiece of Galeton?

The dam and small impoundment offer littler to no benefit to the community. There is no flood control benefit, there is no increase in recreational opportunities, there is no power generation, the dam is not part of the public drinking water supply.

 

[Fly-Swatter]

...and it ain't that pretty. Just sayin'.

 

[salvelinus]

I'm old enough to remember the creek before the dam. It was much nicer then.

 

[Tups]

Not much information about the dam on line. Only this. Pafbc recommended removal. Borough residents fought to keep it. “The State” issued a $900,000. Grant to dredge it. Didn’t say which state agency issued the grant. Dredging planned summer 2022.

 

[JeffK]

People get attached to their dams. Over here in NJ one argument for dam removal is that park land can be created in some areas where land is scarce since towns developed around the mills . Since the exposed pond floor will be in the flood plain that keeps people from building (generally). Also, in one dam removal the locals thought the noise from the rapids was louder and nicer after the dam was removed. But many people do miss the ponds.

 

[pcray1231]

People think that open grassland with a lake is pretty. I get it. Go out for a walk, take the kids to a playground overlooking the lake....

There's no question that trees and flowing water are better from an environmental standpoint, and not just for the trout. And outdoorsmen tend to view that as beautiful. But the general public sees it differently.

I for one find a dense forest and babbline streams prettier than a wide open, gardened manicured estate with a lake on it. But that's me!

 

[BradFromPotter]

Why can't a flowing stream be the centerpiece of Galeton?

The dam and small impoundment offer littler to no benefit to the community. There is no flood control benefit, there is no increase in recreational opportunities, there is no power generation, the dam is not part of the public drinking water supply.

I'm old enough to remember the creek before the dam. It was much nicer then.

swampy , willow lined stream nicer then now?

 

[pcray1231]

I can't speak for what it looked like before the lake.

I don't know how swampy it'd be, some areas on the south branch are. And if it is, nobody is saying not to add some rock and landscaping to keep the area dry and "park like" in town, with paved walking trails and the like. But for me, yes, willows and flowing water through a park is prettier than a lake with mowed grass around.

 

[Tups]

I agree with your sentiments pcray, but the Borough residents have decided they will keep the lake and the state has decided that the people of PA shall pay for it. You live by the sword, you die by the sword. We like it when the state pays to fix up the Yellow Breeches, but not when they fix up the lake at Galeton.
.

 

[troutbert]

Why can't a flowing stream be the centerpiece of Galeton?

Agreed. In many places a flowing stream is the centerpiece.

The Parkway in Allentown with the Little Lehigh Creek flowing through it for example. It's a beautiful place and very popular with local people and visitors.

What people really love are trails along streams.

Just going for a walk outdoors is a good thing. Walking along a lake adds a little flavor.

But walking along a STREAM, now that is awesome. The flowing water really elevates the experience. It's not just fishermen who enjoy that. Nearly everyone loves that.

An example near me is the trail along Spring Creek in "Spring Creek Canyon." It's very popular. There are people walking there probably 365 days a year, even in bad weather. Some of them are fishermen, but the great majority are other folks.