Trout beads

[geebee]

pcray1231 wrote:

define a fly....

A hook decorated to look like a food item.

so what is this ?

i'm not busting your balls pc, i'm just making a point about what we cast with our fly rods is difficult to define....

and as to the hook being 2" from the bead, how is this different ? :

i see very little difference. not enough to make a tangible reason to treat them differently.

 

[AkDan76]

I disagree with theyre just as likely to snag as they are to be inside the gums. Thats after many 30 fish days up here. If done right its actually rare. Is it speculation driving this prejudice? Or first hand multiple years of use? I know where i stand on that line. I will say it again it can easily be done wrong! If youre snagging fish youre setup isnt right!


What i see here is two seperate debates intertwined as one. The first being a moral issue of what constitutes a fly. The second is this snagging mentality.

Imho what flyfishing means to you shouldnt be judged to the masses. Push it hard enough youll only be allowed cane rods with silk lines and gut leaders, open eye hooks fishing in tweed an knickers in ffo waters. If you think im against that come over sometime. I have horsehair waiting to be furled into a flyline and a pile of boo that needs shaved!

We can use rubber legs as part of a fly but imagine the smart guy who took a plastic worm and tied it to a hook, by definition its a fly and would hold up in court as such. But i wouldnt be shocked if he got flogged by peers for doing it or was given a citation by a warden.

Like i showed with the dolly lama (there are many other flies like it these days) youre just as likely to be in the mouth vs out. Yet it looks like a fly. Principal remains the hook is far enough awayif outside in is your battle they shouldnt be allowed either!

Articulated flies imho are no better than a bead other than visual differences.

Theres some great points brought up in the recent posts. Yet the best imho is the slippery slope judgement call. Its rampent in the bowhunting world and has been longer than ive heen in it (25yrs).

Fishing stocked waters over stocked or holdovers and call it purist fishing kind of baffles me. I enjoy catching both by all means! I have a hard time buying a bead tied to the hook is any different than a bead pegged 1" up. thats after an awful lot of fish put to hand! People have some predjudice against a plastic bead, yet throw bobbers. It wouldnt hurt my feelings one to see a guy with a red/white bobber over flies.

Hopefully after Andrew or Jon get up here we can have a good write up in the topic of beads with numbers and hook locations. And plenty of fish pics!

 

[nathanazajac]

This is silly trout beads work great I have never used them on a fly rod only a center pin and always have a small egg sack or nymph as my hook works great for trout and steelhead. Use the 6mm bead for stocked trout and have fun I don't know how it would be illegal if you are using a fly for your hook and the bead as an attractor. Look at walleye rigs beads blades and other assorted attractors and a bare hook with a worm or minnow. What happens when you Bring the fish on board and the worm is gone did you snag that fish?

 

[AkDan76]

Exactly geebee!

 

[afishinado]

The_Sasquatch wrote:
Sal it counts as fly fishing as long as you do it on a fly rod!

Here's my fly pattern, I call it the Squatch....anybody need a recipe? :-o

 

[salvelinusfontinalis]

That looks like my Bowman's insane C4 KaBoom fly.
You can't replace C4 with lead and then claim it's your own. ;-)

 

[The_Sasquatch]

Thanks Afish...hahaha!

This is nuts. You guys are now trying to pass off chucking a BARE HOOK with a bobber as fly fishing. I mean, that would probably work for brook trout, but really?

I'm not saying its not a legitimate form of fishing. I'm sure it is. But it ain't fly fishin', and I'm HARDLY a purest (heck, I use beadhead nymphs! To Shakey, I might as well be spin fishing!). It's not fly fishing anymore than people who use night crawlers on fly rods are fly fishing...they're not. They're bait fishing. That's okay, but its not fly fishing. Geebee, I get what you're saying, but its still a fly. A bare hook w/ a bead 2 or 3" above it is NOT a fly. You know its not a fly haha!

But hey, if it IS a fly, I think I finally found a pattern I could tie!

 

[PatrickC]

Hey, did anyone notice there are 50 degree days in the forecast? Cause you boys really need to get out int:

 

[The_Sasquatch]

I got my beads ready, dude!

That is exactly what is happening, by the way. I'm sitting here, snowed in again. I finally have a job that I love and ice and snow keep me from going in! Where was this weather when I worked at a job I hated!?

 

[pcray1231]

Push it hard enough youll only be allowed cane rods with silk lines and gut leaders, open eye hooks fishing in tweed an knickers in ffo waters.

Gierach said it best.

Purity (in fly fishing) by nostalgia is an interesting idea, but the logic of it is inescapable. If we carry purism to its logical conclusion, to do it right you’d have to live naked in a cave, hit your trout on the head with rocks, and eat them raw. But, so as no to violate another essential element of the fly fishing tradition, the rocks would have to be quarried in England and cost $300 each

And by the way, a little paint could turn the "Squatch" pattern into an honest to goodness "fly", lol. Egg pattern! But yeah, I have a problem with that one, because I don't believe the intent is to have a fish try to eat it.

Geebee's examples are not flies. But I don't have a problem with any of them, as they do look intended to have a fish eat them.

Although the first one, a "tube fly", is PART of a fly. Once that tube slides over the shank of a hook it's an honest to goodness fly, but not until then. The others, well, they are awfully similar to the Moffitt system. I won't knock em, I have no issues with them. But I won't call them flies either.

 

[AkDan76]

Afish,
U mean this squatch fly trip
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pnfb_4A2ASw

Vs this

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4VFm42V9LWM


I think anyone in their right mind can see the difference

Educate yourselves before you fight a battle on perception alone. You may find the vision is far from the assumed!


Pc exactly!

Yet i beg to differ on tubes. Many in fact do not slide over the shank instead resting on the eye or out in front of it. Again two very different principles at play. Snagging vs what is considered a fly.

Have fun with it! Its not by any means an easy game! (Defining ethics).

 

[geebee]

. Geebee, I get what you're saying, but its still a fly. A bare hook w/ a bead 2 or 3" above it is NOT a fly. You know its not a fly haha!

But hey, if it IS a fly, I think I finally found a pattern I could tie!

:lol:

i know its not a fly but the method of use is very very close.

your last comment is actually a major reason for their use - cost and ease of use as you don't have to wrap and trim glo fiber.

as i said IMHO they are fine for steel n salmon. for trout, they are probably slight overkill as you should be able to catch em on glow bugs or nymphs/streamers and if not, a skunking can be educational.

when you've paid for a flight, car, hotel and guide AND frozen your arse off, they must be mighty tempting - same as nymphing vs swinging.

Cheers

Mark

 

[geebee]

double post.


Q: What did the fish say when it swam into a wall ?







A: Dam.(damn)

 

[brookieaddict]

Nice tubers, i chuk them on the tribs where it has been said they are too small for spey rods.( lol). If you fish their tie a orange belly dark green over yellow and you will hook up on some hogs. I call it my gilltube

 

[captbugger]

So after much long conversation with pfbc they informed me that just fishing with a bead and keeping the fish afterwards is illegal but using the bead in front of a fly as a attracter is fare game and they said it's just like a walleye rig i know someone said this earlier. Have fun guys hope to hook up with some of you guys when this snow melts