Trout Beads - Legal in PA??

[Chaz]

Someone had to speak up about it being snagging, and you don't have to use a treble hook to be snagging. I'm not sure if snagging is illegal, but they are after all stocked fish and they will make more. But don't call it fly fishing it's not.
grump, grump, grump!!!

 

[Chaz]

No it's not. We're talking two different methods. Otherwise all fishing would be snagging. That's what you are saying.

 

[FarmerDave]

wbranch wrote:
Farmerdave wrote;

If you plan to release them anyway, why resort to this?

Because the bead is like candy to a kid!! Steelhead and rainbows, and I guess browns to some extent, are hardwired to not be able to resist anything that really resembles a trout or salmon egg. If there are ten steelhead in a pocket pool and there is a guy who we would all consider an expert and he fished for an hour and caught two steelhead I could follow him with the bead and within that same period of time hook every steelhead in that pool. It may some like hyperbole to some of the readers but I have done it over and over.

No offense, but this does not compute for me personally. Just sayin. I could us the same argument for legalizing treble hooks. Way more effective if all you are after are numbers.

I do understand the argument, bot bottom line is that it is simply a rig designed to make flossing (snagging) much easier. Better than snagging them in the body, but still snagging.

I really don't care how many I catch and I don't fly fish because it is the easiest of most effective method. Sometimes it is but many times it isn't. I fly fish because it my preferred method and is often more challenging.

So now I want to use fish candy so I can catch more? Doesn't compute. Might as well use live minnows instead of streamers.

If catching more in those conditions was that important to me, I'd use a noodle rod and a single egg of a live minnow ON a hook. No, I'll stick with flossing them without the pegged egg.;-)

 

[ryansheehan]

I feel the need to see Hank Patterson's view on trout beads.....

 

[PennKev]

FarmerDave wrote:


I do understand the argument, bot bottom line is that it is simply a rig designed to make flossing (snagging) much easier. Better than snagging them in the body, but still snagging.

Except that the bead rigs produce hooks ups that are no different than what you get from fishing regular, true fles. And in fact, seem to produce fewer hookings in the body. The fish are virtually all hooked inside the mouth or in part of the jaw bone.

The fact of the matter is that the bead rigs hook fish in the mouth as a result of the fish eating the bead.

You cast bead, fish eats bead, you hook fish in the mouth or jaw.

How is that snagging? How is that different than fishing any other way? How is that less legitimate than fishing with a piece of yarn or estaz wrapped on a hook? How is it different than fishing a rapala plug or intruder style of fly, both with their hooks hanging off the body of the lure?

 

[ryc72]

Who knew people were this passionate about this topic. Go figure. I can’t get my head around why some folks find this so offensive. I know if I were to go on a trip to Alaska and my guide said we are gonna fish pegged beads with an indicator I cant imagine myself saying “no thanks. I want to fly fish...I didn’t come to Alaska to snag or floss fish...” and then proceed to put on a glo bug that looks similar to the bead I turned down. I can only wonder what the guide’s reaction would be.

 

[wbranch]

Farmerdave wrote;

I do understand the argument, bot bottom line is that it is simply a rig designed to make flossing (snagging) much easier. Better than snagging them in the body, but still snagging.

I can see from all our back & forth posts that you have your opinion of pegged beads and I have mine. That is never going to change. It is interesting to note that NY does not consider pegged beads illegal or an easier method to snag trout and salmon and neither does Ohio.

I have never, ever, hooked a steelhead anywhere other than inside the mouth or outside of the jaw and I have caught a lot of steelhead. But I have foul hooked, by accident, steelhead on my bottom fly if I happen to be a little slow on the hook set. If pegged beads are considered illegal in PA then the practice of allowing two flies on one leader should definitely be banned as you foul hook far more steelhead with a trailing fly than you ever will with a pegged bead.

I just can't see (just as I can't see your hypothesis) how you think beads make it easier to floss, or snag trout. BTW what is your definition of snagging? I thought the definition of snagging/snatching in NY and PA was the deliberate sudden lifting of the rod as your hook drifts through likely looking holding water in an attempt to impale the quarry with a hook.

I fish pegged beads no differently than I would fish a nymph or streamer under an indicator. I either roll cast it on an angle upstream or directly across from me and follow the path of the indicator as the lure (flies, beads, bait) floats naturally downstream.

If the indicator pauses, or dips, on it's downstream travel I lift the rod tip to set the hook just as any nymph guy would do if he/she was nymphing with an indicator. By virtue of your understanding of fishing beads all "legitimate" fly fishers are also flossing and snagging since they are fishing no different than I am. As a matter of fact in Ohio and PA two hooks (lures, flies) are permitted on one leader. I often fish a nymph as my top lure and a pegged bead on the bottom.

It's all good if it is legal. I will no longer fish beads in PA but will continue to use them wherever they are legal whether or not some think it may be a less than a noble approach to fly fishing. That is my last word on beads. Hope everyone has a great Thanksgiving and Christmas.

 

[FarmerDave]

PennKev wrote:

FarmerDave wrote:


I do understand the argument, bot bottom line is that it is simply a rig designed to make flossing (snagging) much easier. Better than snagging them in the body, but still snagging.

Except that the bead rigs produce hooks ups that are no different than what you get from fishing regular, true fles. And in fact, seem to produce fewer hookings in the body. The fish are virtually all hooked inside the mouth or in part of the jaw bone.

The fact of the matter is that the bead rigs hook fish in the mouth as a result of the fish eating the bead.

You cast bead, fish eats bead, you hook fish in the mouth or jaw.

How is that snagging? How is that different than fishing any other way? How is that less legitimate than fishing with a piece of yarn or estaz wrapped on a hook? How is it different than fishing a rapala plug or intruder style of fly, both with their hooks hanging off the body of the lure?

You and WB should ask the fish commission.

 

[FarmerDave]

wbranch wrote:
I will no longer fish beads in PA but will continue to use them wherever they are legal whether or not some think it may be a less than a noble approach to fly fishing. That is my last word on beads. Hope everyone has a great Thanksgiving and Christmas.

Hey, you asked if it was legal, apparently it isn't. Then you asked why, and apparently didn't like the answer.

As I said, I don't care one way or another, but as long as it isn't legal, I'll stick with a blood dot and a nymph trailer. ;-)

Don't shoot the messenger. ;-)

 

[PennKev]

FarmerDave wrote:

PennKev wrote:

FarmerDave wrote:


I do understand the argument, bot bottom line is that it is simply a rig designed to make flossing (snagging) much easier. Better than snagging them in the body, but still snagging.

Except that the bead rigs produce hooks ups that are no different than what you get from fishing regular, true fles. And in fact, seem to produce fewer hookings in the body. The fish are virtually all hooked inside the mouth or in part of the jaw bone.

The fact of the matter is that the bead rigs hook fish in the mouth as a result of the fish eating the bead.

You cast bead, fish eats bead, you hook fish in the mouth or jaw.

How is that snagging? How is that different than fishing any other way? How is that less legitimate than fishing with a piece of yarn or estaz wrapped on a hook? How is it different than fishing a rapala plug or intruder style of fly, both with their hooks hanging off the body of the lure?

You and WB should ask the fish commission.

Yeah well it's not like we have a fish commission employee or two who posts on this site to clear it up for us...... oh... wait.

 

[TroutTracker]

Better not use that blood dot and a nymph trailer in NY state tribs where it is illegal because it makes snagging fish easier ;-)

 

[trike23]

If a fish eating a bead is foul hooking a fish than everyone just needs to srop fishing. This topic is insane. I guess if a bass eats a crankbait it is snagged? After all there is trebles on them der lures. Really come on now.. guess if a steelhead eats a spawn bag its foul also cause that is bait and not a glo bug? Sometimes ethtics go a little to far. Who hear has never foul hooked a fish even with a glo bug? Really?

 

[bigslackwater]

If anyone is interested, I made a quick and easy midge pupae fly as a legal alternative to the bare hook. The idea here is cheap, quick and easy. Functions like a bare hook but technically and legally, it’s a fly! Here it is shown with a pegged bead. The hook is a size 8 eagle claw octopus. 68 hooks at Walmart for a few bucks. I may have to reconsider the hook since a buddy of mine suggested that the up bend is not going to do well with a clinch knot. It’s more suited for a snell knot to get the right angle. I’ll be trying on my flame retardant suite as I await your comments!!!!

 

[moon1284]

Looks good but the bead is a little close to the hook. I bet if you position your split shot correctly you wont even need the bead and will catch fish on the zebra midge. Nice touch with blue thread.

 

[wbranch]

Chaz wrote;

But don't call it fly fishing it's not.

Okay, I won't call it "fly fishing" but how do guys consider the "Squirmie Wormie" fly fishing?

BTW, I was up in Erie for 4 days, the first two were blown out. But Tuesday and Wednesday were very good. I hooked 18 and landed 11. Some got unhooked near being tailed. Many on #12 Flashback Black Stoneflies, a couple on swung Emerald shiners patterns, a few on Estaz, and some on the Bead. Took a bunch of pictures but it is a pain to try and get them no bigger than 300K.

 

[PennKev]

moon1284 wrote:
Looks good but the bead is a little close to the hook. I bet if you position your split shot correctly you wont even need the bead and will catch fish on the zebra midge. Nice touch with blue thread.

I see what you did there...

 

[Tigereye]

late to the party here, so why would this be legal?

 

[wbranch]

late to the party here, so why would this be legal?

Because it is an entirely different concept than a pegged egg. You need to read some of the earlier posts to get the flavor of the discussion. The essence of the argument is the bead is pegged in a relatively fixed position until a steelhead eats the bead. Then while the steelhead is holding the bead in it's mouth the angler lifts the rod to strike and the bead slides down the tippet and the hook impales into the inside, or sometimes, outside of the mouth.

 

[wbranch]

A few pictures from my last trip.

 

[Chaz]

It's not a fly wound on the hook, it's not legal in FFO waterl, like the trout bead, not legal in FFO waters.