Trout Beads - Legal in PA??

[Brown71]

Wbranch, your post about rainbows/eggs is one of the truest posts I’ve read on here. Great post!

Eggs are absolutely deadly for rainbows/steelhead anywhere most anytime.

I know most of you on this board fish fly only, but it’s worth noting the effectiveness of eggs as obviously they can be imitated.

 

[Chaz]

If there is no fly or lure or bait it’s snagging. The question should be is snagging legal in Pa.

 

[FarmerDave]

Chaz, It's about time you showed up. I was getting tired of being the cranky old fart. ;-)

Tag, your it.

 

[wbranch]

Chaz wrote;

If there is no fly or lure or bait it’s snagging

Is this legal?

 

[gulfgreyhound]

Brows like eggs as well. In Ontario triibs yellow eggs are my go to ,but other colors work it's just finding out what they will hit. GG

 

[PennypackFlyer]

It's all snagging if you think about it when you fly fish. Just some locations are appropriate.

 

[PennKev]

PennypackFlyer wrote:
It's all snagging if you think about it when you fly fish. Just some locations are appropriate.

Yeah, no.

 

[wbranch]

Farmer Dave wrote;

Lets face it. Steelhead fishing isn't real trout fishing.

I'd agree with that especially when the venue is any of the PA streams. Most of Elk is either too small, or too crowded, to swing a fly in the traditional sense and have a steelhead come up and boil on it. That is really exciting fishing and not that different than swinging flies for Atlantic salmon.

The Salmon River and the Cattaraugus are large big water rivers where you can really fly fish and overhead, or spey cast, and enjoy the real essence of fly fishing for big fish.

 

[FarmerDave]

wbranch wrote:
Farmer Dave wrote;

Lets face it. Steelhead fishing isn't real trout fishing.

I'd agree with that especially when the venue is any of the PA streams. Most of Elk is either too small, or too crowded, to swing a fly in the traditional sense and have a steelhead come up and boil on it. That is really exciting fishing and not that different than swinging flies for Atlantic salmon.

The Salmon River and the Cattaraugus are large big water rivers where you can really fly fish and overhead, or spey cast, and enjoy the real essence of fly fishing for big fish.

I went one step further and said trout fishing, and didn't limit that to just fly.

Darn things don't act like real trout.

Then again, neither do stocked trout.;-)

But chuck and duck is not really fly fishing either. IMO of course. ;-)

 

[Acristickid]

Is fly fishing with tube flies fly fishing?

Wild coho with purple tube

Easy flies to use. Hook gets beat up too bad , just put another hook on. Didn’t lose any fish once hooked.

 

[Swattie87]

I've thought about putting a small twister tail grub on an unweighted hook and fishing it with a fly rod for WW species. Is that fly fishing? Way cheaper and easier to replace than Woolly Buggers. Can get 50 of those things for $5.

My anecdotal experience is that twister tail grubs on spin gear outfish the same size and color Bugger on fly gear, all else being equal. Best of both worlds?

I'm gonna try it. This is getting rather philosophical.

 

[FarmerDave]

Akid and Swattie,

Unless you are fishing in FFO water, does it really matter?

Sorry, I aint that special. ;-)

 

[FarmerDave]

wbranch wrote:

Is this legal?

Did you peg a bead to the line above it?

 

[bigslackwater]

To clarify my use of the word "most" was because I don't really recall enough from two years ago if every fish was hooked inside the lip or just outside. I'm quite sure that most were hooked inside the mouth and possibly a few were just outside the lip with the point on the inside of the mouth. I'm 100% sure that none were foul hooked on the body, caught by a fin etc... My point is that my experience with beads was no worse or "snaggy" than fishing traditional flies in regards to how the fish was hooked. I'd also agree with your statement that a tandem rig has more potential to snag than a bead rig.

FarmerDave wrote:

bigslackwater wrote:
I fished beads on my one trip to Alaska. I Never snagged a single fish and most were hooked inside the mouth. Beads are very effective in Alaska because of the salmon runs. Steelies get keyed in to certain colors and sizes. Here in PA, I feel like eggs are not a prominent source of food and fishing a bead would essentially be fishing an attractor. If they are keying in on eggs in Erie Tribs, it would be nice to discuss size and color, (if thats even allowed since we've now discovered this is illegal!)

Wait. How is that not contradictory?

Most were caught inside the mouth. How were the rest caught?

Snagging kind of implies intent, so maybe a better description is foul hooked.

In Alaska, a fish hooked near the mouth might not be considered foul hooked, but in PA it is. Whether it should be considered legal caught is debatable. Currently it is not. The law simply forbids a rig that increased the likelyhood of foul hooking.

I count them anyway, but I almost always throw them all back.

Whether or not eggs are a prominent source of food in the Erie tribs is debatable, but they certainly are a part of it. Single egg patterns have worked well for me especially in late winter and early Spring. And who hasn't seen jacks feeding below redds? And I'd bet Brown trout do that same although I haven't caught any yet. I don't get out as much since moving to the farm. But I agree the bead is an attractant.

In the fall and early winter, I start with bead head Woolly buggers or zonkers. Later I went with single eggs, sucker spawn, and nymphs.

Tandem rig with Single egg followed by a nymph works well later in the season. I think one can get similar results with that as one would with a bead pegged above a nymph, but if the Steelhead actually hits the egg imitation, it is often hooked by it. Otherwise they get hooked in the face by the trailing nymph.;-)

Did I mention I don't like using tandem rigs? But sometimes we have to do what we have to do.;-)

Lets face it. Steelhead fishing isn't real trout fishing.

What size single eggs? I find smaller is better. Probably size 12 or 14 hook.

 

[Swattie87]

FarmerDave wrote:
Akid and Swattie,

Unless you are fishing in FFO water, does it really matter?

Legally, no. I just get all sensitive when I'm called a spincaster.

 

[FarmerDave]

bigslackwater wrote:
To clarify my use of the word "most" was because I don't really recall enough from two years ago if every fish was hooked inside the lip or just outside. I'm quite sure that most were hooked inside the mouth and possibly a few were just outside the lip with the point on the inside of the mouth. I'm 100% sure that none were foul hooked on the body, caught by a fin etc... My point is that my experience with beads was no worse or "snaggy" than fishing traditional flies in regards to how the fish was hooked. I'd also agree with your statement that a tandem rig has more potential to snag than a bead rig.

For the record, I don't really care. See DaveS' reality check. I freely admit that many of the steelhead I have caught on a fly rod were actually flossed, but I do not keep track and cannot provide a number or percentage.

All by accident of course. ;-)

Many of the steelhead caught on flies are flossed.
I caught one on a jointed rebel one day and that one I am 100% sure was fair hooked. Hey, I happened to be going past the Grand and all I had in the truck was my bass stuff.

All I am saying is that I do understand the reason why PA doesn't allow pegged beads.

Being a cheap bastage ... If it was legal I'd probably give it a try. Since it is not, I won't.

That is my official response and I am standing by it.;-)

 

[wbranch]

Farmer Dave wrote;

But chuck and duck is not really fly fishing either. IMO of course.

Maybe guys on the Salmon River chuck and duck because they are often using #5 & #7 shot in multiples and a level line. I typically either roll cast just as we would when fishing a riffle or stream for trout and cast conventionally (overhead) when I am throwing nymphs or small streamers without BB's.

 

[wbranch]

Farmerdave wrote;

Did you peg a bead to the line above it?

No, I just let it slide freely on the leaser.

 

[kbkpitt]

Reality check...fished a stocked trout stream the other day. Threw everything in my box. Then I used a trout bead and...you know the rest of the story. At one point, I felt guilty. Do I like them...no. Are they illegal in PA, no, but caught in the act...then yes. I love it when people say they've talked to fish wardens and get the real "answer". Yeah right, if you read these comments, everyone has their own interpretation. Here's mine. Having it won't get you cited, everyone sells them, but the act of catching a fish will. The issue is the bare hook. Wrap something on it so the "illegal" matter is taken care of. But you better set that hook quickly or you get the other no no. Foul hooking the fish. Cheers and tight lines y'all

 

[wbranch]

Farmerdave wrote;

If you plan to release them anyway, why resort to this?

Because the bead is like candy to a kid!! Steelhead and rainbows, and I guess browns to some extent, are hardwired to not be able to resist anything that really resembles a trout or salmon egg. If there are ten steelhead in a pocket pool and there is a guy who we would all consider an expert and he fished for an hour and caught two steelhead I could follow him with the bead and within that same period of time hook every steelhead in that pool. It may some like hyperbole to some of the readers but I have done it over and over.

I drive 280 miles to get to the water. I spend at least $120 - $160 for a motel room (2-3 nights) I spend another $75 on gas and then another $50 on meals. So I'm spending at least $245. So I want to catch as many fish as I can, on a fly rod, regardless of the type of instrument that is luring the fish. Be it fly, bead, artificial egg, etc.

I was steelhead fishing Tuesday and part of Wednesday. On Wednesday morning there were two skilled younger guys next to me using noodle rods, floats, and spawn sacks. I hooked five chromers and landed four. Between the two of them they hooked three and landed one. Typically sacks are deadly but the water was getting lower and they were using heavier leader (8#) and I was using 5# fluorocarbon.