Tournament etiquette

I've avoided this thread till now.

Competitions. Not my cup o tea. No interest in being involved in a formal one.

But I am competitive (in a friendly sort of way). I'm a fish counter, and proud of it. And I do compare myself to others.

But to be clear, I'm not about "shaming". If I outfish someone handily, I don't think poorly of them, I want to help them. If I am handily outfished, I feel no "shame" about it (rather, I'm interested in how they did better, so that I can learn).

Everyone is at there own level and that's ok, it's nothing to get proud or embarrassed over. The better were bad at one point, and the worse will get better.

I'm about getting better. I want everyone to get better. It's about learning. To do that, you need a measurement for where you're at, and where others are, so you know how much room there is for "better", and can identify when things went well for you and when they didn't. You aren't competing "against" others, you are competing against your own expectations.

My main reason for not being interested in the competitions is that they measure the wrong things, IMO. They are given a certain stretch to fish at a certain time. To me, that removes 80% of the skill right there. In real life, you can fish where you want, when you want.

And those decisions on when and where are 80% of being a good fisherman. Putting yourself in situations where you can succeed is the #1 skill to have. And it is a skill.

Now, the other 20% is real. Put 2 guys in the exact same situation and one will outfish the other on a regular basis. But who cares? It ain't about proving superiority. Both will work on that part of their skills and get better with time. I'm interested in how BOTH anglers can do better than they did!
 
lestrout wrote:
Re Pen's "Someone who lives out in the country may feel that you are invading their space if you are within sight or ear shot of each other."

Then there's the boonies: I was driving through Colorado one day, far, far from Denver, spotted a lovely stream, then saw a flyfisher. I pulled over, and the area was so remote that I could have left the rental square in the middle of the road for a few hours. I tried to strike up a conversation with my fellow ffisher. He was an old-timer and more than typically taciturn.

I greeted him by saying I was a flyfisher too; that got no repsonse. I expressed how I wanted to ffish the stream, but didn't want to crowd him. I explained out East what a polite separation was, depending on the water (1 cast away on the Beaverkill; arm's length in SE PA stocked waters; elbow length in NJ). Still no response.

So I got to the point and asked how far from him I could ffish without crowding him. Here were his only words: "Well, I reckon if'n I can get a good bead on you with a 30-06, you might be a little too close."

But he was smiling (I think).
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Les,

Based on the description of you conversation, the poor old guy may have just thought you were pcray and just wanted a little peace and quiet. :p

As far as what PPF said. I was born and raised in the country, and the only time I have EVER felt encroached on while fly fishing was while steelhead fishing, which really isn't fly fishing, so ... never.

 
Following up on the above, I am interested in following the results of comps.

But I go in with the assumption that they are ALL fairly good anglers, perfectly capable of capitalizing on a good situation should they encounter it. So I don't care about how they did as individuals or teams.

Cause I am what I am. I don't give a crap whether I'm better or worse than them in the same water at the same time. If I'm better, fine, so what? If I'm worse, fine, so what? It's not actionable information.

But I care about beats and times. I have an advantage they didn't. I can fish ANY of those areas, anytime I want.

So I wanna see when certain beats fished well, and when they fished poorly. I wanna compare, at 3 p.m., what was the best place to be? Why? And I wanna be able to use that to put myself on waters that are more likely to produce.

Competitors in these things chalk that all up to "luck of the draw". It's the stuff they can't control. Like in poker, whether you're dealt a good hand or not, you gotta play what you got.

But I can control it. My intent is to stack the deck in my favor and put myself in a good situation to succeed.
 
Les, next time, just start fishing what you feel is a reasonable distance and if he complains, offer him a towel.
 
lestrout wrote:
Re Pen's "Someone who lives out in the country may feel that you are invading their space if you are within sight or ear shot of each other."

Then there's the boonies: I was driving through Colorado one day, far, far from Denver, spotted a lovely stream, then saw a flyfisher. I pulled over, and the area was so remote that I could have left the rental square in the middle of the road for a few hours. I tried to strike up a conversation with my fellow ffisher. He was an old-timer and more than typically taciturn.

I greeted him by saying I was a flyfisher too; that got no repsonse. I expressed how I wanted to ffish the stream, but didn't want to crowd him. I explained out East what a polite separation was, depending on the water (1 cast away on the Beaverkill; arm's length in SE PA stocked waters; elbow length in NJ). Still no response.

So I got to the point and asked how far from him I could ffish without crowding him. Here were his only words: "Well, I reckon if'n I can get a good bead on you with a 30-06, you might be a little too close."

But he was smiling (I think).
Click to expand...

Man, I grew up fishing in NJ & PA and I'm sorry to tell you but your definition of "polite seperation" is anything but polite in my book. About the only "exception" being opening day on the more popular stocked streams. Any other time, and I think most anglers I know will agree, any of those descriptions is pretty much WAY TOO CLOSE and I think many an angler, at least that I know, would probably say it's rude (and I'm positive that would not be your intent.) I'd suggest you rethink your definition of it. Seriously.
 
RyanR wrote:
lestrout wrote:
Re Pen's "Someone who lives out in the country may feel that you are invading their space if you are within sight or ear shot of each other."

Then there's the boonies: I was driving through Colorado one day, far, far from Denver, spotted a lovely stream, then saw a flyfisher. I pulled over, and the area was so remote that I could have left the rental square in the middle of the road for a few hours. I tried to strike up a conversation with my fellow ffisher. He was an old-timer and more than typically taciturn.

I greeted him by saying I was a flyfisher too; that got no repsonse. I expressed how I wanted to ffish the stream, but didn't want to crowd him. I explained out East what a polite separation was, depending on the water (1 cast away on the Beaverkill; arm's length in SE PA stocked waters; elbow length in NJ). Still no response.

So I got to the point and asked how far from him I could ffish without crowding him. Here were his only words: "Well, I reckon if'n I can get a good bead on you with a 30-06, you might be a little too close."

But he was smiling (I think).
Click to expand...

Man, I grew up fishing in NJ & PA and I'm sorry to tell you but your definition of "polite seperation" is anything but polite in my book. About the only "exception" being opening day on the more popular stocked streams. Any other time, and I think most anglers I know will agree, any of those descriptions is pretty much WAY TOO CLOSE and I think many an angler, at least that I know, would even say it's rude. I'd suggest you rethink your definition of it. Seriously.
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I agree, I cant speak on the elbow length in NJ, but even on stocked PA waters exepct for possibly erie during the runs arm length is way to damn close. WAY to close.
And on a spacious river/stream one cast length is WAY to close. General rule of thumb for me is 3 cast lengths minimum unless other arraignments are made.
 
BTW, the 30.06 comment made me laugh and reminded me of my favorite sign at the end of somebody's driveway up north in the Adirondacks. We pass it every time we head over to fish the Saranac River. It has a picture of revolver and reads, "We shoot every third visitor, the second one just left!"
 
I agree too, but I assumed les was joking about those distances. ;-)
 
FarmerDave wrote:
I agree too, but I assumed les was joking about those distances. ;-)
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Sorry I missed the sarcasm, need to turn on the brain today
 
RyanR wrote:
BTW, the 30.06 comment made me laugh and reminded me of my favorite sign at the end of somebody's driveway up north in the Adirondacks. We pass it every time we head over to fish the Saranac River. It has a picture of revolver and reads, "We shoot every third visitor, the second one just left!"
Click to expand...

The question and answer reminded me of an encounter my little brother had.

He lives on a private road on a trout stream. People are allowed to fish there. There is parking at the end of the road and you are allowed to walk in to fish.

Anyway, little brother has a couple parking spaces across from his house. It's for guests, but mostly it is for backing out of his garage. His driveway is very short and his pickup is not. Anyway, that is the setting.

One day, some guy with Connecticut plates pulls in the parking space and gets out and starts suiting up to fish. Brother politely asked him not to park there because it interferes with his ability to back out in the event he needs to leave.

So the guy lets out a little huff and gets back in the car. He backs out and then parks in my brother's side yard.

Brother asked him to not park there's either. He had just seeded it.

So the guy gets all disgusted with my brother and asked... "OK, where am I supposed to park."

Brother's response was "Try Connecticut" and walks away.

I know I told that one before, but I love that story.
 
Salvelinusfontinali wrote:
FarmerDave wrote:
I agree too, but I assumed les was joking about those distances. ;-)
Click to expand...


Sorry I missed the sarcasm, need to turn on the brain today
Click to expand...

No need to apologize. I really wasn't being critical of either of you. It might not have been sarcasm. I just assumed it was. Those distances are crazy close.
 
Salvelinusfontinali wrote:

And on a spacious river/stream one cast length is WAY to close. General rule of thumb for me is 3 cast lengths minimum unless other arraignments are made.
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OK, would that be my cast length, or Old Lefty's. Big difference there. He put on a demonstration at the jam, and I was impressed. Not only that, I think he flossed my wheel with it.

Then he turned around and did it with Shakey's old bamboo rod.

 
FarmerDave wrote:
Salvelinusfontinali wrote:

And on a spacious river/stream one cast length is WAY to close. General rule of thumb for me is 3 cast lengths minimum unless other arraignments are made.
Click to expand...

OK, would that be my cast length, or Old Lefty's. Big difference there. He put on a demonstration at the jam, and I was impressed. Not only that, I think he flossed my wheel with it.

Then he turned around and did it with Shakey's old bamboo rod.
Click to expand...

Just depends on the stream, and an average cast length for whatever particular stream your on.

I admire those guys that can cast distance with accuracy, I've never been in the position to cast far though, any time I've ever been In a situation that a long cast is the only way to get to the fish its worthless anyways due to crossing a dozen different seams with different flows in each
 
the emphasis was that there is a difference not the actual distance. And if your too close and I put a hook in ya- I know I at least caught something large that day that I can surely brag about.
 
I was fishing out west with a guy who became furious because there were tracks on a dirt road to access the creek. There was no truck (and nobody else to be seen), but he was extremely angry that someone had fished the water since the last time it rained...
 
I don't think they make towels big enough for that.
 
there's always a blanket
 
Yea, I thought of that, too. Too small, and boat sails are not very absorbent.

We might just have to get a roll of fabric and silkscreen that.

I'm sure pcray could solve this problem.
 
lol
 
Problem solved!

Too slow, Pat.
 

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