Tohickon (sic?)

ian_brown

ian_brown

Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2007
Messages
308
In another thread Chaz mentioned the Tohickon as a decent tailwater. My impression was that it is marginal. Does it have a decent wild trout population and significant hatches?
 
Tohickon is a very nice stream to fish. It has great springtime scenery in the gorge and it has excellent habitat.....large rocks, large pools, deep pocket pools, and tumbling water. Above the gorge, which is walk-in only, it has lower gradient. The stream is stocked in-season only, usually during the first week of the season. It remains cool enough for trout until mid to late May. Fairly low usage in the gorge, good scenery, and plenty of room for a back-cast make this stream ideal for the fly angler who is seeking special reg type water without special regs. This stream, when stocked in the gorge (meaning when enough volunteers with float boxes are available), is everything you could desire from a stocked trout stream for 6 weeks out of the year. You'll think you are in northcentral Pa.
 
The problem with the Tohickon ,is water, or lack therof. After early season they hold back most of the water for the kayakers, leaving the stream at best a trickle. Check out USGS stream flows. It could be a great tailwater, but the kayakers seem to get all the water and the fisherman get screwed.
 
Question is can there be a balance between both interest groups?

Sounds like a really neat little stream and worth pursuing.
 
the insect pop. is fantastic..3 different stoneflies, caddis, mayflies,scuds, etc...over the years I have caught trout all the up to the dam...there are some springs feeding it someplaces too..
 
I did some diggin re: this lake/reservoir. One thing I couldn't find is how the tower is set up to release water...bottom release only or selective withdrawl? Who operates the reservoir, DCNR??

The lake appears to be adequate size and depth (70-90 ft??) to contain a decent coldwater pool. The Whitewater release is in March if I'm not mistaken and didn't se any other releases for WW, so this shouldn't have a profound affect on the coldwater pool in the lake.

So why doesn't the Tohickon have coldwater releases?? Is this just a matter of changing management.

Bottom line, from what I saw this fishery could be better
 
LehighRegular, I think you should run for Governor of Pennsylvania so you could use your influence to divert tax dollars from silly things like roads, bridges, poverty relief, law enforcement and such and direct it instead to improving trout fishing for us fly anglers. If you need help with the campaign out West, I personally know a half-dozen or more fly anglers that will probably help put up signs or even hold a rally for you. :-o
 
Jack wrote: “LehighRegular, I think you should run for Governor of Pennsylvania so you could use your influence to divert tax dollars from silly things like roads, bridges, poverty relief, law enforcement and such and direct it instead to improving trout fishing for us fly anglers. If you need help with the campaign out West, I personally know a half-dozen or more fly anglers that will probably help put up signs or even hold a rally for you.”


Jack,

I believe that your attack on Lehigh Regular is unfair. I’m sure he has spent a lot of time, effort, and probably money on trying to make at he Lehigh a great recreational fishery for everyone.


You always want facts to back up someone’s disagreement about your post – here ya go:


LR mentioned “changing the management” of the dam release as a suggestion, not spending more dollars as a solution.

The PFBC is funded from license dollars not tax dollars from the general fund.

With recreation comes more dollars into the economy.

Furthermore, my understanding is that this is a forum about flyfishing in PA. It is not here to solve world hunger, find solutions for peace in the world, or fill the potholes in the roads of western PA………sheesh!

LR has contributed a lot to this site with great info, advice, and a good story now and than. Your post is out of line Dude……..just my opinion.


I’m glad we have people like him to be an advocate for more and better fishing in the State. Lehigh Reguar - thanks from me, and keep up the good work!
 
Thank you for your opinion. I have those too. Perhaps you find my way of expressing the opinion objectionable. That is your right. But I suspect what you find "out of line" is the substance of my opinion that it is very easy to make a comment that a certain fishery "could be better" and yet a totally different issue when you ask how to make it better. The truth is, it costs lots of cash to design dams so they can be used to manage downstream cold water fisheries. This isn't PFBC license sales money (a dwindling resource in itself) but rather tax dollars. The population of anglers is a small fraction of the general public and the population of coldwater anglers an even smaller fraction of that. I feel it is irresponsible and unfair to throw out comments that suggest that the "government" is somehow shirking a responsibility by not ensuring that every dam in the state exist and be managed to maximize the fly angling possibilities downstream and I said so in my own way. Disagree with that if you wish.
 
direct it instead to improving trout fishing for us fly anglers.
Click to expand...

Jack, As has been said before this is a fly fishing board, and I would dare to say everyone here is an interest in fly fishing and fishing in general...but you really sound like you are against any money being spent to improve waters/habitat for the purpose of the ecosystem, or fishing. Are you against grants for stream-improvement, riprarian work, water quality work, farmer assistance and the some of the fine things many conservation and watershed groups have done? Surely that takes money away from the things you mentioned below. Sure sounds like you are against all of the above.

If so concerned take it to the next level and take it up with these people or some other similar group.


Citizens Against Waste

Your arguement/opinoin - whatever it is - is getting old.
 
I have no problem with using tax dollars to improve fisheries any more than I have a problem using tax dollars to improve the arts, to feed the poor, etc. I just think if you are going to make a statement that implies that the government is somehow at fault in not doing enough about anything, you should be prepared to discuss the benefit of doing what is suggested along with the cost of doing it. As old as my argument must seem to you, the above type of irresponsible government-bashing gets old to me.

It sorta reminds me of the time I was driving with someone who when cresting a hill was blinded by the sun directly infront of him. He declared, "they should do something about that!" Frankly, that is what a lot of this sounds like to me.
 
Jack wrote: “Thank you for your opinion. I have those too. Perhaps you find my way of expressing the opinion objectionable. That is your right. But I suspect what you find "out of line" is the substance of my opinion that it is very easy to make a comment that a certain fishery "could be better" and yet a totally different issue when you ask how to make it better. The truth is, it costs lots of cash to design dams so they can be used to manage downstream cold water fisheries. This isn't PFBC license sales money (a dwindling resource in itself) but rather tax dollars. The population of anglers is a small fraction of the general public and the population of coldwater anglers an even smaller fraction of that. I feel it is irresponsible and unfair to throw out comments that suggest that the "government" is somehow shirking a responsibility by not ensuring that every dam in the state exist and be managed to maximize the fly angling possibilities downstream and I said so in my own way.

Disagree with that if you wish.”



I do, thank you very much. I agree that recreational fishing is low on the priority of government responsibilities, but if all government monies (tax dollars) were allocated by the priorities you listed, zero dollars would be spent on recreation. A balance is needed. Our State/nation would be a very bleak place without recreational opportunities. We need advocates for recreational fishing, without them, no dollars would be spent on recreation. The fact is that better management of the flow is all that is needed in many cases to create and maintain a good tailwater fishery. The Upper Delaware River is one example of that.

I believe your statement, “I feel it is irresponsible and unfair to throw out comments that suggest that the "government" is somehow shirking a responsibility by not ensuring that every dam in the state exist and be managed to maximize the fly angling possibilities downstream…” overstates my interpretation of the facts and intent of any post I have ever read by Lehigh Regular.

Put aside the facts for now, Jack, your sarcasm is funny most of the time, but the tone of your post was more of an attack, not an opinion…that’s my opinion. No offense intended.
 
GEEZE...this thread went to hell in a handbasket real quick...oh no wonder, Jack decided to chime in :lol:

Jack
I appreciate your support or lack of support, I'm not sure which it is? You have every right to your opinion. But I would rather do something about improving our fisheries rather than sit behind my PC and complain about them as it appears you like to do.

I don't think I bashed our govt in any of my posts. I will admit I am very critical in regards to the PFBC because of thier lack of intiative in trying to develope some of our tailwater trout fisheries in PA. IMO, its the PFBC job to be improving our fisheries. That said, I work closely with and have formed partnerships with the PFBC, DCNR, ACOE, DRBC, etc to look into making managment changes that will help improve our tailwater trout fisheries.

You have every right to sit behind your PC and complain. However, if it wasn't for me, VC, the many active TU members and other great activists, such as Owen Owens, that are in this world protecting and trying to enhance our fisheries, there may not be many places for people such as you to fish some day.

So when I run for Gov, I will likely concede the Pittsburgh area and campaign the rest of this great state. And when I win, will give you the nice paved roads in SW PA, so you don't have any problems driving 2+ hrs away from your area/region in order to fish for large wild trout in the other parts of PA
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Have a nice day!

Afishinado, thanks for your kind words...greatly appreciate it.

If we could get this thread back on track it would be nice...my last post was just asking questions about the impoundment itself and its operation....maybe someone knows?? Mike K???? Its obvious Jack doesnt know :-D
 
Somehow I agree with both sides here. Is that OK?

I simply think there are leaps of logic being made by both sides in order to keep the disagreement alive... Probably without realizing it.

More should be done to improve these fisheries, but ya gotta use the right tool for the job... If you know what I mean. The organizations in place for just that should keep forging ahead and the road builders should keep building roads. I stink at linear algebra, so I'm not the one to figure it all out, but in the end everyone thinks they're getting screwed. Such is life.... at least since 1985. Something tells me it was like that before I came along too.

Oh, and I can't get enough of Jack's attitude. seriously. I think the only one who gets more enjoyment out of it is the man himself.
:-D

The internet is a hell of a place. I might be of a different generation here, but...

I'm just picturing that episode of chapelle's show where he goes
"to" the internet and comes out with bags of porn and CDs, among other things. Good stuff. All this feather ruffling, and there will still be cold beers and friendship at every Jam from here til the end of time. How's that work? Oh well, I won't look a gift horse in the mouth.
 
LehighRegular, when you made this comment, "Bottom line, from what I saw this fishery could be better," you invited me and any one else who disagreed with the implication to comment. I did so in my typical manner. I didn't ask to be questioned and challenged about it, but when I was, I took the time to respond and explain myself. I'm sorry if this sidetracked your intentions, but without your quoted comment above, it would not have occurred, so I'll ask you to take equal responsibility rather than try to blame it on me alone.
 
lol im finding this funny.

it does sound like it could b a geat fishery. IMO i say to hell with the roads! fix the dam, pa roads arent great anyways! :-D and they dont fix them right either :-D
 
Great links. Looks like a dynamite smallmouth Creek. They don't mind warm water.
 
Geeze Jack....I hope that you are being sarcastic.

FYI there is a world class smallmouth river (Lower Delaware) 2 minutes from this reservoir. The lake itself is a very good largemouth fishery. Don't you think SE PA could use a year round trout fishery...most are marginal as it is already.

Those are some beautiful pics....nice find.

As for my bottom line comment you slammed me on...I think Lou M, Sandfly and even Mike K (for most part) said the same exact thing but in slightly different use of words.
 
we do need another tailrace fishery. at least here in sepa. jack live out in western pa, he should because of location, understand our fight over here. but id vote for ya! give jack the roads ill take the trout :-D
 
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