Wild trout streams that get stocked question

[Underdog]

Do you think a lot of the really neat wild trout that would otherwise be released get taken home on a stringer from the wild trout streams that get stocked? Or do you think the tactics of a stockie fisherman, spook the wilds enough that many duck for cover?

 

[wildtrout2]

Do you think a lot of the really neat wild trout that would otherwise be released get taken home on a stringer from the wild trout streams that get stocked?

I'd say some of them do, without a doubt.

 

[Fish Sticks]

This is actually the reason that Maryland makes native brook trout catch and release because the crowds the stockers attract and the fishing pressure is immense. In PA both get harvested(stockers and brook trout) but the state only can put stockers back, effectively replacing one with the other time to an extent. This is one of the many reasons getting stocking reform is so critical.

 

[TimMurphy]

Do you think a lot of the really neat wild trout that would otherwise be released get taken home on a stringer from the wild trout streams that get stocked? Or do you think the tactics of a stockie fisherman, spook the wilds enough that many duck for cover?

Dear Underdog,

From informal surveys I have conducted around opening day weekend on Clarks Creek over 20 years I can assure you that many wild trout get harvested. When I ask the chain link stringer guys how they did they proudly hold them up and reveal a couple of silvery stockers and a couple of "dinks" that were stocked. Dink is their word, but they are clearly wild fish.

Regards,

Tim Murphy

 

[PennKev]

Do you think a lot of the really neat wild trout that would otherwise be released get taken home on a stringer from the wild trout streams that get stocked? Or do you think the tactics of a stockie fisherman, spook the wilds enough that many duck for cover?

My experience has been that it can be shocking the number and size of wild fish that turn up in stocked streams, particularly near easy access.

On the other hand I've seen some very nice wild trout on stringers at those spots.

So yeah it happens. It matters more on some streams and less on others. Wils trout in streams with long, fairly remote stretches seem to do fine. But there's always that wondering.... ....what if?

 

[troutbert]

Do you think a lot of the really neat wild trout that would otherwise be released get taken home on a stringer from the wild trout streams that get stocked? Or do you think the tactics of a stockie fisherman, spook the wilds enough that many duck for cover?

Yes, many wild trout get harvested on stocked streams.

Including native brook trout in the many streams where hatchery trout are stocked over native brook trout populations.

 

[Wild_Trouter]

Yes...I've been doing this a long time. There is a certain percentage of fishermen who don't release anything. If it's a trout, it's going home regardless of its origin and you couldn't tell that element otherwise. I know of one that gets absolutely plundered until the end of this month. The PFBC should stop stocking it but won't because local politics would never allow it. This is most certainly a case of "what if" they stopped stocking it as it has the right sauce to really be something. I know of others too, and we've been through the exercise of listing them on here before.

 

[Nymph-wristed]

Yep, I have seen them on stringers on every limestoner in Northampton and Lehigh counties....

 

[Bamboozle]

Last time I checked, wild fish get harvested on ANY stream where harvest is permitted, not just the stocked streams...

I get that pressure is heavier on the stocked "wild" streams and MAYBE harvest is higher, but that pressure dissipates once the last stocking has passed.

Looking at it another way; if fish on a stringer upsets you, is it better or worse if there are four fish on the stringer and three are stockers or if all four were wild....?

 

[Millsertime]

Absolutely.

I fished Tobyhanna Creek several years ago with a guy that keeps everything. He ended up fishing a Toby tributary with a good population of natives and harvested every native he caught. I can't remember if they were even legal size.

On the other hand, there are some excellent local Class A brown trout streams that very few people fish because "it doesn't get stocked anymore" or "there's only small natives in there". The guys I see fish these streams are typically always FF and C&R. If people would see the 20" browns I pull from the streams, I'm sure more eyes would be opened = more fisherman would show up = more harvesting.

 

[jifigz]

Wild trout get harvested in stocked streams. Stockies get harvested in stocked streams. Wild trout get harvested from unstocked streams. Stockies get harvested from unstocked streams. I do think, however, that in many streams a lot of average trout fisherman are far too noisy and careless to really get into the wild browns and brookies. Or they overlook where many fish are and stomp right through/past them to all of the "holes." Of course wild trout eat worms, get caught my spin fisherman, etc. Heck, the largest wild brown of my life was caught on a nightcrawler.....

Now, the damage and pressure brought on by said fishing can only be evaluated on a case by case basis. I can think of a few small streams that are minimally stocked that, after the first two weeks, never see pressure it seems. These are top notch trout streams, too. This might not be the case for all though. Kish, for instance, gets freaking pounded all spring and always has. No doubt wild brownies get harvested. But there are still a ton there. And tons of stockies.... So, I don't know.....

My girlfriend's dad I feel represents most trout anglers. He is about to be done fishing soon for the year, even though I tell him the best trout fishing hasn't even happened yet. He also really seems to always want to go to the places that are the most recently stocked. I try to tell him that on a good creek, look for places that weren't recently stocked. There are still fish there. Less people. Blah, Blah Blah. He will say it is "fished out" if he goes and has a bad day, catches none, and it wasn't stocked in the last 3 weeks. lol

 

[bigjohn358]

There are a lot of rumors circulating around several of the stocked wild trout streams. I'm hearing several small stream/creeks will be cut from stocking and a few like Fishing Creek in Clinton and Bald Eagle Creek in Centre will have catch and release of all brown trout. I'm all for this! Now the problem is educating anglers on what is a brown trout. I see a lot of wild browns caught in Fishing Creek and kept in the stocked section. There are a lot of meat hunters in that area and the wild browns are often accidental catches from the stockies. Its just bound to happen. I really don't target the stockies or wild browns any differently. I really wish there was a study done on the rainbow fingerling stockings on these streams. I'll watch the fingerlings grow from the time they are stocked (3-4 inches) right on up until they get about 12 to 14 inches. They all seem to max out at about the 12-14" mark.

 

[Fish Sticks]

There are a lot of rumors circulating around several of the stocked wild trout streams. I'm hearing several small stream/creeks will be cut from stocking and a few like Fishing Creek in Clinton and Bald Eagle Creek in Centre will have catch and release of all brown trout. I'm all for this! Now the problem is educating anglers on what is a brown trout. I see a lot of wild browns caught in Fishing Creek and kept in the stocked section. There are a lot of meat hunters in that area and the wild browns are often accidental catches from the stockies. Its just bound to happen. I really don't target the stockies or wild browns any differently. I really wish there was a study done on the rainbow fingerling stockings on these streams. I'll watch the fingerlings grow from the time they are stocked right on up until they get about 12 to 14 inches. They all seem to max out at about the 12-14" mark.

I agree, brown trout tolerate stocking MUCH better than brook trout it seems. There is also a publication to support that I have to dig up where I saw that. Wild native brook trout subwatersheds and watersheds should have fish relocated to these brown trout dominated ones that can handle intense angling pressure and competition if the state so feels that it must continue producing millions of hatchery fish. Its very financially wasteful in truth because if stocking was stopped in some streams all together you may get higher numbers of fish from nat repro than stockings. PA fish and boat seems committed to the former model of mass producing domesticated trout that most people are conditioned to fishing for and ignoring the question of where PA’s population is going to access streams that are jot elbow to elbow in 10-20 years.

I know people like the people J-figs knows who follow the truck, proclaim its fished out with no hookups. Its not their fault really its just that PA fish and boat encouraged them to fish for domestic trout that will strike anything, have no fear, and don’t know how to be……fish.

Pa fish and boats model is that this picture is the ideal angler experience as long as angler catch rate stays above 1 fish per hour. Thats who is driving the bus here

 

[bigjohn358]

I agree, brown trout tolerate stocking MUCH better than brook trout it seems. There is also a publication to support that I have to dig up where I saw that. Wild native brook trout subwatersheds and watersheds should have fish relocated to these brown trout dominated ones that can handle intense angling pressure and competition if the state so feels that it must continue producing millions of hatchery fish. Its very financially wasteful in truth because if stocking was stopped in some streams all together you may get higher numbers of fish from nat repro than stockings. PA fish and boat seems committed to the former model of mass producing domesticated trout that most people are conditioned to fishing for and ignoring the question of where PA’s population is going to access streams that are jot elbow to elbow in 10-20 years.

I know people like the people J-figs knows who follow the truck, proclaim its fished out with no hookups. Its not their fault really its just that PA fish and boat encouraged them to fish for domestic trout that will strike anything, have no fear, and don’t know how to be……fish.

Pa fish and boats model is that this picture is the ideal angler experience as long as angler catch rate stays above 1 fish per hour. Thats who is driving the bus here
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I really feel stocking over wild brown trout has little effect on them especially on the larger streams. They don't do anything differently just because there are stocked trout around or more fishing pressure. Also the stocked wild streams I know DO NOT get stocked with any brown trout. Its strictly rainbows with an occasional brook trout stocking. I think they do this to have less hatchery brown trout genes in the pool.

 

[troutbert]

I really feel stocking over wild brown trout has little effect on them especially on the larger streams. They don't do anything differently just because there are stocked trout around or more fishing pressure. Also the stocked wild streams I know DO NOT get stocked with any brown trout. Its strictly rainbows with an occasional brook trout stocking. I think they do this to have less hatchery brown trout genes in the pool.

On Spring Creek, when stocking was ended and C&R regs went into effect, the brown population doubled in 7 years.

On Fishing Creek, in the Narrows, when stocking was ended, and harvest restrictions went into effect, the brown trout population tripled.

So, brown trout populations are very significantly affected.

But brook trout populations are much MORE affected.

 

[bigjohn358]

On Spring Creek, when stocking was ended and C&R regs went into effect, the brown population doubled in 7 years.

On Fishing Creek, in the Narrows, when stocking was ended, and harvest restrictions went into effect, the brown trout population tripled.

So, brown trout populations are very significantly affected.

But brook trout populations are much MORE affected.

But what effected it more? Stocking or changing it to Catch and Release regs? I'm guessing Catch and Release regs had more of an effect.

 

[Bamboozle]

My girlfriend's dad I feel represents most trout anglers. He is about to be done fishing soon for the year, even though I tell him the best trout fishing hasn't even happened yet. He also really seems to always want to go to the places that are the most recently stocked. I try to tell him that on a good creek, look for places that weren't recently stocked. There are still fish there. Less people. Blah, Blah Blah. He will say it is "fished out" if he goes and has a bad day, catches none, and it wasn't stocked in the last 3 weeks. lol

This mentality befuddles me but I honestly think the best thing the PFBC ever did for me was publish stocking schedules...

 

[jifigz]

I know DO NOT get stocked with any brown trout. Its strictly rainbows with an occasional brook trout stocking. I think they do this to have less hatchery brown trout genes in the pool.

This is true for a variety of reasons, but I think the biggest reason is that rainbows are the easiest strain to grow and raise in a hatchery, AKA FARM and they represent are smallest segment of wild fish, hopefully making ID'ing wild torut easier. Have you ever noticed how any and all farmed trout you have ever seen on a restaurant menu is rainbow trout.

Kish, in its lower reaches, is stocked with browns AND bows. The browns do not seem to hold over very well as hatchery browns are rarely found months after stocking. The bows for sure holdover well, though. I am ready for them at least to start only stocking bows in that stream.

I agree wild brown trout streams are affected by stocking hatchery trout over them. The complication is how to best compromise for anglers. Do we stop stocking? Do we do the C&R for browns and allow stocked bows?

I don't know.

 

[Wild_Trouter]

I'll just come out and say it...The PFBC really needs to stop stocking Hyner Run in Hyner Run State Park. I think it's an absolute tragedy because I do fish it fairly frequently and I see people catching/killing 7" native brook trout along with the stocked bows and browns. You have a campground right along the stream within the Park, and nothing gets released there. If you're savvy, you can still catch fish in the lower end of the Park, but it could be so much more than it is. I'd be fine with one stocking in the Spring for the opener (w/all bows) for the sake of tradition, and have it C&R for all brookies for the sake of Resource First. I have plenty of other places I could name but it's just beating a dead horse at this point.

 

[bigjohn358]

I'll just come out and say it...The PFBC really needs to stop stocking Hyner Run in Hyner Run State Park. I think it's an absolute tragedy because I do fish it fairly frequently and I see people catching/killing 7" native brook trout along with the stocked bows and browns. You have a campground right along the stream within the Park, and nothing gets released there. If you're savvy, you can still catch fish in the lower end of the Park, but it could be so much more than it is. I'd be fine with one stocking in the Spring for the opener (w/all bows) for the sake of tradition, and have it C&R for all brookies for the sake of Resource First. I have plenty of other places I could name but it's just beating a dead horse at this point.

I agree with Hyner...I've heard Bakers Run is probably on the chopping block for stockies.