Longer Pole are much more accurate

Lets talk about Rods for a moment.

As you all know I'm new to FF. I was taken aback at how easy it is to break fly rods. I never broke a fiberglass spinning rod. One of the most frequent negative comments in online reviews about fly rods is breakage. When I was in the plane and in the river in Utah I met several folks that broke tips. Of the 3 rods I broke in the last year two were tips broken. In all the years of Spinning fishing I only ever broke on rod and it was in the hatchback of a 1975 Civic.

So it seems to me that Graphite is not the way to go. But doesn't all of todays glass rods have graphite in them.

What are todays rods made of actually?
 
This may be helpful in outlining an understanding of rod construction: Anatomy of a Fly Rod: A Glossary


As many eastern fly casters note, there seems to have been a sort of "arms race" over the last 3 decades where manufacturers are competing to have faster actions and lighter blanks. If I remember correctly, this was driven by western guides and fly shops who value the ability to punch a cast into the wind. I think this resulted in more fragile rods. Manufacturers (initially Orvis, I think) introduced thermoplastic resins to regain some durability.

At least I think that's the case.

The small but significant movement back to fiberglass rods is driven by easter fly fishers who tend to fish smaller waters and contend less with wind. The "drawbacks" of glass is it has a slower action and heavier than graphite. It's up to you to determine if this matters.

I have a circa 1950s Sears Ted Williams 7'6" 5 WT fiberglass rod that my dad used on hundreds of fishing trips. I have a difficult time casting it because I'm so used to graphite. Back in the 90s my dad drove up from Florida to meet me in western NC to fish the Davidson River. He had not held that rod in probably 25 years. Starting with the first cast he was expertly casting it. It was quite impressive. He know how to load and direct the rod.

Bottom line; there is not "correct" rod material. Fishing is for fun. Use what makes you happy (or less nervous) and works best for you. :pint:
 
Everyone has different preferences for rods they favor. I'm one of those guys that fished the back-in-the-day fiberglass rods back-in-the-day and never looked back when graphite rods were introduced.

I like the lighter and crisper action of graphite. I own and fish fast rods as well as more many moderate action depending on the type of fishing I plan to do.

When I pick up some of my older fiberglass rods just to reminisce, I find them very clunky and sloppy. I compare it to having a '57 Chevy.....beautiful car and nice for a Sunday drive, but no comparison to the performance, handling and power of the cars we drive today. Different strokes for different folks, no doubt.

I will say some of the newer fiberglass rods using newer "S" glass are decent, but I wouldn't choose them over the many graphite rods I've cast.

As far a durability, no doubt graphite rods are more fragile, but I take good care of my rods. In the 40 years or so I've used all the graphite rods I own, which is more than quite a few, I've only ever broken one and sent it back for repair. I fish quite a bit for trout, bass, muskies, steelies, and have fished for many saltwater species including stripers, redfish, bonefish and tarpon.

Some guys are rough on equipment, but if you take care of your rods, keep them in a case or tube for transport and don't abuse them while fishing, they will last you a lifetime. I have a few graphite rods that are between 30 and 40 years old and they are still going strong. Granted the older rods are semi-retired since I fish newer rods most times, but they still fish as well as they did when they were new.

I'm a big fan of many of the rods being produced today. The overall performance of rods are generations ahead of the older rods produced a few decades ago. Even the foreign-made rods are better now. And those that claim all the new rods are "broom sticks" haven't really seen and cast some of the rods that are actually out there. So there's no excuse to cast and fish a bad rod that doesn't fish well for you, even a budget prices. All you need to do is test out a few and pick the one that best suits your casting and fishing.

YMMV.
 
Thanks Fly-swatter. nice info.

Afish, how dare you, I'm easy on my equipment, I even took it out of the truck and washed it last year ;-)

Seriously, I haven't any issues with casting either FG or Graphite. I'm convinced that Spinning rods are heavier built and that accounts for me never having broke one. I also need to add linear rod holders to my boat and baby them a bit more.

Time will likely improve things for me if I work at it. And I sure don't want to go back to a stick, string and worms.
 
Baron:
I will gladly hold the football for you to kick!

AFish: I'm sure the rods find you clunky and sloppy as well.
 
Sorry folks. I’m still driving the old 57 Chevy. But I’m learning. For sure we need these “broomsticks” to sweep up all the rods I’ve been braking.
You’re all killin me. :-D
 
When I pick up some of my older fiberglass rods just to reminisce, I find them very clunky and sloppy. I compare it to having a '57 Chevy.....beautiful car and nice for a Sunday drive, but no comparison to the performance, handling and power of the cars we drive today. Different strokes for different folks, no doubt.
Click to expand...
Maybe true for longer rods, but no so much for shorter vintage fiberglass, especially 7'.

The well made vintage 7' examples such as Fenwick, Browning-Silaflex, Shakespeare, Heddon, Cortland, *some* Garcia 7'3" models, and other shorter 4-5wts can be simply sweet, and provide awesome small creek and tight situation performance that I've not seen with graphite. I watch people trying to survive graphite in those situations while I'm having a great day making casts of all sorts.

But I also agree that maybe it could be just personal preference ..... on the other hand, it may be that Madison Ave has educated consumers on what's best. But there's no way 7'6" 5-6wt graphites would be considered outstanding panfish rods, but I have a Browning- Silaflex that absolutely is. And when my pals try it they scratch their head in disbelief. The taper is magic.

But hey, I also fish my longer rx6 Batson graphites and think they are of the best rods I've ever handled in larger creeks.
 
So you would recommend the Browning Sikaflex?

I really not completed my Carbon Fiber approval raining yet. I went back to as much glass as I could get. I'm now looking at an old cortland.
 
Some Silaflex, I'm not advocating all of them. My 022975 from 1976 is super. And the 7'6" and 7' Cortland Pro Crest rods (and some other Cortlands) are also.

But before you buy any vintage or modern glass, do some research. Goto/Join the Fiberglass Flyrodders at ....
https://fiberglassflyrodders.com/forum/index.php

On the forum's home page upper right, see the "FFR Wiki" link .... goto that and from there select the brand you're interested. Some links are more developed than others, but most will at least list model numbers and and a brief history.

For instance, the Shakespeare (Wonderod) link is very well developed .....
https://wiki.fiberglassflyrodders.com/wiki/Shakespeare
And while some of the longer (8'6 etc) examples can be real brutes, the 7' Wonderod models are a joy to fish with, and so are many other vintage brands' shorter glass rods. Some not so much.

So at the least, you can then search the forum's archives with the model number or description you're interested in, and read what members have to say .... or just ask !
 
Springer,
I started this discussion, as I often do, in a way that would challenge people to dig deep and to defend their viewpoint. It was fun and I learned a few things. It was worth the work to keep this string going.

You mention FFR and you'll find me there harassing Bamboozle and a few others from this site. In a perfect world I like Old Glass rods.
Being new to the whole world of FF I have allot to learn. I have a full time job and it will take some time to learn my way around and to find the info I need. FFR has been very accommodating and I'm learning about wonder rods as we speak. I didn't know about the FFR Wiki Link.
Thans for the heads-up.


springer1 wrote:
Some Silaflex, I'm not advocating all of them. My 022975 from 1976 is super. And the 7'6" and 7' Cortland Pro Crest rods (and some other Cortlands) are also.

But before you buy any vintage or modern glass, do some research. Goto/Join the Fiberglass Flyrodders at ....
https://fiberglassflyrodders.com/forum/index.php

On the forum's home page upper right, see the "FFR Wiki" link .... goto that and from there select the brand you're interested. Some links are more developed than others, but most will at least list model numbers and and a brief history.

For instance, the Shakespeare (Wonderod) link is very well developed .....
https://wiki.fiberglassflyrodders.com/wiki/Shakespeare
And while some of the longer (8'6 etc) examples can be real brutes, the 7' Wonderod models are a joy to fish with, and so are many other vintage brands' shorter glass rods. Some not so much.

So at the least, you can then search the forum's archives with the model number or description you're interested in, and read what members have to say .... or just ask !
Click to expand...
 
I have one ultra-light spinning rod that's graphite. It's really a nice rod, but I don't fish it much anymore. One reason is I usually get stuck fishing with my one buddy who we've named "he who breaks rods by stepping on them". The other reason is if I broke I can't replace it. The blank isn't made anymore. All my other spinning rods are Ugly Sticks and those things are pretty much indestructable. I always wondered if they made a fly rod blank. I'll have to see if they make a 8 foot Ultra Light spinning blank. I'm sure a fly rod built on one would get some interesting comments on the water.
 
Jerry, Growing up on the farm I had a nickname that stuck for years:
Wreck'em-all , seriously. Wonder how I got that name?
 
First, on topic:

I prefer the longest rod I can get away with in all circumstances. On lakes and large rivers, that is usually a 9-foot rod with shorter rods most often used on medium to small streams. In a boat, I have a 9-foot rod and if I am fishing conventionally, I’m using the longest spinning or casting rods in my quiver which are 7 to 7’6”.

I just feel better equipped fishing a longer rod when I can get away with it.

Things I consider when choosing the length rod I use: reach (especially when mending or reaching over obstructions or faster currents that screw up a drift), obstructions around me and in the case of bank fishing, bank-side obstructions, tall weeds and back cast placement.

That being said, a person can achieve accuracy with any length rod of any material if they have reasonable casting ability AND can adjust to circumstances. While it isn’t fun to cast three feet in front of yourself with a 9-foot rod, it can be done so I wouldn’t fish a 7 foot rod on big water, in case that happens…

Heck, I fish 13-foot Tenkara rods and can drop a fly in a teacup from 30 feet away so it isn’t the rod length that determines accuracy….

Off topic:

In regards to preferences in action or material or even length, that’s why they call them “preferences” and not requirements. You like what you like and what works for you although sometimes it is out of necessity. For example, I prefer glass for the shortest rods I own (5’0” & 5’6”) because I have yet to meet a rod of any other material with an action I like in a rod that short, but that’s ME.

Rod weight has never been an issue so beyond that length, I have trout rods with my “preferred” moderate action in bamboo, glass and graphite including two graphite rods slower than most glass rods I’ve fished, (yes Virginia, there are slow graphite rods).

BTW - The only rod I ever broke was glass!!

In summary, you couldn’t GIVE me a fast action trout rod to fish with no matter what it is made of, however, for warmwater or saltwater exploits, I like FAST rods and you couldn't give me a moderate or slow rod, so go figure.

What DOES figure is what works for ME in the situations I encounter doing the kind of fishing I prefer.

Bottom line, fishing should be fun and for me a HUGE part of that fun is enjoying the “fishing.” That means the casting & retrieving and other stuff besides catching fish. It’s analogous to sitting in an uncomfortable chair for hours watching TV.

If I don’t like my chair, it almost doesn’t matter what I watch.
 
I couldn't agree more however one caveat: I prefer a shorter flyrod when in a boat. Although I do sometimes I prefer not to fish spinning gear.

So, When did you start carrying tea cups fishing? :-D
 
I like a longer fly rod in a boat 'cause if I'm fishing with someone else, it keeps my back cast high and out of the way, plus for the other reasons I mentioned before.

I also use rod holders in a boat so rods are out of the way when I'm NOT using them.

I should have said a shot glass...
 
Distance yes longer rod. But it all come down to who is casting the rod. 20 yards I have no problem with a 6 footer. Now longer than that a longer rod will help with Distance and accuracy At least for me.
 
What determines the size line a rod should have? It is very confusing sometimes. Is there a change in eyelet size that corresponds to different weights lines? Or is it merely the flexural characteristics of the particular rod?

Last night I fished a new-to-me reel (1492) loaded with what appeared to be very lite line......maybe 3 or4wt and strongly Wf. It was a very floppy glass rod marked 6WT. This rod has always done well with cheap 6wt line but last night with that lighter line I was all over the place while swinging lite flies and bugs.

 

Baron
What determines the size line a rod should have? It is very confusing sometimes. Is there a change in eyelet size that corresponds to different weights lines? Or is it merely the flexural characteristics of the particular rod?

Last night I fished a new-to-me reel (1492) loaded with what appeared to be very lite line......maybe 3 or4wt and strongly Wf. It was a very floppy glass rod marked 6WT. This rod has always done well with cheap 6wt line but last night with that lighter line I was all over the place while swinging lite flies and bugs.
Click to expand...

If you want to read a good article about the what the fly rod and fly line industry has done with the AFFTA fly line rating system read the following, and remember there’s no such thing as a 5 weight fly rod.

https://swiftflyfishing.com/blogs/news/fly-fishing-fly-rod-ratings-fly-line-weights-and-the-arms-race
 
Gene, that was a great article and confirms my suspicions. There was also an article there that described floating vs sinking lines. As a new FF I spend allot of time looking over my shoulder wondering if I'm doing it wrong.
 
Article on guide size:
https://www.rodbuilding.org/library/fly_rod_guide_sizing.pdf
 
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