Keystone stockings

[mute]

Are keystone categorized streams only stocked with brood fish during the spring and not other seasonal stockings ?

 

[Mike]

Not originally. Can’t speak to that now, but I doubt it. Fall stocked trout “tend” to be larger on average, or at least they did in the past, because the fish were held in hatcheries for almost an extra half year. Given the opportunity to produce or buy fertilized eggs at many different times of the year these days, that may no longer be true. So I guess you’ll have to attend a stocking or fish to find out.

 

[mute]

Thanks for the insight Mike. I would assume it be the case of the program for larger fish stocking to happen whenever a stocking said section was stocked.

Actually ended up fishing the Tully yesterday as its been a while and noticed they had a stocking. Even though I only had enough time(2 hours) to fish one of the proposed stocked sections it was pretty void of fish, caught a few out of a hole of an entire mile+ stretch, but not more then a buckets worth in that hole, and nothing of "keystone criteria". Other anglers reported the same. Maybe the next section would of been different, didn't have time to tell. Regardless I was asking because i was thinking of hitting it again tomorrow morning on my way to work and then drive a bit to try another keystone stream that evening where its been a few years.

I would of assumed that maybe only the larger brood fish existed for in-season stocking for obvious reasons.

 

[outsider]

We float stocked the Tully DH and the AT water yesterday. Seemed like the number of fish was lower, and the average size of the fish was definitely smaller than usual. No Select fish either.
On another note, we are making an effort to have the second stocking for Section 6 (spillway to Reber's Bridge) moved to the fall. That area sees at least as much fishing pressure as section 7, if not more.

 

[mute]

Thanks for the confirmations outsider. That adds up with my outing. Although again I only fished from Rebers down to not even 222. Was still a great evening on the water regardless. I dont fish that stream enough.

I was planning on like i said hitting it again tomorrow morning but maybe ill fish the next section down (222 and downwards) just because i enjoy the water. I wonder if the extra hour drive from there in the evening to the quittie wouldnt be worth it. Sounds like my assumption of "select" fish being present only exists for in-season stockings.

 

[drakeking412]

last fall pgh region got some really nice sized rainbows in the fall.

 

[PaScoGi]

The Tully needs to be changed to fly fishing only. Long overdue. It is not patrolled at all by PAFBC. So many spin fishers at the spillway poaching. What is the point of regulations if they are not enforced? Wish it was just made fly fishing only.

 

[Mike]

If they are fishing at the spillway, they are not poaching. The DH regs start at the first deflector down from the spillway.

 

[FCP]

To PaScoGi. We have been suggesting fly fishing regs for the Tully tailwater since the early 1980s, that 40+ years. Had multiple polls and drives with support for No Kill.
FCP

 

[HopBack]

The Tully needs to be changed to fly fishing only. Long overdue. It is not patrolled at all by PAFBC. So many spin fishers at the spillway poaching.

How exactly would this deter poachers? If anything it would increase poaching. It sounds like you just couldnt be bothered by spinfishers. I dont understand all of the fuss is over some stocked fish. Its not even a viable waterway to hold trout over through the summer. Yes know that fish gang up around the tribs and hold on for dear life.

 

[outsider]

Having fished the Tully extensively for 41 years, I never saw a reason to change the regulations. I think that would be selfish. Spin fishers do well for a week or so, then the pressure from them greatly subsides.

 

[PaScoGi]

No, I am not talking about the actual spillway. I mean guys walk down the stream (I've seen them all the way down to water road) with their bait buckets and lake spinning rods rigged with orange & red bobbers. They start at the spillway, see how crowded it gets, and walk downstream. I see them coming back up with the trout in their white buckets. It might not even be their fault, they are probably used to keeping what they want.

My point is the lack of enforcement. Why even bother having regulations then? PFBC is a joke.

 

[outsider]

I have pointed that out to the fish commission in the past. Fact is they are very understaffed, and they can't be everywhere. The WCO's have a pretty large area to patrol and enforce. And it doesn't seem like anyone wants to be a deputy WCO anymore (if that even exists today).

 

[outsider]

Also this: trout streams are not the only things they have to contend with. In Berks there are 5 or 6 impoundments, plus the Schuylkill River etc. I may have missed something.

 

[FCP]

The former WCO patrolled the Tully and he was just as busy.
FCP

 

[Mike]

With the vacancies and changes in personnel that have occurred in the past couple of years or so in some of the WCO districts serving Berks Co there was bound to be some lighter coverage at times on certain waters. Furthermore, with the Covid situation and increased boating activity at Blue Marsh I would not be surprised if added emphasis was placed on safety concerns there.

As for FFO, its a relic of the 1950’s and early 1960’s when the comparative delayed C&R fishing mortality caused by flies vs spinners was unknown and when (1950’s) spin fishing was just gaining traction in Pa. Fly fishing at that time was the only C&R management technique for trout known to provide acceptable fishing mortality rates. By the mid-1970’s much research had been done on comparative C&R delayed mortality rates associated with the two techniques and it became clear that at the population level fish mortality rates from both were acceptable in managing C&R fisheries.

Fast forward and improved bait fishing techniques, specifically tight lining (not sitting on a bank with a tight line, but more like nymphing without an indicator) has been providing acceptable, relatively low delayed C&R mortality rates as well. See the Idaho studies. Likewise, when bait anglers have an incentive to C&R successfully, they can do so at very acceptable levels. See the Pa Bald Eagle Ck study.

When doing angler use and harvest studies of selected DH Areas in the late 1980’s or early 1990’s the PFBC found that spin fishermen represented an average 30% of the anglers. Two of the study waters were Cheater Co’s Middle Br White Clay and W. Valley Cks. As I recall, of all waters in the study Middle Br had the highest percentage of spin fishermen at 35%, so variation among waters was low.

 

[outsider]

I would like to correct something that I previously posted. There are 8 impoundments that I know of in Berks County:
1) Scott's Run
2) Hopewell, which straddles Berks and Chester
3) Antietam
4) Carsonia
5) Kaercher's Creek
6) Ontelaunee
7) Blue Marsh
8) Bernharts

 

[Mike]

If you are searching for an abundance of bigger fish recently stocked, hit Little Pine…the lake and the creek above the lake.

 

[Floggingtrout]

As stated on previous thread same topic, tighter refgs and limiting water use doesn’t lead to less people breaking the law. They were already doing that. It just leads to less people being able to use a resource and resentment and less respect on the stream. If you see illegal activity call them out on it. Also offer your fly rod to a spin fisher on the stream. Ask him how the fishing was? What was he getting them on? I love fly fishing for trout, and also love fishing a live bunker for stripes, will even chuck a spinner for a strike in January/Feb. just sick of fly vs spin for me to cliche

 

[bearfisherman]

As far as Keystone Select stockings goes, our local water got small fish - actually below average rainbows compared to typical stockings in our streams.