High End Rods

Millsertime said:
NRD....What make/model rods do you currently have and what is the rod you like the most and the least?
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First: Orvis Clearwater 9' 5 wt Took 7 weeks to break the tip section, hence my focus on warranty. Meh, I wouldn't miss it.

Second: Orvis Clearwater 8'6" 4 wt Purchased to keep fishing while waiting for back ordered tip section. With my 5 wt Cortland line, I enjoy casting this rod more than the repaired 5wt where I had room to back cast. I want more length when my back is to a wall. I do not want another Clearwater.

Third: Moonshine Epiphany 10'6" 3wt nymphing rod. Rolls and casts the 5 wt line Cortland very nicely, if not very far. It's caught more fish on dries than nymphs.

Fourth: Hardy Demon 7' 3wt for small streams. Casting SA Amplitude Creek Trout 3 wt felt like it took too much effort. Light weight, pretty, I should to sell it.

Fifth: G Loomis IMX Pro Creek 7'9' 3wt to replace the Hardy. Casts easier than the Hardy with Rio Creek Trout 3 wt. Tip seems wiggly if I push it, but not pushing it very hard on small streams.

Sixth: Sage Foundation 10' 7wt for salmon, and someday Steelhead and streamers. Not really part of the Trout discussion.

So, what I'm thinking is that when I find an American made 10'4wt I like enough to become my primary rod, I'll probably keep the first Clearwater for a loaner, keep the second Clearwater for my wife, and sell the Moonshine.
 
If you go back to 1980, the gap between an entry level rod and top level rod was significant. In 2022, that gap has been narrowed and in some cases, it's almost gone.

What do you really get with the high end rod that's missing from low end offerings? Well, some may have a nano coating or something to help durability, higher end components and a huge thing is shaving off 1/16th of an ounce. You also get name brand recognition, higher resale value and enhanced warranty (maybe).

I fished junk for the first 3-4 years and caught plenty of fish. Bought my first high end rod in 84 and it was a sage 3wt that I still have today.

IMHO and based off of the last couple of years guiding, begining anglers couldn't tell the difference between a $50 rod and a $1000 rod. The novice that insists on using the high end rod typically can't use it well enough to make it perform correctly. They read about how awesome it was in the Yellowstone shootout.

At this point, buy what you can comfortably afford, have fun and learn as much as possible. If you are still into it 3 years from now, you're deserving of the upgrade and can actually notice the performance upgrade....and.... you will have a much better idea of what you like and don't like in a rod. It's like golf, if you typically shoot 128, buying a $2500 set of irons ain't going to make you a 4 handicap. It makes you look like a guy who has money to burn and is in desperate need of lessons 😁
 
I was told about the "trickle down effect".... RWR said the same thing. Bush called it Voodoo Economics. And, likewise, the 'trickle down effect" in rods only goes so far. With all they can do, and DO do, I swear, manufacturers intentionally build flaws into their mid-priced rods. I've cast enough over the years to notice "last model was more THIS or more THAT" So they had some rods with the desireable characteristics and overshot corrections. They make them more intentionally slow or stiff or heavy...whatever.
Like they say "Hey, this is too good. Screw it up by upping its swing weight." I swear it happens.
 
I have both the 9'/5 wt. Orvis Helios 3/Mirage reel and Recon/Hydros reel in the same rod wt./length.

I am pretty much a wooly bugger/ wet fly swinging fisherman, who in all honesty, is not that good, but doing my best to get better. That said, I really can't tell a significant difference when casting them between the two combos, but I know that I am not the best fly fisherman or fly caster reading my post.

I fish both rods and they are rigged differently.

My euro nymph rod/reel is the Recon/Hydros. I didn't really see the justification in spending more $ when I already know what I know. I did buy a 9'/7 wt. Orvis Recon for dealing with the wind. Again, I know my limitations as a fly caster so I didn't see the need to upgrade beyond what the Recon vs. Helios 3 can do for me.

I have posted before that I am a loyal Orvis customer because of their customer service.
 
I wonder if fly shops have demo rods any more that they allow you to use for a day of fishing. That would be your best bet to see what you like.

Based on your current rods, I'd recommend a Orvis Recon or a used Sage rod. I personally can't see justification for anybody to spend $1K on a rod.
 
I feel like I've learned a lot in a year, but probably not enough to appreciate $1k rod yet. Maybe someday. For now, a new Recon is the definite front runner.
 
In that price range, I'd definitely look at the Loomis IMX Pro, Sage Pulse or Sage Sonic. Pulse would be by far the easiest to cast. The other 2 are faster with less feel for feedback. Second thought... for the price of one of these listed above, you can get a Fenwick aetos 10' 4wt and a TFO LK Legacy 9' 6 wt for nearly the same cost.



 
I don't care for the "Farbank" website, but anyway, apparently something new is coming from Sage. Hope it's better than the format of the new web site. Pulse may be gone? Sonic not offered in a 10'4wt.
The IMX PRO is also not offered in a 10'4wt.
There are really not so many choices in this size/wt.
Thoughts on the Douglas DXF?
I may have become anti-Chinese, but not opposed to Korean rods. Still, I'd prefer to buy American this time.
 
Redington and Echo make good rods for those on a budget. TFO rods are decent too. I've cast the Douglas rods at shows and liked them, but I haven't fished them. I might have bought one earlier but they came along after my rod needs are filled (or maybe overfilled)

I've slowed down now, but used to build rods to get what I want at a reasonable cost(although blanks are more expensive these days). For example, I built a 9 1/2' 5 wt Z-Axis as my big water trout rod because I went out West and all the guides were using it and I loved it and I found a blank cheap when I came back home. For my 9' 8 wt saltwater rod I built a TFO BVK blank with upgraded salt water hardware and oversize guides. I love the way the BVK casts, but I didn't like the hardware on the TFO rod for the salt. So I bought the blank and the hardware I prefer. Kit rods can be inexpensive and fit most beginner's skills, but may not be what you want in the end.
 
Jeff is right, think Echo makes a shadow that is a high stick/ Euro rod
 
The R8 is set to replace the X series.
 
My premium rod is a Sage Z Axis that was a Christmas gift from my wife and daughters. I cherish it because of how I came to own it as much, if not more, than how well it performs. It feels wonderful on the occasions I’m throwing dries on a large stream like Penns or the Upper D. That to me is when a premium rod really performs. Yesterday I chucked a cone head woolly bugger with a bb split shot for stockers on a medium size stream with an Orvis Access. It worked just fine for the job. I have several mid range rods that get the job done and have been using a TFO Finesse for the little bit of small stream fishing I do. It tosses a dry/dropper just fine and a 10” fish feels like a monster at first.

Just fish - do it the way you prefer and don’t over complicate things.
 
I don't need a 10'4wt. I want a 10'4wt. I want a rod I can take a mile from the truck, nymph till the hatch and then cast drys. I want a rod that roll casts more better than a 9' rod.
 
I'm also curious. What makes you think that a 10' will roll cast that much better than a 9' rod? I've cast some 8' - 8.5' rods that roll casted great. I'm thinking line type, leader setup and technique trump an extra foot on the rod length. It might help to reach over currents or mend and distance but don't think it's dramatically different. Lastly, have cast very few 9.5' or 10' rods that were great for dry fly fishing.

For most PA water, 8-8.5 rods are more than sufficient. You are hitting big water like Yough, Pine, Lehigh or Delaware....a 9' rod is the standard. If you find something you like, roll with it but my experience has been less than stellar with rods over 9'. Let us know what you end up doing.
 
I'll echo what krayfish said, I have fished a 8'-6" 4 wt original helios rod for a long time and never had a problem, however fishing the Delaware last year made me buy a 9' 6 wt.

By the way I will say that as far as I can tell there is definitely a difference between a high end rod and a low end rod, but not so much between a high end rod and mid level rod.
 
I'll second what Krayfish said. The roll cast is in the line and leader. My 580 with a double taper will roll cast with the best of them.

Also, good luck with that 10' rod through the brush. I've owned one 10' rod, an 8100 One, that I found in the Cabela's "bargain cave". I tried it for streamers for trout. I couldn't sell that thing fast enough. I will never own another fly rod over 9'. Not to mention how much of a pain that extra 1' is in the rod holders of a drift boat or skiff.
 
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