fallfish confuse me

[bushwacker]

I've caught them in trout water. I've caught them in bass water. Some trout streams don't have them. Some bass streams don't have them. What dictates their presence in a body of water? Is their presence an indication of poor or good water quality? Are they tasty?

 

[Canoetripper]

I don't know the answer to your questions but I spent some time fishing in the Rocky Mountains and frequently catch white fish there.

I think that they are some what equivalent to the western version of a fall fish. I don't know if either one are very good to eat. I just don't know and have never tried to dine on either of them.

I used to work for a company that was headquartered in Muskegon, MI, which was located on Lake Michigan north of Grand Rapids. The white fish on the menu from Lake Michigan were right up there with walleye and perch as a local delicacy from Lake Michigan.

 

[Dave_W]

Canoetripper wrote:
I don't know the answer to your questions but I spent some time fishing in the Rocky Mountains and frequently catch white fish there.

I think that they are some what equivalent to the western version of a fall fish. I don't know if either one are very good to eat. I just don't know and have never tried to dine on either of them.

I used to work for a company that was headquartered in Muskegon, MI, which was located on Lake Michigan north of Grand Rapids. The white fish on the menu from Lake Michigan were right up there with walleye and perch as a local delicacy from Lake Michigan.

While they look and behave similarly, whitefish and fallfish are different critters. Whitefish are salmonids closely related to trout whereas fallfish are related to carp and minnows.

 

[Dave_W]

bushwacker wrote:
I've caught them in trout water. I've caught them in bass water. Some trout streams don't have them. Some bass streams don't have them. What dictates their presence in a body of water? Is their presence an indication of poor or good water quality? Are they tasty?

They're widespread and at home in warm water creeks and rivers as well as colder trout streams, especially those sections where temps transition from coldwater to marginal for trout (ie. 70s in summer). I rarely see fallfish in headwater brookie streams or cold limestone spring creeks, although I'll get small ones from time to time. Most stocked ATWs that get too warm for trout in summer are loaded with 'em (and chubs too). Bigger ones are more common in bigger, warm water creeks like Conodoguinet or Swatara, for example. In these waters, they routinely grow to 14-16 inches.

I don't know about their table fare. I have not heard of folks eating them - keep in mind that old time PA anglers ate white suckers - so I would doubt they're any good; probably comparable to carp.

As I've mentioned in past threads, I enjoy catching bigger fallfish and regard them as scrappy fighters. If I want something to eat, I'll go look for stocked trout.

 

[Canoetripper]

Dave_W,

I think that the white fish in Lake Michigan are a different species than those that I have caught in the Frying Pan River. I could be wrong about that. I just don't know.

The white fish that I have been served in restaurants in Muskegon, MI are every bit as good as walleye and perch. In my opinion, those three freshwater fish are as good as it gets for freshwater fish with only farm-raised catfish in the same league.

I lived in the south longer than I ever did in Michigan. I've dined on more catfish than walleye, perch, and whitefish combined.

 

[RLeep2]

>>The white fish that I have been served in restaurants in Muskegon, MI are every bit as good as walleye and perch. In my opinion, those three freshwater fish are as good as it gets for freshwater fish with only farm-raised catfish in the same league. >>

Well, you lost me at catfish... I tend to think of them as sort of the blue polyester suit of freshwater fish; serviceable and reliable but pretty ordinary.

During the 15 years we lived in the Midwest, I ate a lot of Great Lakes Whitefish. Pretty good and I'd never turn my nose up at them. But walleye, perch and even crappie leave them in the dust, IMO. That's the Holy Trinity of freshwater fish so far as eating, in my view.

Another fish that is underrated, IMO, are larger rock bass from coolwater lakes. Lake Erie rockies are delicious and usually of a size worth monkeying with.

 

[jifigz]

There is one particular wild brown trout stream that I fish that has a lot of them. They tend to be in the larger pools with very slow current. Other streams, like Kish, doesn't have all that many but they are there. The Juniata River grows some pretty darn big fallfish and I love catching them. They fight hard, reach a nice size, and readily take surface offerings as well as subsurface. They are always a nice bycatch when smallie fishing.

 

[shakey]

fallfish and chubs are supposed to be bony,but decent eating.

 

[sarce]

I think it's a habitat thing...I seem to catch a lot of them in streams large or small in wide, sandy runs or silted pools. Rocky areas on the same streams will either have smallmouths or trout which will eat fallfish. So I think streams with a lot of erosion and siltation issues will have more fallfish because there are less predator fish due to lack of predator fish habitat. This does not mean you can't find them in clean mountain streams or among the bass in a large river, but I think they are found in lower numbers in these areas.

 

[troutbert]

Are there many fallfish in the Susquehanna?

 

[Dave_W]

troutbert wrote:
Are there many fallfish in the Susquehanna?

They are in there but I see a lot more of them in the Susky's mid-sized tribs rather than in the main river itself. Ditto with the Juniata. Conversely, I see a great deal of quillbacks in the big rivers but far fewer in the mid-sized tribs and never in creeks.

Just my observation - I've thought about this and have no answer or theory as to why this is.

 

[flyflicker]

Quillback? I’ve never heard the term before. What species? Thanks

 

[Prospector]

flyflicker wrote:
Quillback? I’ve never heard the term before. What species? Thanks

Quillback is a freshwater fish in the sucker family. It has a deeper body more like a carp

 

[JeffK]

Interesting comment on the Susky tribs. The most fallfish I have seen are in the riffles of the Tioughnioga R, a Susky trib in NYS.

The Delaware has some outsize fallfish. I always wonder what the Delaware was like when pickerel and brookies were the only gamefish (browns, rainbows, smallies, pike, muskies, carp, and rock bass are all introduced). Either it was heaven for the anadromous fish or for fallfish.

 

[jifigz]

JeffK wrote:
Interesting comment on the Susky tribs. The most fallfish I have seen are in the riffles of the Tioughnioga R, a Susky trib in NYS.

The Delaware has some outsize fallfish. I always wonder what the Delaware was like when pickerel and brookies were the only gamefish (browns, rainbows, smallies, pike, muskies, carp, and rock bass are all introduced). Either it was heaven for the anadromous fish or for fallfish.

Don't forget the American Eel. I consider them a gamefish and they are certainly native to the Delaware.

Quillback and Buffalo both are hard fighting fish. The last time I caught a quillback was years ago out of the Juniata and it was pretty awesome.

 

[jifigz]

Plus, aren't Redbreasts native to the Delaware watershed?

 

[krayfish2]

Why do they always take a dump when caught? Got a big chub on Delaware the other week and he dropped a breakfast sausage on my shoe.

As for quillbacks.....tried to sight fish them on the Susky but they are crazy spooky. Can't even get a cast off. Look to average 3-4 pounds. Based on body build and speed they move....they'd have to put up a nice fight.

 

[pratt]

sarce wrote:
I think it's a habitat thing...I seem to catch a lot of them in streams large or small in wide, sandy runs or silted pools. Rocky areas on the same streams will either have smallmouths or trout which will eat fallfish. So I think streams with a lot of erosion and siltation issues will have more fallfish because there are less predator fish due to lack of predator fish habitat. This does not mean you can't find them in clean mountain streams or among the bass in a large river, but I think they are found in lower numbers in these areas.

not so sure about this - I fish the main stem Delaware alot right above Zane Grey and there are loads of fallfish in that section, mixed right in with the smallies in both slow moving and faster moving sections with and without structure (though generally the D there has lots of structure). they feed on the bottom, on top and in the middle. of course, that section of the D has lots of food (mayflies, crayfish, hellagramites, small fish, etc.)..enough for everyone so maybe that leads to their coexistence

 

[FarmerDave]

RLeep2 wrote:
>>The white fish that I have been served in restaurants in Muskegon, MI are every bit as good as walleye and perch. In my opinion, those three freshwater fish are as good as it gets for freshwater fish with only farm-raised catfish in the same league. >>

Well, you lost me at catfish... I tend to think of them as sort of the blue polyester suit of freshwater fish; serviceable and reliable but pretty ordinary.

During the 15 years we lived in the Midwest, I ate a lot of Great Lakes Whitefish. Pretty good and I'd never turn my nose up at them. But walleye, perch and even crappie leave them in the dust, IMO. That's the Holy Trinity of freshwater fish so far as eating, in my view.

Another fish that is underrated, IMO, are larger rock bass from coolwater lakes. Lake Erie rockies are delicious and usually of a size worth monkeying with.

Add bluegill to the short list, especially when caught through the ice or in early Spring. Very similar to perch or crappie.

I'd also put tilapia just below catfish when it comes to table fare. Many don't realize it is a freshwater fish.

I've seen smoked chubs in Pittsburgh grocery stores, and fall fish are probably about the same, judt a little bigger.

And Dave W. Carp are a food fish everywhere in the world cept USA. Have I tried it? Hell no.;-) But Spring time white suckers really aren't bad, just bony.

 

[redietz]

krayfish2 wrote:
Why do they always take a dump when caught?

That's my chief complaint about them. Otherwise, I'd deliberately fish for them more often.