W
wsender
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Save the money that you'd spend on books and book a day with Loren Williams. It's worth the money and the drive.
T
Twofly
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Wsender is dead on. If you can scrape up the dough, book a 1/2 day trip with a professional. I had my 10yr old son take a lesson with George Daniels from TCO in state college. Hes a great teacher and you will be miles ahead of the game. We both learned a ton. My son is now a pretty good fisherman and loves flyfishing.
jdaddy
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meh
george ftw. or paul. or charles.
wetnet
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Meh..You don't want to learn?
wetnet
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It is not always afforable to hire someone, but Loren WIlliams is not just a guide he is a true teacher, so should u get the opportunity contact him. I'd just contact him anyway
jdaddy
Active member
I have no problem spending money on a guide. I would suggest that there are excellent regional guides here that are just as equipped to teach without having to drive to Syracuse NY or further to spend money out of state. It is my opinion that one should support the local guys. I know that Loren is near and dear to you because of the competitive youth fly fishing thing, but you know local talent such as the aforementioned George Daniels actually won some of the international fly fishing competitions, thus would be pretty high in my book as well. I am not simply basing my recommendations upon perceived personal relationships. That's all.
wetnet
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George..I hear he sucks! LOL!!!!
George is a machine, they don't get much better.
Listen I don't ever wish to be mean or a know it all. George is an Ace. His Mom is the most Gracious woman I have ever met. My Son knows both Loren and George and many others across the US. I am so thankful that my Son had an outlet. Something he didn't get from soccer or baseball or football. He had #1 class Acts to teach him. If you know a kid that is just busting out of his waders. Let me know. I'll put some money up for a lesson or waders a TU camp or something. $200. You guys figure it out.
Padraic
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I never was a great nymph fisherman, but here's a couple things to try to get a handle on it.
Use a visible nymph, like an egg, a green weenie or the killer.. the chamois worm. Then fish it in clear water. You'll get a great idea of how your nymph moves through the water.
There is a religious schizm on the question of drift indicators. Whatever! If you have an emotional reaction to them, follow your bliss. If you approach them rationally, you'll find there are times when they are a huge help. Fast water? not so much. Low slow runs or in pools where you have to stand far back? Yeah.
There are many types of indicators. I took lessons from a great nymph fisherman, one of the best fishermen using any technique. He swore up and down at fishermen who used "bobbers". He ties in a foot of bright orange line at the butt of his nymphing leaders. When the tail end of it ticks upstream, he sets the hook. Well, that's an indicator even if its not a "bobber". Experiment with rigs until you find one that suits you.
Expect to get a hit. Even really excellent fishermen will miss a strike because they spend a half second wondering "if" they just got a hit. Expect the strike and strip a bit of line any time you see what might be a hit. If you "slip strike" you won't put your line up in a tree, but you will get those little tap strikes. And you'll be amazed at how many fish you get.
Use a visible nymph, like an egg, a green weenie or the killer.. the chamois worm. Then fish it in clear water. You'll get a great idea of how your nymph moves through the water.
There is a religious schizm on the question of drift indicators. Whatever! If you have an emotional reaction to them, follow your bliss. If you approach them rationally, you'll find there are times when they are a huge help. Fast water? not so much. Low slow runs or in pools where you have to stand far back? Yeah.
There are many types of indicators. I took lessons from a great nymph fisherman, one of the best fishermen using any technique. He swore up and down at fishermen who used "bobbers". He ties in a foot of bright orange line at the butt of his nymphing leaders. When the tail end of it ticks upstream, he sets the hook. Well, that's an indicator even if its not a "bobber". Experiment with rigs until you find one that suits you.
Expect to get a hit. Even really excellent fishermen will miss a strike because they spend a half second wondering "if" they just got a hit. Expect the strike and strip a bit of line any time you see what might be a hit. If you "slip strike" you won't put your line up in a tree, but you will get those little tap strikes. And you'll be amazed at how many fish you get.
TimRobinsin
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to me it depends on what kind of nymphing you like to do.
if you like to use an indicator: i like to leave about 3' of 0x or 1x between my flyline and indy. then from the indy down to my flies I usually go about one and a half times the depth of the area I am nymphing. so if my target area is 3ft deep I try to make the section of line between my indy and my first fly 4 1/2 ft long. I don't know why, I think I heard that some where.
if you don't like to use an indicator: the only way i do this is if I'm czech/highstick nymphing. in this case I make my leader long enough that my flyline is about a foot out of the water while still letting the flies bounce along the bottom. this is a great technique and is highly effective and fun because you really get to feel the fish take the fly.
Ill say this much, the common mistake i see with my friends that try to nymph but fail is that the don't use enough weight therefore they are not getting down to the fish in the target area and they do not give themselves enough leader to properly mend their line when using an indy.
don't fear the leader!
you'll learn to cast with weight by practice, the only thing ill add about casting weight is, don't mistake speed for power. that is to say that when casting you can cast weight well by being powerful in your movements but you don't necessarily have to make fast movements. feel the weight load the rod on your forward and back casts. you'll feel this by making crisp, well defined stops at the end of your forward and backward casting motions.
thats just my 2cents, it works for me. I learned this weekend that there are a lot of smart, good nymphers on here. good luck, stick with it.
if you like to use an indicator: i like to leave about 3' of 0x or 1x between my flyline and indy. then from the indy down to my flies I usually go about one and a half times the depth of the area I am nymphing. so if my target area is 3ft deep I try to make the section of line between my indy and my first fly 4 1/2 ft long. I don't know why, I think I heard that some where.
if you don't like to use an indicator: the only way i do this is if I'm czech/highstick nymphing. in this case I make my leader long enough that my flyline is about a foot out of the water while still letting the flies bounce along the bottom. this is a great technique and is highly effective and fun because you really get to feel the fish take the fly.
Ill say this much, the common mistake i see with my friends that try to nymph but fail is that the don't use enough weight therefore they are not getting down to the fish in the target area and they do not give themselves enough leader to properly mend their line when using an indy.
don't fear the leader!
you'll learn to cast with weight by practice, the only thing ill add about casting weight is, don't mistake speed for power. that is to say that when casting you can cast weight well by being powerful in your movements but you don't necessarily have to make fast movements. feel the weight load the rod on your forward and back casts. you'll feel this by making crisp, well defined stops at the end of your forward and backward casting motions.
thats just my 2cents, it works for me. I learned this weekend that there are a lot of smart, good nymphers on here. good luck, stick with it.
W
wsender
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True, especially given the OP's location. He probably sees George more often then most of us do. I only mentioned Loren because I've used him before and had a great time and because I possibly think the OP is a bit on the younger side and I know Loren is a youth coach (but I think George is too, correct?) and has experience coaching.
Speaking of George and nymphing, doesn't he have a book coming out in the near future?
M
midnightangler
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He does. I've seen the early copies, and it looks great. Title is "Dynamic Nymphing":
http://www.amazon.com/Dynamic-Nymphing-George-Daniel/dp/0811707415
It is pretty funny how infrequently he is referred to by his actual name, George Daniel. Why does everyone want to add an "s"?
pcray1231
Well-known member
This is one reason I don't use floats if I can get away with it. That said, I can't always get away with it, and do sometimes use floats.
One thing I do when using a float is to "check" the float. It's basically that once you sense that the float is too far downstream of the nymph and is or will soon be dragging it, move the float upstream a little. Most of the time it's simply throwing a mend in the line out as far as the float, you throw it upstream a bit.
The disadvantage, of course, is that you are putting a little slack between the float and the nymph, which hurts strike detection. There's always that trade-off. Tight line = better strike detection but imparting some drag.
One thing that helps lessen the trade-off is making sure that all subsurface line is thin diameter. Don't sink your butts. That means short or absent butts and tapers, with long tippets. The fine diameter cuts through the current better, thus reducing drag, while still giving you sensitivity.
When going indicator-less, it's really amazing how slow the drift should be, you have to kind of see it to understand. The nymph needs to be truly just rolling along the bottom.
jayL
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Because the version with an s sounds more like a last name, and the incorrect version has become a meme.
jdaddy
Active member
"Look inside the cover" on Amazon gives an idea of the books content.
http://www.amazon.com/Dynamic-Nymphing-George-Daniel/dp/0811707415
afishinado
Moderator
Staff member
Agree with the above. Like Pat, I seldom use an indy, except when I fish across multiple current speeds in a larger river or stream and mend to the indicator. Most times I apply paste floatant to my furled leader, and use flouro colored line and/or a dab or strike putty for visibility. With a "sighter" rather than an indy, I can control the depth by the type cast I make and/or changing the rod angle rather than movng the indy up and down.
As far fishing an indy and "checking", I only do so when trying to achieve more depth on the drift. The most important thing that I do is balance the rig with an indy. By balance I mean add enough weight to get the fly in the zone at the bottom. The weight of the rig counteracts the drag of the indy on the surface.
To get into the zone use all tippet behind the indy, get the length right (no more than 2x the water depth) and adjust the drift with weight. When this is achieved, you will see your indy traveling slower than the current since the current at the bottom is slower than it is on the surface. The fly is riding close to the bottom in the zone where I want the fly to be and there is no slack between my fly and my indy.
I like to use weighted flies and tie them in different weights for better strike detection. I may add a split shot if necessary and I often use tungsten putty to make fine adjustment to balance the rig.
wetnet
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There is no setting one teacher above another every one learns differently and until you really open yourself up you'll learn just one way from one teacher. When you are really awake you will learn everything from them and make it your own.
I love nymphing because there is a close connection for me when doing it.
Not a ton of advice as far as indicators, I just don't use thingabobbers or putty. I just have other things from one teacher and another.
I still suck if that makes anyone feel better. LOL!
I love nymphing because there is a close connection for me when doing it.
Not a ton of advice as far as indicators, I just don't use thingabobbers or putty. I just have other things from one teacher and another.
I still suck if that makes anyone feel better. LOL!
SBecker
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O just to many jokes can be used after that post 
Speaking of George Daniel...The newbies on here might be interested in learning from him hands on. The Western Pocono TU will be having a pig roast on Memorial Day in May and everybody is invited. George will be there the whole day and will be doing an on stream presentation and video presentation. This might be one of the cheapest and best times to learn from one of the best.
Speaking of George Daniel...The newbies on here might be interested in learning from him hands on. The Western Pocono TU will be having a pig roast on Memorial Day in May and everybody is invited. George will be there the whole day and will be doing an on stream presentation and video presentation. This might be one of the cheapest and best times to learn from one of the best.
jdaddy
Active member
SBecker wrote:
O just to many jokes can be used after that post
Speaking of George Daniel...The newbies on here might be interested in learning from him hands on. The Western Pocono TU will be having a pig roast on Memorial Day in May and everybody is invited. George will be there the whole day and will be doing an on stream presentation and video presentation. This might be one of the cheapest and best times to learn from one of the best.
Hey Shane, you are probably FB friends with George. As such you are probably aware that someone hijacked the #OOPS# out of his account and as late as a few minutes ago I got super awesome horrible stuff from his account. You may want to let him know.
SBecker
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Done
wetnet
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Some times there is just not enough damage control.
But I can try. When you have multiple teachers they all have something different to offer. I just think that it's hard to get outside of your comfort zone. You learn new things but still go back to the same old thing anyway, because it's the only way you've really been sucessful. That was my pretty much boring point.
I nymph because I am comfortable with it, can't see a tiny dry to safe my life and am afraid to wade above midwaist. I have made fly fishing my own, when I had back surgery and turtle crawled from rock to rock to fish. Rock fishing.
