Vista Outdoor buying Simms Fishing for $192 million

[Bamboozle]

I just think it is an oversimplification to imply that outsourcing equals low quality. Japan, Taiwan, Korea, and yes, even China now makes many products just as good as we make them. There is American made quality and American made junk.. There is imported quality and there is imported junk. The consumer who buys the junk is to blame for it still coming in, that I agree with, but country of manufacture does not imply junk..I can't agree there.

I have lots of Spyderco's from all countries of manufacture that they use and I can't say the USA made knives are the best. A USA made model is my favorite, however, but the best quality? I don't know about that. I think it goes to a Taiwan blade. I have a friend that owns a shotgun accessory company so I have tortured so many models of autoloaders just for the sheer purpose of firing thousands of shells and I must say the American autoloaders are no better built than imports. Heck, even the Turkish guns that were rubbish 20 years ago are amazing quality these days. What makes my USA made Orvis rod leaps and bounds better than my Korean made TFO? It has some nicer components, but for the price difference it should, but I can't say it is higher quality.

I'd be inclined to remove Japan for the list of junk merchants...

However I will refrain with the utmost vigilance to refuse to buy $#!+ from China.

You can do as you please...

...and contribute to the problem...

 

[jifigz]

Honestly I've purchased way more American made products that I'm disapointed in the quality of. I guess I expect way more out of the product plus the product usually costs way more.

I can actually agree with this.

I'd be inclined to remove Japan for the list of junk merchants...

However I will refrain with the utmost vigilance to refuse to buy $#!+ from China.

You can do as you please...

...and contribute to the problem...

Not acknowledging what other countries do well and their production capabilities is a dangerous level of myopia.

You did fail to acknowledge that there is quality and junk from all countries, including ours. And that is fine. I will continue to buy what is good quality and fills a role regardless of where it is manufactured. And, as I said, prefer USA made when I can to keep someone in my country employed.

 

[greywolf]

I'm a huge fan of Orvis however, they also had/have issues with stuff they outsource and even some QC issues with rods THEY make in Vermont. I've also seen more than a few occasions where they seem to ignore bad reviews of those products on their website.

Maybe they make good if the complainant contacts them directly for resolution, however that's no excuse for selling $#!+ for top dollar in the first place.

Same with L.L. Bean, another great company with great customer service that often sells overpriced junk.

There must be a reason and that reason is and always will be profits. I realizes this as much as the next guy but there WAS a time in both company's histories when the good stuff vastly outweighed the crap.

Cabelas was also a customer and quality focused privately owned company that started going downhill when they went public and sold stock. Focus shifted to making wall street happy by meeting earnings forecasts and buyout by Bass Pro made it much worse

 

[Bamboozle]

I believe L.L. Bean only make their Maine Hunting Shoes and canvas totes in Maine.

Everything else is "imported."

Folks can buy what they like from where ever they like. However, before you cast doubt on the quality of products made here, do some inquiries on where the stuff is really made, meaning where the materials they are constructed of come from.

Every hand tool I buy is made in the USA because I've had my share of bad experiences with tools from Asia, specifically China breaking or bending. However, a lot of US based companies try and get cute about the country of origin (COO) on their websites and catalogues.

Recently I needed some ball-peen hammers so I went looking on-line. I found only a few labeled as made in the USA. But when I did my research and asked the manufacturers what the COO was I discovered one "Made in USA" hammer was manufactured with outsourced steel on an American made handle, while another was US made steel on an outsourced handle while others were only assembled here.

If the head on the "Made in the USA" with outsourced steel rusted or deformed or the "imported" handle on the other hammer breaks, is that really reflective of the quality of USA stuff??

If anyone cares, I ended up buying my hammers from Snap-On who assured me in writing that both the handle and the head were made here.

Did I pay a LOT MORE so I could sleep at night?

Absolutely, WAY MORE but I refuse to reward bad behavior by buying from places that are deceptive in their advertising or who are dealing with folks that quite frankly don't have our best interests in mind, especially recently.

Label it myopia, nationalism or even xenophobia if that floats your boat. I just choose to not be a hypocrite when it isn't convenient or cost effective to stand on my principals.

Back on topic; only time will tell if Simms quality goes down or how many more products & materials they outsource after this acquisition.

 

[RLeep2]

My NRS inflatable kayak was made by the good little Commies of the Socialist Republic of Vietnam. It is durable and of good manufacture. If it wasn't, I would have drowned and then there would have been no way for me to come here and testify to its quality...

There are times when buying American is smart, not only from a USA Uber Alles standpoint, but also in terms of functionality or quality. IMO, my Folstaff is an example of this. I wouldn't hit a dead dog in the drive end with most of the imported staffs out there.

There are also times when Buy USA! is more about virtue signaling than anything else. My LL Bean Pocket Water fly rod was made in China, probably in the same industrial park as the company that makes the Izod knockoff polos and the 15 minute COVID antigen test and maybe the True Value garden rakes as well.. My Pocket Water is one of my 4 favorite fly rods, absolutely as well as I like my 3 1980's vintage American Made Orvis Premiums

 

[poopdeck]

The Chinese junk bs. American made awesomeness gets brought up a lot round here. What the don’t tread on me Merica types don’t understand is you can specify how you want your foreign made parts made. If you want cheap you get cheap. If you want super awesome you can get super awesome from China, Korea, India, Vietnam and the USA. You can also get super cheap junk even in the USA. No wait……especially in the USA. It’s the only way to offset insanely high labor costs. But for sure you can get exceptionally well made stuff at exceptional prices in the USA. I happen to like quality stuff at awesome prices regardless of where in the world it’s made.

for the record, buying imports also supports all those Mericans working in the importing end, at the docks, truck drivers, Amazon delivery drivers

 

[Bamboozle]

With that convoluted logic, maybe we all should start buying 100% of our gear from online retailers out of country and put all of those local fly & gear shops people seem to adore out of business too...

You know, to support those poor Mexicans & delivery drivers...

...or doesn't that fit the narrative.

And for the record, if you think for one minute that just because you SPECIFY to an offshore manufacturer how you want something made that they will follow through for the extent of the contract with your wishes unless you are there looking over their shoulder...

...you never had 1000's of items made offshore.

 

[poopdeck]

Maybe my logic is convoluted because what I said was you can get junk or awesome stuff from any country and you can get get stuff at good prices even in the USA. It’s just harder to find something well made in the USA at an affordable price. Easier to find something well made at an affordable price in other Countries. I’ll support a global economy any day of the week.

 

[Tigereye]

There are 3 qualities we look for in a product. 1) Low price. 2) Quality 3) Quick availability.

You only get 2 of the 3.

 

[Sylvaneous]

That is what I meant by my original reply about Cabela's too. I walked in a store with a broken rod and walked out with a replacement no questions asked at least 2 times over the years before BPS.

In my experience, before the merger, Cabela's branded gear was better stuff than the Bass Pro stuff. Now it's all the same. Why they bother to keep the name , I wonder. BPS traded on being more southern, more hick-ish, NASCAR, Bud LIght. Like cigarettes, the customer self-selects. Cabela's used endorsements of waterfowl gear by Minnesota Vikings coaching great Bud Grant. They certainly didn't tread into the Orvis realm, but their stuff was better than BPS 'RedHead", which itself was an esteemed brand.