Survey results of Black Creek aka Hayes Creek

[NJAngler]

For you stat nuts - like me - here you go:

I've fished Hayes 23 times(1995-2012). On my career list of Pa trout streams fished, it ranks 41st based upon trout caught per visit(23.4). 12 brook trout and 527 brown.


23.4 sounds great to most but for being a Class "A" stream. fairly remote and with 3+ miles of continuous access, its not a good number from an angling success pov.

Its also interesting that among my "Top ten" best streams. only 4 of them are Class "A"., In fact the top three are not "A". Just goes to show that there are some great public waters out there not on any list - as of yet.

Disclaimer: my #'s are mostly based upon spin fishing which I do about 90% of the time. Of the 23 trips to Hayes, only two were ff and none particularly good(6 and 8 fish respectively)

 

[wgmiller]

Interesting stats. Clearly the electroshocking shows that fish are there, however, as has been stated by Mike in the past, a fishing is not the most effective means to catch them. I'll keep the study in the back of my head, but still have a gut feeling that on a flyfishing effort/reward scale, this creek is pretty low.

 

[geebee]

This is dumb question - but has anyone fished it mid winter ?

I was thinking of giving it a shot. I've read that the fishing can be exceptional in two guide books.

 

[salmonoid]

geebee wrote:
This is dumb question - but has anyone fished it mid winter ?

I was thinking of giving it a shot. I've read that the fishing can be exceptional in two guide books.

I don't know that I would classify any stream that I've fished in the wintertime as exceptional, because I usually fish freestoners and they slow remarkably as the cold sets in. The bedrock geology there is predominantly sandstone, so I don't think there would be any limestone influence to keep the water warmer. But, my wintertime wanderings are always more about being outside prospecting; catching fish is always a bonus. I don't have any specific experience on this stream, but that doesn't mean that the guide books are wrong or that one couldn't glean equal enjoyment in exploring it during the winter.

 

[Swattie87]

I'm sure it's an extremely low alkalinity, infertile freestoner. Seemingly all of the small, steep Pocono streams are that way. Most are pretty tannic too. Not sure on Black/Hayes, but I bet it is at least somewhat tannic. Someone that's fished it can verify.

I agree with salmonoid that on most days, it won't fish very well in Winter, despite what any guide books may say. This is pretty much standard for small freestoners in Winter. If you catch them after a rain, and during a warming trend you can have a decent day, but they won't show their best stuff until the afternoon water temp is consistently in the mid 50's, or higher. Even then, and especially with Browns, you want to fish them after a rain event.

As salmonoid mentioned, Winter is the best time to do your scouting...less brush along the streams and easier to get around. If you're walking along the stream though, you might as well take your rod!

 

[geebee]

thanks guys. i'll stick to the limestoners unless we get a warm spell.

 

[JasonS]

Am I the only who noticed that the trout pictured on the last page of the report is obv a stocked brown even though they labeled it as "12 wild brown trout".

 

[troutbert]

JasonS wrote:
Am I the only who noticed that the trout pictured on the last page of the report is obv a stocked brown even though they labeled it as "12 wild brown trout".

Why do you think it is a stocked brown? It looks wild to me. The pectoral fin looks perfect.

The brook trout shown in post #16 is a hatchery fish, though. I'm 96.47% sure.

The indicator is the very opaque, milky look of the fins. That is common with hatchery trout. Wild trout fins are generally much more transparent, particularly with small trout.

 

[wildtrout2]

troutbert wrote:

JasonS wrote:
Am I the only who noticed that the trout pictured on the last page of the report is obv a stocked brown even though they labeled it as "12 wild brown trout".

Why do you think it is a stocked brown? It looks wild to me. The pectoral fin looks perfect.

Good question. I see what I believe is an eye spot as well. Wildtrout2 says wild trout on that one.

 

[wildtrout2]

I was going through some pics and found this one from Hayes/Black Creek from 2010. I think I remember posting this pic and asking if folks thought this brookie was wild or stocked. It's size makes it questionable. It was one of only 3 trout I caught that day.

 

[troutbert]

Wildtrout2, That's a hatchery brookie. Notice the crinkled pectoral fin.

The last time I was at Hayes Creek, I also caught a hatchery brookie there. Which makes 3 people on this thread who have caught hatchery brookies there.

It's a supposedly unstocked stream. Are fish coming up from the river? Or are some local people doing a little stocking in the lower end?

 

[wildtrout2]

Yes TB, I think you're right. Also, that brookie didn't really have the crisp, vivid colors of a native. As I mentioned, it's size also had me skeptical. As "wild" as the area is, I can only see them getting in there from the river.

 

[wildtrout2]

Does anybody have any info as to what this little dam was for, or what it was a part of?

 

[Fishidiot]

Perhaps a mill (esp if there are nearby ruins of buildings)?

 

[wildtrout2]

I must be getting old! I think that I may have misnamed a group of pics, and have them titled Hayes/Black Creek, when in reality I think they're from Lick Run (Clinton). But that pic of the stocker brookie was from Hayes without a doubt. Memory does get foggy with time, and that's one of the reasons I take a lot of pics when I'm streamside. lol

 

[blueheron]

I think that there is a way to mine the information from your pictures, such as date and possibly location, but I'm not sure of the technology involved. I'm not inclined to think the brookies migrated up from the river unless they were stocked close to the confluence.

 

[troutbert]

wildtrout2 wrote:
I must be getting old! I think that I may have misnamed a group of pics, and have them titled Hayes/Black Creek, when in reality I think they're from Lick Run (Clinton). But that pic of the stocker brookie was from Hayes without a doubt. Memory does get foggy with time, and that's one of the reasons I take a lot of pics when I'm streamside. lol

I'm pretty sure that dam is not on Lick Run either.

Maybe Hickory Run above Rt. 504?
There are a bunch of remains of old dams there. I think I read somewhere that they were from sawmills.

 

[Chaz]

Usually hovering over a pic will tell you when it was taken, but if it doesn't right click on the image and then click properties, that gives you important details.
I've caught some stocked brookies in Hayes/Black Creek on a couple of trips. Must be coming from either the river or someplace upstream where some club stocks.