Spruce Run Tests and Checkup (Stocking Tests)

[KrsnaM]

Tell us you know nothing about how ecosystems work without actually telling us you know nothing about how ecosystems work.

If I understand the gist of this thread, you essentially want the equivalent of your own aquarium you can stock with non-native fish so you can fish it. So you’ve made up some theory that’s putting non-native fish in waters where they do not exist can have positive effects. Other than potential recreational enjoyment (i.e., catching stocked fish), what positive effects do you imagine come from introducing invasive species in a body of water where they currently do not exist? Just because there’s “like nothing big in the water dude” that does not justify introducing an invasive species into a body of water AND certainly not doing so on your own accord. Just because there’s “like nothing big in the water dude” that does not mean you get to just dump a few buckets of your preferred gamefish into a stream (or any body of water) without the need for actual scientific study of the impact on the species that currently inhabit that body of water! For the love of god, have we learned nothing from the past 150+ years.

aight buddy calm down lmao. how are you this worked up over an idea haha,

* I don't want my own aquarium, I don't know where you find such an accusation. All I'm trying to do is add to these waters which have seemingly once been filled with life.
* What you don't seem to understand is our own living and taking over of land has already impacted the "natural" essence of the water. For example, if there ever were native trout in this area, they could have been driven out due to humans. We already change nature.
* Like I said, I have been monitoring the pH, depth, width, species of fish, bugs, etc etc. Im not blindly doing anything, in fact all I have been doing is preparing for the possibility of stocking it. I have spoken with different PFBC officials for months now and closely looked at the laws, rules, and guidelines regarding stocking. When I say "there's nothing big in the water", I mean there's nothing more than minnow, and creek chub, no larger fish that are spawning right now.

To say I don't know about how an ecosystem works is undoubtably a fact, but I'm learning and along with learning I'm trying to stock the waters within legal guidelines if all tests come pack positive.

 

[bdhoover77]

aight buddy calm down lmao. how are you this worked up over an idea haha,

* I don't want my own aquarium, I don't know where you find such an accusation. All I'm trying to do is add to these waters which have seemingly once been filled with life.
* What you don't seem to understand is our own living and taking over of land has already impacted the "natural" essence of the water. For example, if there ever were native trout in this area, they could have been driven out due to humans. We already change nature.
* Like I said, I have been monitoring the pH, depth, width, species of fish, bugs, etc etc. Im not blindly doing anything, in fact all I have been doing is preparing for the possibility of stocking it. I have spoken with different PFBC officials for months now and closely looked at the laws, rules, and guidelines regarding stocking. When I say "there's nothing big in the water", I mean there's nothing more than minnow, and creek chub, no larger fish that are spawning right now.

To say I don't know about how an ecosystem works is undoubtably a fact, but I'm learning and along with learning I'm trying to stock the waters within legal guidelines if all tests come pack positive.

Again, you are concerned with the presence of some preferred species of gamefish for which you want to fish. You seem to be ignoring the potential impact on the fish and other species already in that watershed. That is where the concern should be; not with the desire to stock yet another stream. I don’t think there is any lack of stocked trout water in PA (or here in MD where I am).

Just because a stream does not have your preferred species of gamefish, it does not mean you should be stocking over non-gamefish (at least not without the express permission of the applicable regulatory authorities).

 

[KrsnaM]

Again, you are concerned with the presence of some preferred species of gamefish for which you want to fish. You seem to be ignoring the potential impact on the fish and other species already in that watershed. That is where the concern should be; not with the desire to stock yet another stream. I don’t think there is any lack of stocked trout water in PA (or here in MD where I am).

Like I said, the watershed has already been affected by human presence-- forest has been cleared, homes built, waterways blocked. Not like anyone cares about the water right now anyways, at the very least I'm showing interest in it? Ive been trying to research the waters, but I even asked PFBC fisheries biologists if they had any research conducted on Spruce Run in the past, but nothing.

 

[bdhoover77]

The local pond where I take my kids to fish for bluegill does not have any fish big enough for me to want to catch. I would like to stock it with something cool that will put a nice bend in a fly rod. If I dump a bunch of snakeheads or trophy largemouth bass in the pond, that would add to the bioversity of the pond, right? I mean, it’s not like snakeheads or largemouth eat smaller fish, right? What’s a little invasive species introduction compared to hauling in a big fish, bruh!

 

[jifigz]

Okay, there is a lot going wrong with this thread.

I agree, stocking this stream seems like a silly idea; however, if the person follows all regulatory guidelines and is not breaking the law, he is really not doing anything wrong in the eyes of the law. I agree, it might have a negative effect on some native species that already reside there.

In my opinion, stocking the stream seems like a lackluster use of private resources. It may be neat as an experimental type of thing, but I still wouldn't do it.

Where is the closest stocked stream? Would the money that you would spend to develop your own stocked creek just be better spent on gasoline driving to your closest already existing stocked trout fishery?

Also, if Ninemile is right there just down the road, and you have already confirmed that it contains a population of wild browns, then why not just fish there?

Have you extensively fished Spruce Run? If not, you should before you even proceed. Fishing is not a great way of determining what is in there, but it is at least much better than walking along and hoping you see a trout. If you happen to find or catch a wild brown, then, once again, stocking seems silly because the trout are already there. If they are thriving, great, but if not, something is holding them back. So a stocked fishery would be a seasonal type of thing if that is the case and, really, what is the point of spending your own money to put fish in for a couple of months?

 

[bdhoover77]

Like I said, the watershed has already been affected by human presence-- forest has been cleared, homes built, waterways blocked. Not like anyone cares about the water right now anyways, at the very least I'm showing interest in it? Ive been trying to research the waters, but I even asked PFBC fisheries biologists if they had any research conducted on Spruce Run in the past, but nothing.

Look, it’s commendable that you are taking an interest in a local watershed. But rather than focusing on stocking, I think your energy could be better focused by volunteering with a local conversation effort. Maybe focus on improving the habitat and see if that leads to natural fish reproduction?

 

[KrsnaM]

The local pond where I take my kids to fish for bluegill does not have any fish big enough for me to want to catch. I would like to stock it with something cool that will put a nice bend in a fly rod. If I dump a bunch of snakeheads or trophy largemouth bass in the pond, that would add to the bioversity of the pond, right? I mean, it’s not like snakeheads or largemouth eat smaller fish, right? What’s a little invasive species introduction compared to hauling in a big fish, bruh!

Another thing to consider, there are several runs within a few miles of Spruce Run that have been noted by the PFBC to have natural trout spawning, which could imply that at one point, trout did indeed inhabit Spruce run

 

[bdhoover77]

Another thing to consider, there are several runs within a few miles of Spruce Run that have been noted by the PFBC to have natural trout spawning, which could imply that at one point, trout did indeed inhabit Spruce run

All the more reason to focus on actual conservation and trying to rehabilitate the watershed, rather than simply focusing on stocking trout. Just my opinion.

 

[KrsnaM]

Okay, there is a lot going wrong with this thread.

I agree, stocking this stream seems like a silly idea; however, if the person follows all regulatory guidelines and is not breaking the law, he is really not doing anything wrong in the eyes of the law. I agree, it might have a negative effect on some native species that already reside there.

In my opinion, stocking the stream seems like a lackluster use of private resources. It may be neat as an experimental type of thing, but I still wouldn't do it.

Where is the closest stocked stream? Would the money that you would spend to develop your own stocked creek just be better spent on gasoline driving to your closest already existing stocked trout fishery?

Also, if Ninemile is right there just down the road, and you have already confirmed that it contains a population of wild browns, then why not just fish there?

Have you extensively fished Spruce Run? If not, you should before you even proceed. Fishing is not a great way of determining what is in there, but it is at least much better than walking along and hoping you see a trout. If you happen to find or catch a wild brown, then, once again, stocking seems silly because the trout are already there. If they are thriving, great, but if not, something is holding them back. So a stocked fishery would be a seasonal type of thing if that is the case and, really, what is the point of spending your own money to put fish in for a couple of months?

Yeah, I have already hiked around a lot, and there is a small ecosystem. Lots of stoneflies, other aquatic bugs, some spawning creek chub and blacknose dace, some rusty crayfish (yes I know they're invasive), some spawning salamanders, and even an eastern ribbonsnake, I found sunbathing on a rock.

 

[jifigz]

Yeah, I have already hiked around a lot, and there is a small ecosystem. Lots of stoneflies, other aquatic bugs, some spawning creek chub and blacknose dace, some rusty crayfish (yes I know they're invasive), some spawning salamanders, and even an eastern ribbonsnake, I found sunbathing on a rock.

Lol. That didn't answer my question at all. First, go look for the presence of wild brown trout. You might not catch them, but that doesn't mean they aren't there. Better yet, have that organization do an electro-fishing project and look for them. That should be step #1.

 

[KrsnaM]

Lol. That didn't answer my question at all. First, go look for the presence of wild brown trout. You might not catch them, but that doesn't mean they aren't there. Better yet, have that organization do an electro-fishing project and look for them. That should be step #1.

What is an electro-fishing project? It sounds like a great idea to look for browns, but there aren't any signs of them in Spruce Run (idk I might just be dumb)

Ive tried fly fishing, using rod and reel, but nothin. Its honestly really eerily empty, almost like the area was abandoned, because there just seems to be so many places I would suspect fish to hide, deep pools with lots of cover in rocks.. Idk maybe I just gotta keep looking smh

 

[jifigz]

What is an electro-fishing project? It sounds like a great idea to look for browns, but there aren't any signs of them in Spruce Run (idk I might just be dumb)

Ive tried fly fishing, using rod and reel, but nothin. Its honestly really eerily empty, almost like the area was abandoned, because there just seems to be so many places I would suspect fish to hide, deep pools with lots of cover in rocks.. Idk maybe I just gotta keep looking smh

Just because you aren't catching brown trout does not mean that they aren't there.

I have streams that I know are loaded with brown trout, just absolutely packed full of em, and there are days I have been there and you would swear the stream is dead.

A few bad fishing trips tells you nothing about what is in the stream. You might not even see fish spook. Trout are extremely good at hiding if they want to.

 

[KrsnaM]

Just because you aren't catching brown trout does not mean that they aren't there.

I have streams that I know are loaded with brown trout, just absolutely packed full of em, and there are days I have been there and you would swear the stream is dead.

A few bad fishing trips tells you nothing about what is in the stream. You might not even see fish spook. Trout are extremely good at hiding if they want to.

Thanks, I think you are confused a little though:

Spruce Run is the place in the backyard of my new home in Bellevue. It is the place I say is empty and I have not found a single trout, bass, or any bigger fish.

Ninemile Run is the waters that they have been fixing up for many years now since it was used as a sewer runoff or something like that I forgot. I lived in squirrel hill and it was close access to me. They found brown trout in it while doing their survey and I've seen trout in it.

But what kinda tests could I do to see if there are trout? Im trynna think but I'm not sure still.

 

[jifigz]

Thanks, I think you are confused a little though:

Spruce Run is the place in the backyard of my new home in Bellevue. It is the place I say is empty and I have not found a single trout, bass, or any bigger fish.

Ninemile Run is the waters that they have been fixing up for many years now since it was used as a sewer runoff or something like that I forgot. I lived in squirrel hill and it was close access to me. They found brown trout in it while doing their survey and I've seen trout in it.

But what kinda tests could I do to see if there are trout? Im trynna think but I'm not sure still.

No, I am not confused at all. You said Spruce Run seems devoid of trout, and I said you can't form that opinion by walking along the stream or a few failed fishing attempts.

I don't think I have been confused at all throughout this whole thread, but maybe I am just too confused to realize it.....

You should have someone come in and do an electro-fishing survey.

 

[KrsnaM]

No, I am not confused at all. You said Spruce Run seems devoid of trout, and I said you can't form that opinion by walking along the stream or a few failed fishing attempts.

I don't think I have been confused at all throughout this whole thread, but maybe I am just too confused to realize it.....

You should have someone come in and do an electro-fishing survey.

it looks like a much more expensive route... I might just try to do more hiking around and wait until the summer I guess. Thanks though anyways.

 

[jifigz]

it looks like a much more expensive route... I might just try to do more hiking around and wait until the summer I guess. Thanks though anyways.

Dude, HIKING IS AN UNRELIABLE WAY TO TELL WHAT IS IN THE WATER. It does nothing for you other than gives you exercise.

yes, a cheap thermometer in July and August will tell you a lot about the capabilities of the stream.

 

[KrsnaM]

Dude, HIKING IS AN UNRELIABLE WAY TO TELL WHAT IS IN THE WATER. It does nothing for you other than gives you exercise.

yes, a cheap thermometer in July and August will tell you a lot about the capabilities of the stream.

lmao im sorry bro im 16 I don't have that kinda money haha, Im just trying get into this a little more, because I CANT EVEN DRIVE ANYWHERE WITHOUT MY DAD BRO. The backyard is low-key golden bc it has Spruce Run, ykwim, I just wish there were more fish maybe more activity. I try wading a lot, hoping to scare fish and see them run, I also use a net, but so far the only things Ive found/caught are minnow and creek chub. Plus im trynna use this as a subject for my high school long term project

 

[hemlock]

Lmao someone else moved my post to that thread, I posted this in the general forum... on top of that, yes, putting non native fish in the waters can have positive effects. Not only would it increase the stream diversity and competition, but like I said earlier, it could also gain the attraction of locals and help preserve the stream in general. There's like nothing big in the water dude, and of course I'm gonna wait till the summer to really determine if I'm gonna stock it or not, I just think it would be pretty badass. Aint gotta get so worked up over it haha

Hahaha what? Hoover said everything that needed to be said so I'll save myself time and won't retype it. Best of luck creating all those positive effects bruh!

 

[KrsnaM]

Hahaha what? Hoover said everything that needed to be said so I'll save myself time and won't retype it. Best of luck creating all those positive effects bruh!

thanks bruh!

 

[lycoflyfisher]

Brooooo, duuuude or however you want to be referred to as.....

Figure out some simple measurements you can do, you have mentioned stream width, depth, ph and temperature. Pick several accessible points along the stream, ie a bridge crossing, park, your back yard. Collect your measurements at the same location every month or every other week or as much as possible. Plot those results on a timeline and you have your high-school science project. Google the scientific method or monitoring stream temperature and you will get info on basic project design.

Keep it simple.