Santa is coming!

Why is the weight of the rod so important? A rod that balances correctly with the reel can be cast all day. I say this because a light rod will require a light reel ($$$) to balance the outfit properly and if not balanced, you arm will fatigue.

All my rods are a bit on the heavy side (several Winston WT's, several old glass rods and a few boo rods) but paired with the appropriate reel I can cast them all day with no fatigue. I just think you’re severely limiting your options if you are looking to get the lightest rod out there and light doesn’t necessarily translate to feel or ability to cast all day unless pair with the right reel.
 
GreenWeenie makes a great point and to further illustrate what he's talking about, here's my personal experience.

This past spring, I wanted a new rod for small streams, I was between the Orvis Superfine and the Sage TXL. I cast them both and went with the TXL. I am a Sage guy, but figured that I needed to cast a couple of rods to try out the different actions. The TXL is EXTREMELY light and to balance out that rod I had to get a very light reel. I own an Orvis Mid Arbor and that was just too heavy for it.

My advice to you is to go to your local fly shop, with your budget in mind and cast some different rods. What I may like, you may not. As has been said, with a $400 budget, you have PLENTY of great options to choose from!

Good luck and let us know what you go with!
 
the sage launch is cheap right now and will do everything u need it to , or maybe check out the used orvis zero gravitys ?
 
hey i just saw a guy has a 4wt sage rod for sale under the swap forum , the only thing about sage is their rods each come with an individual serial number and the warranty only applys to the original owner , sage will fix the rod if u send it in but for a fee and alot more than if u were the original owner, so take that for whats its worth
 
The Sage Launch is a great rod for the price, it's their entry level rod but I think they're wonderful. I don't believe that they made an 8'6 4wt though.

As far as the XP, amongst Sage fans, this is a pretty coveted rod and most were disappointed when they discontinued it. Cabelas struck a deal with them apparently and Sage made a limited run of them. I've had my eye on one for a while now :lol:
 
Thanks for all the unteresting info guys, really appreciate it. One rod that I have been researching today which looks nice is the St Croix Legend Elite at $420 , I know I read somewhere on this forum somone that had one ,it might have been Bruno?
 
atlantisboy911 wrote:
Heritage, is it really worth the extra money, its going for about $500 and according to the specs it is a bit heavier than some rods that don't cost quite as much.

Please tell me a about the rod, what makes it your favourite?
Click to expand...

As mentioned by g.w., absolute minimum weight has very little to do with the performance of the rod. Orvis might want you to think so, but it's just marketing. Balancing the rod with an appropriate weight reel is much more important. If you place the whole outfit on top of your finger at a 90 degree angle, it should balance somwhere on the front half of the grip. If it still tips forward with your finger at the very front of the grip, the reel is too light. Keep in mind that personal preference plays a large part in the "feel" and "balance" of a rod.

Not looking to bash Orvis, but their Helios uses a skeleton aluminum reelseat, with a carbon fiber insert. Yes, it's light, but it's also cheaper for them to use. Winston did a similar thing with the BIIx series, but at least they left the option of getting one of their nice reel seats and inserts if you so desire.

Appearance of the reel seat and insert is just window dressing in reality. The real measure of a rod is the performance of the blank - this is why I prefer the XP. Their butt sections are very stiff and powerful, but the tips are soft enough to load the rod in close. This makes a rod that can toss dries softly, yet has plenty of grunt in the lower sections to toss the big stuff. This combination makes the 486-4 XP the most accurate casting rod I've ever cast - it's like throwing darts. It's also very versatile. If I know I'll be throwing nothing but small dry flies, I'll take my Winston 8' 4wt TMF. If I know I'll be nymphing exclusively, I'll take my new Sage 99 4wt. If I don't know if I'll be chucking dries, nymphing, or throwing streamers, the 486-4 XP is my choice. It does it all.

This is just my personal opinion - lots of people will disagree. Choices are good. Find out what works for YOU, since your opinion is the only one that matters when it comes to your rod choice.
 
Jules

I have a 8/4 3wt Orvis, the next time we fish your welcome to try it, just to see if you like one!

PaulG
 
Sage XP Heritage Ed! U da man! My XP 9' 5wt is my favorite rod of all time! It casts 5' of flyline as well as 55' of flyline.

Atlantis, you really can't look through the catalogs and pick a rod based on it's weight. As Heritage said, those Orvis rods are built with very light components. You must cast a rod to get a feel for it. Look at this thread, I love the feel of Sage rods and so does Heritage Ed and Jaybo, while Greenweenie and Mr Chunk are Winston guys. We may kid each other about our rod choices like a Sage "broomstick" or a Winston "wet noodle" but the fact is it's an individual thing. After you try a bunch of rods, I'm sure one will have you name on it. Good luck on your search.
 
PaulG wrote:
Jules

I have a 8/4 3wt Orvis, the next time we fish your welcome to try it, just to see if you like one!

PaulG
Click to expand...

Isn't that rod 8'6" Paul?
 
Maurice wrote:
PaulG wrote:
Jules

I have a 8/4 3wt Orvis, the next time we fish your welcome to try it, just to see if you like one!

PaulG
Click to expand...

Isn't that rod 8'6" Paul?
Click to expand...

Maurice

I just knew you were going to ask that :)

PaulG
 
Thanks again to all.
 
HA, Afish or anyone who's cast one...thoughts on the 865-4 XP?
 
I agree with what Green said, excpet...About light rods limiting the reels you can get to match the rod(thus being expensive).

Get a BBS I they are extremely light weight for light rods and really dont cost that much for the quality you are getting.
 
jaybo41 wrote:
HA, Afish or anyone who's cast one...thoughts on the 865-4 XP?
Click to expand...


Jaybo41 - Never cast the 4pc version, but I did cast the 2pc - contrary to the norm, it actually felt a tiny bit softer to me than the 590 XP (yes, I liked it). I opted for the 9 footer for the extra reach for nymphing. Twice (I have a 2pc and a 4pc 590). The 590 is great for nymphing and can throw streamers like a 6wt, but it's a bit much for small dries like tricos and midges. Bigger dries (like sulphers & caddis) are right in the wheelhouse though. The 586 might be a better all around rod, especially if you fish small to mid size waters. YMMV......
 
I have a 590-4 XP. I've never cast the 8.5 5wt. I checked and see that Cabelas is out of stock of all but the 8.5 x 5 XPs. Angler's Pro Shop in Souderton, PA also bought a run of XPs from Sage. They have the 590-4 on sale for $499.99 (vs Cabelas @ $490).

http://estore.anglers-pro.com/cgi-bin/cat/09575.html

You can take a trip out there and cast one for yourself. About a 2hour drive from Hburg I would guess. Good luck.
 
Thanks guys, I apprecite your insight. I've actually been contemplating an 8'6 to add to the quiver to serve as an all purpose rod for everything from dries, to buggers. I've got the 9ft spectrum covered at this point. I may need to call the Cabelas in WV and take a ride south to check one out.

I know the Z-Axis replaced the XP, has anyone ever cast those that can share thoughts?
 
jaybo41 wrote:

I know the Z-Axis replaced the XP, has anyone ever cast those that can share thoughts?
Click to expand...

Before I bought my 590-4 XP, I bought a 590-4 Z-Axis. If I had never cast an XP, I'd probably still own it. It had a softer tip than the XP - it felt too wimpy for my tastes (but not as soft as the Winston BIIx).

Fortunately for me, I found a new 590-4 XP on closeout, so I bought that and sold the Z-Axis. I was lucky to find that XP at the time - most places didn't even discount that particular XP due to demand.
 
Although I'm a Winston guy, the Sage Z-Axis is really a sweet rod and I personally wouldn't hesitate to buy one. A friend of mine who guides on the Delaware and owns a bunch of rods (including an 8', 4 weight Winston BiiX, several T&T, more than a few Orvis rods) uses 2 rods - a 9 ', 6 weight Z-Axis for the D/bass fishing and an 8.5', 4 weight Z-Axis for everything else. His guide rod is a 9', 5 weight Sage Flight - also a really nice rod.
 
I agree, the Z-Axis is a great rod too. It casts very well off the tip close-in, but when compared to the XP, it lacks some of the power for longer casts and casting in the wind. Depending on your casting and fishing, it may suit you even better than the XP. The ZXL a little more towards a mid-flex rod, similar to the Winston BIIx. The TCX is a very fast long distance weapon. All these rods serve a purpose.

The thing that I like about the XP is that it casts well (for me) off tip close-in or clear across the river, with big wind resistant flies or small flies, using heavy weight or no weight, on a calm day or into a strong wind.
 
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