PA Trout Parks?

[PennKev]

Fishidiot wrote:
As this discussion continues to unfold, I think we should perhaps re-read and pay closer attention to the first part of Afishinado's original post...and focus less on the Missouri example:

What fun would that be?

 

[troutbert]

There is no indication that the PFBC is considering creating "trout parks."

See the original post. The first part, that actually quotes the PFBC, has discussions of stocking trophy trout to create an attraction for anglers. It doesn't say anything about creating "trout parks" or charging admission or anything like that.

It talks about stocking trophy trout. But that could just mean putting more big trout in DH areas and C&R areas.

(I wrote this before reading FishIdiot's post. He was writing basically the same thing as I was typing.)

Sensible is boring. I realize that.

So: TROUT PARKS!!! OH NO!!!

 

[afishinado]

So: TROUT PARKS!!! OH NO!!!

Lol....true enough. One would think that the PFBC would not have, or more precisely would not spend the funds to stock large trout and more frequently without some pay-to-play aspect.

The article mentioned some sort of proposal is in the offing this fall. All we can do is wait and see what develops; but here are the last two lines of the trout park article:

"The trout parks serve another of the MDC's primary purposes, as well. They are the best recruiters of new trout fishermen in this state."

I actually have no problem with the Trout Park or trophy trout (whatever they call it) concept if they are set up in marginal waters where wild trout cannot survive. They would be very popular. And if they could break even with some sort of fee, it would be win for the FBC.

 

[pcray1231]

There are private companies out there already providing these types of facilities. They are making a profit.

Yes, there are. I was taken to one many, many times as a kid. That particular one was Farnsworth Trout Club. Chicken wire at the bottom and top of the club water, private hatchery, they loaded a small stream with fish and an especially high % of larger fish.

Here's the thing. It wasn't full of mullet haired/shirtless men with a Marlboro red, PBR hat, and a stringer full of fish.

It was full of..... KIDS (though, granted, sometimes their parents were mullet haired, the last time I was there was in the 80's!).

And I'm not talking teenagers. We're talking 5-10 year olds here.

Look, groomed banks, tons of big fish, easy to catch, so that a kid can reel in a trophy and then take it home and brag to his grandparents? Yeah, this isn't a terrible tragedy. It's how you get kids into fishing. Once interested, those kids become teenagers who seek out more difficult situations.

I probably would support some sort of "must have kids with you" restriction in such places, though I'm not sure whether it's necessary or not since I feel it'd turn into that anyway. I just can't imagine adults enjoying this on their own. That said, I can't imagine adults hunting in deer farms that advertise a 100% success rate either, but they do. Maybe I have too much respect for the public?

 

[mr7183]

Does the PFBC have any incentive to stock more fish besides the assumption that more stocked fish = more license sales?

Seems like trout management should be a pretty easy process.
1. Maximize and optimize cold water / wild trout fisheries. Look to create new wild trout waters wherever possible (Lehigh!!!!).
2. Continue heavy stocking programs in many of the more marginal streams with flow / temp issues.

 

[geebee]

more larger fish doesn't necessarily mean more fish, it can and often does mean less.

there are private ponds and lakes stocked with a couple of hundred lunkers rather than thousands of cookie cutter trout.

these places typically have a one or two fish limit then C&R though some make you stop fishing and buy another ticket if you want to continue.

typically the trout are 5lbs - 14lbs.

i've tried it, not my thing really. but i do understand the attraction for some - escpailly if you are stalking them in clear water.

 

[Chaz]

Tigereye wrote:
I am by no means a Wild Trout Purist. In fact I couldn't tell you the last time I caught a wild trout, let alone targeted them.

However the issue is that the PFBC focuses all their resources and energy on stocked trout and less on stream management

My viewpoint comes from the management of the Lehigh River. Here is an opportunity to have a great self sustaining fishery that would cost fisherman ZERO dollars if managed correctly.

The Lehigh River fishery really isn't managed by anyone for the fishing. Sure PFBC stocks it, they stock it with just about everything they produce, but they don't manage the fishery because they can't without the flows required. The flows are managed for flood control and rafting, that's it. If you want a better fishery then tell it to ACE. That would be the Army Corps of Engineers.
It would make a good trout park.

 

[CRB]

How's that stream access situation working out for you?

Spread those problems to other places in the state?

No, thanks.

Have to say they did a pretty good job of gathering what they could at the time. But, now they need to start upping the anti. From Rt20 to the the lake on elk only a small 1/4 mile posted. Not bad it would have been much worse without the stamp.

 

[Acristickid]

Well, here in the western PA we want our fair share. We ain't got not limestone streams? What will become of us?

I don't chase stockies for the most part. I'm not against stocking for most streams except those that support wild trout but that's a tall order here in trout purgatory.

So I do support stocking less trout but bigger ones because that's what it seems what they want. Give them want they want. I am not against of filling the ditches around here to give them what they desire. But leave the wild trout alone. They are harder to catch anyway. Stupid America.

 

[Trico3]

No offense to those that enjoyed it, but back in the 1990's when I fished at the Ditch on Big Spring, it kind of had the feel of a trout park. You could see the large trout from the road when you were driving in to the parking lot. If you were looking for solitude, that was not the place for it!

 

[Stevie-B]

I grew in Missouri and learned to trout fish at these parks. The best fishing was usually outside the parks.

Now, can anyone name all the trout streams in Missouri? You would need less than two hands to count them. This is the reason the parks exist, there are more trout fisherman than trout streams. So, if you want to fish for trout in MO you go to one of the parks. The hatcheries are on site to minimize transportation coast as well.

As far as implementing a similar type park in PA, a significant piece(s) of high quality streams would need to "converted" which I would not endorse.

 

[krayfish2]

Yeah, 'the ditch' (80's - mid 90's) was the closest thing I've ever seen to a trout park. As much as I hate the idea, that was a sick place to fish.

 

[brookieaddict]

How about a nice grassy lawn , no trees, ffo,cold beer,and someone to throw your fly out, all you have to do is pass the pole to your pole boy, he'll bring the fish in take a pic, release or cook the fish and, repeat. LOL

 

[Sylvaneous]

1) this is what Fisherman's Paradise was.
2) Add no-kill and FF only regs, and this is the Little Lehigh below the hatchery: the Kiddie Pool and the next few slow spots below
3) Why not have people pay to catch fish out of a raceway? We have many hatcheries. They are all enclosed in security fencing. Spring creek has a big, closed hatchery. If they want more $$$, then maybe send some water through 1 raceway above the Paradise from like April to June, when there won't be issues with unwanted warming. Bring the people to the fish instead of the other way around.
4) A person killing a few stocked fish has already exhausted the cost of their trout stamp. If anything like this happens, it can't be everything the same with some special, big fish thrown in. That won't save money or make money. It will waste money.
I think this is something of the impulse in the idea to bring bait to DHLO and let kids harvest early, or whatever they think. That is tapping a paid-for resource, kind of "C&R and C& Kill" on the same fish. That doesn't work anywhere besides in accounting schemes, and it doesn't even work there.

The Fish Commision has a lot of good people in it, but it so frequently does not do the right thing.

Sylvaneous.

 

[dryflyguy]

I remember reading about the old Fisherman's Paradise in one of George Harvey's book.
And he was of the opinion that the fish commission could - and SHOULD - bring it back. Put in some dams to make more holding water, and stock large fish.

My first thought was - NAHHH.
But after I thought about it awhile, maybe that wouldn't be such a bad idea after all.
I probably wouldn't fish there. But it would likely take some of the pressure off of the rest of the stream

 

[ValleyBrown]

dryflyguy wrote:
I remember reading about the old Fisherman's Paradise in one of George Harvey's book.
And he was of the opinion that the fish commission could - and SHOULD - bring it back. Put in some dams to make more holding water, and stock large fish.

My first thought was - NAHHH.
But after I thought about it awhile, maybe that wouldn't be such a bad idea after all.
I probably wouldn't fish there. But it would likely take some of the pressure off of the rest of the stream

These are pretty much my thoughts. Sell a "trophy trout stamp" to fish in these places. It would help relieve pressure and maybe even generate some extra revenue. Cut down on stocking in certain places where 500 fish are dumped in one holding spot and re-allocate those fish to the trout park. To me the difference between catching a 20" stocked rainbow and a 25" stocked rainbow is none. Take the bigger fish to the trout park.

 

[troutbert]

dryflyguy wrote:
I remember reading about the old Fisherman's Paradise in one of George Harvey's book.
And he was of the opinion that the fish commission could - and SHOULD - bring it back. Put in some dams to make more holding water, and stock large fish.

My first thought was - NAHHH.
But after I thought about it awhile, maybe that wouldn't be such a bad idea after all.
I probably wouldn't fish there. But it would likely take some of the pressure off of the rest of the stream

Here in Centre County I've heard several people saying that they would like to bring back the "glory days" on Fishermans Paradise. But there are also many here who would oppose it. The stretch is Class A wild trout, and by a wide margin.

It would be quite a "trout war" if that was ever proposed.