Nothing is sacred

[simplefish]

I stopped by my favorite wild trout stream in the eastern corner of Berks county to fish while on a extended lunch break. I started working my way upstream, and noticed a small dead 4" brown. Another few feet upstream, a second dead small brownie. I started to worry about the health of the stream, until I walked another 50 feet and saw the culprit: a blue plastic worm container with dirt still in it and a nightcrawler ripped in half lying on top. I don't fish ATW waters becasue I can't stand to see trash and fishing line all over the place. It's bad enough to think of what these neanderthal bait fishers do to the ATW streams, now they are doing it to my favorite stretch of water. This stream isn't stocked, nor is it even on the Class A list. I can only imagine what will happen to this stream once word gets out to the "bait" fishing public that there are some nice trout in it. It makes me madder than hell to think of those beautiful wild "keepers" being tossed into a frying pan. What a waste of a great resource.

 

[jayL]

"Neanderthal bait fishers"?

With all due respect, you sound like a real ***.

 

[GreenWeenie]

Sorry, anyone who litters is a Neanderthal. What’s so difficult about taking your trash with you or is that too much effort?

Don’t sweat it simplefish, say anything on this board that remotely associates “bait/spin fishermen” with “slob/pig” and you’ll be crucified.

 

[jayL]

Agreed.

But to pass a sweeping generalization of all bait fishers is acting like an ***, and perpetuates the stupid artificial rivalry with bait fishermen that fly fishermen love to think exists. It's just fishing!

Simplefish could have said "neanderthal litterers" and it would have been fine. Instead, the low road was taken. The crucifixion is totally justified. It's no different than racism.

I've said it before... "most litterers may bait fish, but most bait fishermen do not litter". To not be able to make that distinction is simply pathetic.

 

[simplefish]

Well then, I guess I am an ***. Have you ever noticed the correlation between baitfishers and streamside garbage? How many tippet spools, leader packages, or floatant containers have you ever seen lying on the ground at a class A stream? How many fish have you killed this year by gut hooking with a size 14 hook? I would like to think that most of us FFers have a little more respect for our environment. If getting upset about that kind of stuff makes me an ***, then Im the biggest one in the bunch.

 

[mike_richardson]

i agree. with jayl. you do sound very ignorant. I fish with people who use bait all of the time. My family and i will never knowingly drop litter into a stream. I find that we will take garbage bags to clean it up as well. Most of them are your DUMB BAIT FISHERMAN. And i am positive that nothing has ever accidently fell out of your vest into a stream and you didnt notice "RIGHT!". Or never once saw litter at flyfisherman's paradise huh. Maybe the Bait fisherman took his kid to introduce him to the sport because he lived close by and only had a few min after work to take him fishing. Did you think of that.

You need to think before you go shooting your mouth off. The reason you see more litter from bait fisherman is because there are more of them on the stream. When you post things like that it turns people away from fly fishing. What gives you the right to that stream Why dont they name it after you. Honestly they should. ;-)

 

[jayL]

Correlation does not imply causation. You're stereotyping, and yes, it does make you an ***.

 

[simplefish]

Thanks for the reassurance GreenWeenie. I didn't want to start a debate on the baitfisher stereotype, I just felt like I needed to vent about what I saw. I upset me, thats that.

 

[jayL]

Understandably so, but there is no need to publicly make broad, disparaging generalizations about a group that contains an awful lot of dedicated conservationists.

 

[mike_richardson]

Smart thing to say. Hope they call the stream Simplefish Creek Bro.

 

[LouM]

simple fish; I'am with you I fish a lot of open water and the trash left behind by the baiters is deplorable. I talked with the WCO for northampton and he told me he nails them when he catches them , he also said he doesn't have the problem on FFo or with fly fishers. How many baiters belong to TU or help TU or other organizations do stream work or stream clean up, you can bet your a$$ not many. All they do is abuse the resource, except for a few.

 

[Bruno]

Wow - I bet you all have been "bait chuckers" in your time.

 

[simplefish]

You need to think before you go shooting your mouth off. The reason you see more litter from bait fisherman is because there are more of them on the stream. When you post things like that it turns people away from fly fishing. What gives you the right to that stream Why dont they name it after you.


This quite honestly might be the dumbest comment I have ever read on this website, and the exact reason why I stopped visiting this site for a long time, and after I am done typing this, I am going to delete myself as a member. Jay and Mike, who the hell elected you two to be the PC spokespeople for PAFF? I think it's funny how people like you jump all over anyone who has an opinion other than your own. I used to like this site back when I first joined, and learned a lot from it, but now I feel much differently about it. I will continue to flyfish, and pick up trash left by your buddies, but that does not mean I have to like it.

Ryan

 

[jayL]

LouM wrote:
you can bet your a$$ not many.

You just lost your a$$. There are plenty of conservation-minded anglers that bait fish, and MANY of them eventually turn to fly fishing, if not for miserable something or others like you turning them off to it.

 

[GreenWeenie]

My family and i will never knowingly drop litter into a stream. I find that we will take garbage bags to clean it up as well. Most of them are your DUMB BAIT FISHERMAN. And i am positive that nothing has ever accidently fell out of your vest into a stream and you didnt notice "RIGHT!".

Accidently falling into the water and deliberately leaving crap streamside can't even be compared.

Maybe the Bait fisherman took his kid to introduce him to the sport because he lived close by and only had a few min after work to take him fishing. Did you think of that

Huh?????? So does this mean if you fish for 1 minute you can leave 100lbs of trash behind, 2 minutes 50lbs, 4 minutes 4lbs, 8 minutes, 25lbs, etc.? What does the amount of time have anything to do with leaving trash behind? I would think the first thing would be teaching his kid to PICK UP AFTER HIMSELF!

 

[jayL]

If your opinion is going to allow you to disparage a large group of people based on the actions of a few, then yeah, you deserve it.

How is it different than racism? You're passing negative judgement on an entire group due to your incorrect assumptions about them. It's people that act like that that cause 95% of the problems in the world. I'd rather deal with litter than bigots.

 

[tomgamber]

"I think it's funny how people like you jump all over anyone who has an opinion other than your own."

You just did the same thing. Quit being a crybaby and accept that when you post something publicly you can expect it to be criticized publicly. You can take your ball and go home if you like but it'd be your loss. Sites like this need different points of view. I respect yours. I may not agree with it but I respect it and I reserve the right make public my comments when I don't agree with yours. Its all good.

 

[NoMoreCornChuckin]

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

 

[GreenWeenie]

Oh, I started as a garden hackle (worm) guy when I was 12 years old, a long time ago. The first thing my father bought me was a metal worm box that you put on your belt. The reason, so you’re not bringing a container streamside.

Not difficult.

 

[jayL]

GreenWeenie wrote:
Oh, I started as a garden hackle (worm) guy when I was 12 years old, a long time ago. The first thing my father bought me was a metal worm box that you put on your belt. The reason, so you’re not bringing a container streamside.

Not difficult.

Yet you fail to understand why claiming that using bait makes you a "neanderthal" is ridiculous?

It's littering that's the issue. Simplefish had to shoot his mouth off and put a whole group down for no good reason. He didn't say litterers. He said people that use bait. Unacceptable.

Simplefish,

I'd imagine you don't really think that way about all that use bait, and just shot off about it. If you really mean litterers, then say it. A simple apology to the very numerous non-littering bait fishermen of the world, and that's that.