My SIMMS Warranty Experience

[mute]

Wow so many posts to quote. Without a better multi quote system going to just generically address them all.

Clarification: I definitely got alot of years \ outings from my G3s, no complaints there.

I am however put off with how Simms shows no loyalty or care for the people that buy their product. "No we dont offer any discount for you on another pair of G4s even if you've supported us for the last 10 years". Me no longer supporting them means nothing to them, but when you're the top dog in the business, you have the popularity, the product sells, you dont need to care about the peons.

The fitment comments make the most sense. I have put on a few pounds in the past few years compared to when I bought them. And they were originally bought more with a tighter streamlined fit VS baggy.

I just picked up the Orivs Pros from $499 so will give them a shot. Granted its taken a face value, Orvis themselves told me they put customer satisfaction first and will gladly offer me a discount on another pair of if I wear these waders our to exhaustion over the next few years.

I tried them on and was expecting to be a Large Short or Large regular based on their sizing chart. However I opted for the extra 2" of inseam which landed me a Large Long because when bending down in the Large regular the fit streamlined, and probably was OK but i could tell there was tension on the crotch.

Even though they use a new gusseted crouch I wanted to make sure there was no tension on the seam when bending down, etc. And the Large Long fit perfect. I believe they are also already form fitting so going up a bit made sense to even it out.

I will say the fabric did feel very stiff\solid. While there was a sense of slight hardy mobility in them im not particularly trying to make it sound like a bad thing. The texture of the Cordoba also felt gore-texy. So we will see how they perform.

And as far as the discussion i see about buying waders based on using alcohol to be able to see pin holes seems past silly to me. why would i want to spend time, spraying alcohol all over my waders, wading for a discoloration to appear so i know where to squeeze aqua seal? Get a flashlight like i did and it takes all of 5 seconds to find the holes. AND my rechargable batteries are free, unlike my refillable alcohol spray bottle.

 

[Swattie87]

Not trying to be a jerk here, legitimately trying to understand. Maybe I’m the one looking at this wrong?

Why do you feel a company owes you a discount on a replacement product when you acknowledge yourself that you “got a lot of years/outings” from the product, had “no complaints” and plan to “wear them out to exhaustion”? Those would all seem indicative to me (and the company you’re seeking a discount from) that you were satisfied with the product and felt you got your money’s worth. If you didn’t feel like you got your money’s worth, yeah go ahead and ask for a discount/replacement.

I’d argue Simms did do right by you by providing you with a good product that lasted a long time (beyond most reasonable lifespan expectations for the type of product) and you got years of enjoyment from. I’d think they’ve earned your loyalty based on that and you’d WANT to purchase their products again. If the waders (at that price point) took a dump after a year or two and you were disappointed in their performance, and they didn’t offer you some type of solution, I’d understand it better I guess.

Are you talking more along the lines of a customer loyalty discount? Customer loyalty discounts, outside of maybe new automobile purchases, just aren’t that common. Certainly not from large scale FFing product companies.

I buy Toyota’s, because I think they’re well built and they last a long time. When I wear one out, and I’ve been happy with it, and enjoyed using it for 200 or 300k miles, I don’t see why I should expect Toyota to give me another one. Sometimes they have a $500 or $1k customer loyalty promo going, sometimes they don’t. But if they don’t, I certainly don’t go across the street and buy a Dodge. (Sorry any Mopar fans.)

 

[ryansheehan]

I don't think I agree with you mute. If a company sells you a top notch product that's what they plan on keeping you as a customer. Out of curiosity how tall are you? My previous orvis waders were a large long, wondering how these fit.

 

[mute]

Swattie87 wrote:
Not trying to be a jerk here, legitimately trying to understand. Maybe I’m the one looking at this wrong?

Why do you feel a company owes you a discount on a replacement product when you acknowledge yourself that you “got a lot of years/outings” from the product, had “no complaints” and plan to “wear them out to exhaustion”? Those would all seem indicative to me (and the company you’re seeking a discount from) that you were satisfied with the product and felt you got your money’s worth. If you didn’t feel like you got your money’s worth, yeah go ahead and ask for a discount/replacement.

I’d argue Simms did do right by you by providing you with a good product that lasted a long time (beyond most reasonable lifespan expectations for the type of product) and you got years of enjoyment from. I’d think they’ve earned your loyalty based on that and you’d WANT to purchase their products again. If the waders (at that price point) took a dump after a year or two and you were disappointed in their performance, and they didn’t offer you some type of solution, I’d understand it better I guess.

Are you talking more along the lines of a customer loyalty discount? Customer loyalty discounts, outside of maybe new automobile purchases, just aren’t that common. Certainly not from large scale FFing product companies.

I buy Toyota’s, because I think they’re well built and they last a long time. When I wear one out, and I’ve been happy with it, and enjoyed using it for 200 or 300k miles, I don’t see why I should expect Toyota to give me another one. Sometimes they have a $500 or $1k customer loyalty promo going, sometimes they don’t. But if they don’t, I certainly don’t go across the street and buy a Dodge. (Sorry any Mopar fans.)

No offense taken. They definitely don't owe me anything, which is fine. Just like I'm not forced to buy their product, which is also fine.

I'm not sure how we're determining whats a "good product" and whats a "long time". Theres so many variables that alter that its entirely subjective. 500 outing in one year vs 100 outings over 15 years vs treating them like glass vs treating them like garbage. I don't know if they were used to exhaustion or not, by anyones standards. No noe can say if the seams started going because im fitting 200lbs of fat in a 100lb bag or if they just decided to start going. But what I do know is i treated them like glass, i delt with the pin holes all down the seams when they started appearing and aqua sealed the **** out of them. But when the booties started leaking there was nothing more i felt like i could do about it except ship them back and assume they would simply replace the booties for me for some fee to get X more outings out of them. Which i specifically said in my comments was my only concern of the waders that i felt was not up to par. The booties did not have serparating seems, nor tears, nor pin holes that i cold find. but they would dampening my socks.

I didn't expect them to spray the entire set of waders with Flexseal and tell me they were all fixed. Nor did I expect them to send me a brand new set free of charge. But what I did expect was some respect, loyalty, actual customer service.

Instead you get "Because we cannot repair them to our degree of satisfaction we are going to have to send them back to you, have a great day!" They didnt smell like a trash bag. They wernt tan waders that were now black. But just because you see Ive already repaired the **** out them dont let that be a cop out reason and not replace the booties which doesn't change or negatively affect any of the previously repaired seams that I did myself.


Yes I am talking about customer loyalty discounts. I bought the waders hearing that they did that. Which being a company of that size, profit margin and popularity i honestly expected to be shown some sort of respect come $550 dollars to them every few years. Redington offers the loyality, Orvis ive "heard" offers the loyality, I think you get my point.

Regardless it doesn't matter what my experience was, its just my experience. Ill try Orvis and see what happens. I expect them to last the same amount of outings if not more. And if not, ill see if their moto and pleasant conversations i've had with the crew at the local store show to hold up. I feel like thats one thing going for anyone in that direction, a local brick and mortar dealing. And if **** does hit the fan or its all the same or worse, then ill cross them off the list and its probably worth exploring cheaper companies offerings around the $300 range until you find the line of quality abuse to price ration with the side benefit of loyality and customer service.


Dont ever buy a dodge, ever!

 

[mute]

ryansheehan wrote:
I don't think I agree with you mute. If a company sells you a top notch product that's what they plan on keeping you as a customer. Out of curiosity how tall are you? My previous orvis waders were a large long, wondering how these fit.

Im 5'10. Id say im on the short, stocky side. When i get a moment ill take a few pictures of me in the Simms G3 M and the Orvis Pro L Long if it maybe helps you in anyway closer determine what you should get.

I will say, the Orvis Pro Large Regular fit my dimensions to the T. But when i knelt down with one knee and felt the crotch tighten up I knew I should probably get the lon gversion to be safe. While a little baggier in the length now and around the legs, i think ill take the slight bagginess over possibly over stretching them for the remaining future use of them.

I do believe the Orvis Pros are designed with a slimmer taper over all anyway, so going up one size ( in my case just length here) probably helped compensate correctly

 

[JohnPowers]

I don't expect much consideration for failure from normal use. 300 trips Simms provided a good wader and I wouldn't expect anything although I'd send them back and cop a plea. My experience with both Simms and orvis arose from identical production and lack of quality control In China. Walking out of Buckingham last year my friend told me both my heels were loose of the soles from the heel to the arch. Same thing happened to the Orvis boots a few years before. Not a dozen trips on the Simms boots. Both companies sent me new boots. That type of adhesive failure is inexcusable and made me long for my old Weinbrenner Gary Borgers with actual sewn on soles. They’re both great companies but if you want lifetime warrantee you have to buy a Martin Guitar.

 

[ryansheehan]

Mute, I just reread your post about how you find holes and I think I understand why you aqua sealed every seam. The flashlight trick only works in the neoprene booties, not the lightweight wader material. The light will go through every seam even if it is water tight.

 

[Sylvaneous]

T

ryansheehan wrote:
I never understood wearing jeans under waders, thought that only flat brimmers did that :lol:

THere is that group that hunts in white high-top sneakers.
Cotton, for THESE purposes, is junk. But I have a hunting friend who wears cotton junk. Heavy, thick, streaches out, isn't really warm. My brother too. I bought him Terramar tops and bottoms for a few Christmases and he's just AMAZED at how they work. Not like I didn't have that kind of stuff for 30 years, and good socks, starting with Filsons in the early 90's.
Like....how do you not know? You don't like 'warm and dry'?

You gotta just acknowledge and move on.

 

[hunter1]

When I hunted, My base layer was silk or polyester top and bottoms. Wool hunting pants then swithed to a complete Gore tex winter outfit. Wool shirt. gore tex insulated hunting gloves, and a wool hat. Never felt cold. Butvto bulky for FF. I did start of with a PA tuxedo, loved them, just kept changing the size's as I got older. They were warm and cool looking.

 

[PennKev]

mute wrote:
"No we dont offer any discount for you on another pair of G4s even if you've supported us for the last 10 years". Me no longer supporting them means nothing to them, but when you're the top dog in the business, you have the popularity, the product sells, you dont need to care about the peons.

If you buy a pair of waders every ten years, how much are really SUPPORTING them?

 

[mute]

Well between the boots, overpriced flannels and all the other gear...alot.

 

[mute]

ryansheehan wrote:
Mute, I just reread your post about how you find holes and I think I understand why you aqua sealed every seam. The flashlight trick only works in the neoprene booties, not the lightweight wader material. The light will go through every seam even if it is water tight.

I would tend to agree, but i just put my light up to every seam in my Orvis Pro waders and could not get seepage. Did the same with the Simms and where i aquasealed them the seepage was there, every other part of hte seems it wasnt.

Anyway, this may help you showing the fit difference between Simms G3 Medium and Orvis Pro Large Long. Im 5'10" 200lbs


https://fishyintentions.com/2021/02/11/simms-g3-vs-orvis-pro-waders/