Marcellus Ignorance

[ryanh]

I teach an environmental pollution class at the local Penn State branch and our semester project will revolve around a debate concerning the Marcellus gas issue.

Considering that we are smack in the epicenter I find it odd and alarming about the complete ignorance of my students in relation to this crucial topic. I would suggest that their familiarity reflects on the population at large.

To make matters worse they are drilling wells literally on the banks of our public water supply.

 

[bikerfish]

you can probably teach some of us a few things as well!! good to hear about your project, hope it goes well(pun!) for you.
I believe this will be THE most important envronmental concern that we will be dealing with for the next 30 years. really has the chance to screw things up and set us back 100 years.
our new governor won't be helping matters.
like one protester said, we can't drink money

 

[Maurice]

Ryan, good to see you back here. Wondered what happened to you....you can spend hours reading the stuff you missed over the last 6-12 months here regarding the Marcy Shale.

Welcome Back.

 

[jayL]

I see the same thing. Around here, all most people know is what they've heard from they "dey taxin our jerbs away" gas lobby ads on the radio.

 

[troutbert]

ryanh wrote:
I teach an environmental pollution class at the local Penn State branch and our semester project will revolve around a debate concerning the Marcellus gas issue.

Considering that we are smack in the epicenter I find it odd and alarming about the complete ignorance of my students in relation to this crucial topic. I would suggest that their familiarity reflects on the population at large.

To make matters worse they are drilling wells literally on the banks of our public water supply.

What's your location? And which water supply are they drilling next too?

I'm a little surprised that people who live in the area don't know. You can see the wells, the land clearing, the trucks, etc. And the people I know who live in those areas seem to talk about nothing else but Marcellus. Of course they are all flyfishing TU members...

 

[osprey]

Ryan.....as an educator take the oppertunity to enlighten and envigorate as many young folks as you can , vigilance can start with your classroom and spread from there , grassroots=classroots , you are in a perfect position to prompt interest in the ones who will have to live with any consequences. GO GET EM RY !!!!!

 

[tomgamber]

I think the ignorance is related to the demographics of the audience. 18-25 might not know much. Anyone who owns land is pretty up on it. The old timers who have had camps for decades and are frequent to the state forest where these are popping up like dandelions are reading everything they can get their hands on.

I see bad things in the future. I don't want to. I'd like to believe that this could be done with the least impact possible. But I don't. You wouldn't see Alaska or Texas not drill for oil or Kentucky, WV or Pa not mine coal with all the money at stake and this is going to happen whether we lie it or not.

But we must be vigilant. It must be regulated. (sorry, small gov't guys but you aren't gonna be able to police this without legislation) and Violators MUST be held accountable.

These aren't vertical wells. They can drill these things miles from waterways and still reach them horizontally. Its the well water I am most concerned with.

 

[osprey]

ryan.........Man your timing is unreal!!! A friend of mine who is a beginner fly fisher , who is in that stage where you hear fishing related conversation or news you perk up and try to pay attention , was at my home Thursday morning asking if i heard about a drilling incident that resulted in a fishkill , he said he saw something briefly on the local news and they were interviewing a TU guy , i can't find anything and i've run out of places to look. Talk about ignorance , an accident occured somewhere in Pa within a short time ago , a fishkill (trout he said) resulted , TU was being interviewed in relation to it and i can't find anything in the form of info about where or what or who or how , now THAT is ignorant , or a cover-up.

 

[JackM]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the actually drilling procedure for the typical MS well, with horizontal fracking, does not take very long. That is, minus surface site preparation, once they put the drill to the earth, the well itself can be drilled and capped in weeks, not months or years.

So why can't we have on-site, round the clock regulator supervision? Why can't we require strict monitoring of the environment while the drilling, fracking, casing and capping process is underway. Can't there be procedure for drilling "test" bores that would probe the final bore route to determine whether critical geological structures/features will be disturbed or contaminated? Will there be a law or regulation giving the government the right to HALT drilling, and require immediately remediation of any damage if test bores prove that a full well might be too risky to the environment?

Are any of these regulations in effect now? Will it cost some money to beef up our regulatory oversight? Where will this money come from? From the mouths of poor people or from the pockets of the folks that are about to make a killing in this industry? Too many Qs for my feeble brain.

 

[bikerfish]

why can't we have that Jack? because the gas companies call the shots. they are in the pockets of any politicians involved. they have donated millions of dollars to both parties. hell, cheny got the clean water act changed.
they don't want us watching them. they don't care about our state, our health, our future. they only care about the money. they want our gas as cheap and easy as they can get it. they could give a $#t what we have to live with 30 years from now.

 

[JackM]

Hopefully all who care will hold their state reps' feet to the fire. You wanted this group, you got them. Now make them do what is right and just. Not every "politician" was bought off. Trust me, there are many good ones. But they're human just like us and they will hear the loudest voices.

 

[osprey]

JackM , I read in TROUT magazine that in Pa the number of permits issued already would require the existing group of inpectors to inspect nine wells a day seven days a week 365 days a year , the lack of inspectors is in my opinion what requires OUR vigilance , perhaps if they come up with a tax they can increase the inspection workforce with part of the tax $. In the meantime it's pretty much up to us to keep an eye on any and all operations we can and report them to authorities when we have to. To address the question about how long it takes to drill , it varies from well to well , the horizontal part is what takes the most time , the one operation i watched on rt 30 the drilling rig was there about 6 weeks , the one we watched on Little Paint Creek the rig was there about three months.

 

[JackM]

"Pennsylvania Gov.-elect Tom Corbett announced the leaders of his transition team Wednesday as he prepares to take over the governorship Jan. 18 from current Gov. Ed Rendell. Corbett named Christine Toretti, Jack Barbour and Bill Sasso as co-chairs of the transition team.

Toretti is chairman and CEO of S.W. Jack Drilling Co. in Indiana, Pa. and one of Pennsylvania's delegates to the Republican National Committee."

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2010/11/gov-elect_tom_corbett_names_hi.html

"Leading the list of natural gas industry donors between 2001 and 2010 is S.W. Jack Drilling, Indiana, Pa., the largest privately held land-based drilling company in the U.S. with $1,002,000 in contributions."

http://www.sungazette.com/page/content.detail/id/546725.html

 

[pratt]

JackM wrote:
"Pennsylvania Gov.-elect Tom Corbett announced the leaders of his transition team Wednesday as he prepares to take over the governorship Jan. 18 from current Gov. Ed Rendell. Corbett named Christine Toretti, Jack Barbour and Bill Sasso as co-chairs of the transition team.

Toretti is chairman and CEO of S.W. Jack Drilling Co. in Indiana, Pa. and one of Pennsylvania's delegates to the Republican National Committee."

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2010/11/gov-elect_tom_corbett_names_hi.html

"Leading the list of natural gas industry donors between 2001 and 2010 is S.W. Jack Drilling, Indiana, Pa., the largest privately held land-based drilling company in the U.S. with $1,002,000 in contributions."

http://www.sungazette.com/page/content.detail/id/546725.html

what place does a drilling co. CEO have on a public government transition team?? what makes me sick regarding this is the outright arrogance of Corbett to just shove it in our faces...totally disgusting.

 

[jayL]

Color me unsurprised. This is what happens when the republicans run the table in an election.

 

[osprey]

UNREAL......A friend who is out of work went for an interview at Haliburton in Indiana about a month ago , Sperry which is a subsidiary of Haliburton is putting up a huge warehouse somewhere near Indiana to supply drilling ops with the tools of the trade which include some chemicals like benzine that are just downright nuts to shoot into the groundwater.

 

[JackM]

A worthwhile investment for all anglers under the circumstances:

 

[osprey]

They'll get no lube assistance from me , if they want mine they are gonna have to take it , and not without a fight.

 

[NCPAtrtbum]

I made a trip up to camp this past week to fish slate/cedar runs and sat down in a bar one evening after a day on the water. Two guys came walking in and right away I knew why they were there just by hearing the accents (texas).. so I got to talking with the both of them and the one guy told me that they just bring people in from everywhere regardless of experience in the gas drilling industry, I found that quite disturbing.

A friend of mine who has a camp not too far from mine told me a couple months ago he was up and in the same bar he overheard these gas workers telling this one old couple "I'm just going to apologize now because after were done this place won't look the same, I've been on sites like this and they just completely destroy everything on the drilling pad and w/e is around it."

I really wish there was a way to stop this completely because in 10-15 years were gonna look back and think.. how the hell did we let this happen.

 

[JackM]

I was joking about the lube, but I think we need to make our government monitor this carefully and place the cost of being careful and careless on those people who wish to pursue riches in the industry. I am not anti-drilling. I am "anti-drilling-without-heavy-regulation" and certain financial assurances of the ability to FULLY remediate any environmental damage.

And this does not mean go ahead and damage things as long as you repair them, it must mean do not damage things in the first place or the financial gain you expect will evaporate. Business knows one thing: profit. Their ability to profit must be tied directly to an ability to sink the wells without harming the environment. We MUST not let it be economically feasible to harm the environment and then skirt on remediation.