bingsbaits
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Started on a wild Brookie stream that runs through the family farm. Mr. Whoopie set the way back machine to 1966.
nymphingmaniac
Well-known member
troutbert,
I thought a large portion of upper BE was class B? I could be wrong.
Did not consider Lakes.
I thought a large portion of upper BE was class B? I could be wrong.
Did not consider Lakes.
T
troutbert
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I think the populations are quite low. I'm guessing that it's Class D. But if you find any reports on the surveys, I'd love to see it.
I've fished "upper" BE some for stocked trout and for smallmouth and have never caught a wild trout there. But I've mostly fished not that far above Milesburg.
A friend said that there are some wild trout below where certain tribs come in, further up. But I think the overall populations are low.
The flow gets extremely low because it is a pure freestoner. No limestone aquifer at all in that valley. And the water gets quite warm, over 80F. There are decent numbers of smallmouth, where you can find a decent pool.
The stream is totally transformed by the influx of Spring Creek. In midsummer when upper BE is low, about 95% of the flow below the confluence is coming from Spring Creek.
You can see this by looking at the USGS gauges for Spring Creek near Milesburg, then at the BE gauge just below Milesburg. When flows are low there is very little difference between the numbers. Which is because only a trickle is coming down from upper BE, even though that is quite a long, large valley, with numerous tribs.
The geology is shale and sandstone and it just stores very little water.
C
Canoetripper
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I caught my first trout when I was a six year old boy. It was a native brook trout in a tributary to Mountain Creek near Pine Grove Furnace in the South Mountains of Cumberland County, PA. The creek is no bigger than a sidewalk and I crawled up to it on my stomach with my grandfather. I had his fly rod with a piece of worm on the hook.
The first trout I ever caught on a fly was at a dude ranch in Wyoming on Sunlight Creek with my grandfather. I was a ten year old boy. I forget if it was a native cutthroat or a brook trout. Brook trout are not native in the Rocky Mountains as I have learned educating myself on trout and trout fishing just like everyone else on the board.
I caught plenty of brook trout at that dude ranch. They could have been stocked, or by that point wild. I was too young to know or care. I was having too much fun. The fly that caught them all whether they were brook or cutthroat trout was a humpy.
I have since learned that the stocking of brook trout over native cutthroats is not popular in the Rocky Mountains. I understand the points made by others on this thread about stocking over native/wild reproducing trout.
I probably spent most of my boyhood opening days with my father on the FFO section on Clark's Creek in Dauphin County. My parents live close to the Frying Pan and Roaring Forks rivers in Colorado so I have done a lot of fishing there, and I've been to Alaska twice. I like to fish for wild trout even though they tend to kick my a$$ in PA.
My favorite outdoor activity is a canoe/camping trip. I did this from 1985-1991 from Balls Eddy, PA-Calicoon, NY on Father's Day weekend and caught wild trout there. Not a lot but some very memorable ones. Even some when I was spin fishing for bass. I haven't been back there since then but know that it is now a very different trout river.
My two favorite canoe/camping trips are from Durbin to Cass on the Greenbrier River and the Smoke Hole section on the South Branch of the Potomac River. These canoe trips are in West Virginia. They trout are stocked but I am glad that they are there. Theses sections of river get too warm in the summer for wild trout.
Completing the post, I will one day be a member of a rod & gun club near Blakeslee, PA in the western Pocono Mountains where I spent a lot of time fly fishing with my grandfather and then my father. Those trout are all stocked.
I have a lot of great memories from there as well.
I enjoyed and agreed with what others have posted. Stocked trout, if done in marginal waters, has its place, especially in introducing young kids like I was to fishing.
The first trout I ever caught on a fly was at a dude ranch in Wyoming on Sunlight Creek with my grandfather. I was a ten year old boy. I forget if it was a native cutthroat or a brook trout. Brook trout are not native in the Rocky Mountains as I have learned educating myself on trout and trout fishing just like everyone else on the board.
I caught plenty of brook trout at that dude ranch. They could have been stocked, or by that point wild. I was too young to know or care. I was having too much fun. The fly that caught them all whether they were brook or cutthroat trout was a humpy.
I have since learned that the stocking of brook trout over native cutthroats is not popular in the Rocky Mountains. I understand the points made by others on this thread about stocking over native/wild reproducing trout.
I probably spent most of my boyhood opening days with my father on the FFO section on Clark's Creek in Dauphin County. My parents live close to the Frying Pan and Roaring Forks rivers in Colorado so I have done a lot of fishing there, and I've been to Alaska twice. I like to fish for wild trout even though they tend to kick my a$$ in PA.
My favorite outdoor activity is a canoe/camping trip. I did this from 1985-1991 from Balls Eddy, PA-Calicoon, NY on Father's Day weekend and caught wild trout there. Not a lot but some very memorable ones. Even some when I was spin fishing for bass. I haven't been back there since then but know that it is now a very different trout river.
My two favorite canoe/camping trips are from Durbin to Cass on the Greenbrier River and the Smoke Hole section on the South Branch of the Potomac River. These canoe trips are in West Virginia. They trout are stocked but I am glad that they are there. Theses sections of river get too warm in the summer for wild trout.
Completing the post, I will one day be a member of a rod & gun club near Blakeslee, PA in the western Pocono Mountains where I spent a lot of time fly fishing with my grandfather and then my father. Those trout are all stocked.
I have a lot of great memories from there as well.
I enjoyed and agreed with what others have posted. Stocked trout, if done in marginal waters, has its place, especially in introducing young kids like I was to fishing.
shakey
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^^^this.
P
PennypackFlyer
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"Wild Trout Life's Matter" Just saying
afishinado
Moderator
Staff member
^ A little bassackwards, and here's why > Most coldwater streams support wild trout and most warmwater streams support wild smallmouth. No need to stock either.
Marginal/warmwater streams are stocked with trout early in the season to give anglers the opportunity to fish for and keep stocked trout when the water temps will hold them. Check out streams in SEPA like the Wissahickon, Pennypack, the Perk, etc. and you will see hundreds and thousands of anglers fishing them in the early season. There would be no trout fishing in these streams without stocking and little if any trout fishing opportunities in SEPA . These type of streams should and are stocked with trout for put-and-take fishing. The coldwater streams that actually can and do support wild trout should be left unstocked.
As far as warmwater streams, smallmouth bass are very prolific, adaptable and should never be stocked over in warmwater / coolwater streams. These wild fish have adapted to the stream conditions and thrived. Adding stocked fish to dilute the gene pool of a thriving wild population and pushing the population over it's carrying capacity in the stream is definitely the wrong thing to do. The same is true for the coldwater streams that hold wild trout.
The PFBC has it right most of the time. The problem is more with the anglers, the ones that pressure the FBC to stock streams that support wild trout for parochial reasons.
tomgamber
Well-known member
honestly, if there was never stocking, not many of us would be fishing. the water quality would suffer greatly. much of the conservation has been taken up by sportsmen. many of the stocked waters are still as clean as they are because this is where we put the trout. with less of that clean water holding stocked fish the wild fish waterways would have been over fished, unkempt and degraded. the stocked waters, without the stocked fish would not be protected. the only waters worth protecting would have little access. we'd be limited to private property fee fishing.
Hook_Jaw
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There's so many different ways to look at it you don't really know though sometimes I feel if you would or would not have been can be introduced to it later in life.
If I look at places people fish for "non stocked' trout most have hatcheries that are on the water way, spillways, waters that are stocked that run into it wether by the state or private parties.
If I look at places people fish for "non stocked' trout most have hatcheries that are on the water way, spillways, waters that are stocked that run into it wether by the state or private parties.
tomgamber
Well-known member
OF COURSE...ITS ALL MONDAY MORNING QUARTERBACKING...IF WE ACTUALLY KNEW, WE WOULDN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO TALK ABOUT.
Hook_Jaw
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Easy on the caffeine Gamber lol
T
troutbert
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Who in PA is advocating ending stocking?
Is there even anyone on the other side of the argument?
Is there even anyone on the other side of the argument?
tomgamber
Well-known member
its ok i don't use any caps from home...work is all caps...part numbers and such.
BrookieChaser
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When I factor in the avatar and the "all-caps" posts, I see this for some reason...
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=r0f1Aqk1XHI
T
troutbert
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Writing posts in all caps—not a good idea.
Prospector
Well-known member
There was only one native trout stream in the county I grew up in, so without stocking I would have been fishing for Walleye and Crappie as well as spending more time hunting Morels in the spring.
Fly-Swatter
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It is impossible to know for certain, but my answer is "Yes, I would certainly be a wild trout fly fisher if there was never stocked trout." Of course, I would only be fishing for brook trout b/c browns would not have naturalized b/c they never would have been stocked.
The things I love about trout fishing (selective feeding, beautiful locations, striking fish coloration) have nothing to do with stocked trout.
The things I love about trout fishing (selective feeding, beautiful locations, striking fish coloration) have nothing to do with stocked trout.
R
rrt
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I hope I would be. Dad started me with sunnies and then smallies. He then took me for stocked trout on opening day. When I got older, I began to realize there were wild trout in the streams I fished, and I appreciated catching them. When Operation Future ended stocking on some of my favorite waters, I was happy to see it, and I am glad the biologists were correct that year-long trout populations expanded in many of these waters.
I hope I would have fallen into fly-fishing for them as well.
Disclaimer: If I lived where there were no wild trout streams and no wild trout but there were stocked fish, I imagine I would fish for the stocked trout, esp if they held up during the season.
I hope I would have fallen into fly-fishing for them as well.
Disclaimer: If I lived where there were no wild trout streams and no wild trout but there were stocked fish, I imagine I would fish for the stocked trout, esp if they held up during the season.
C
Canoetripper
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The R & G club that I fish in the western Poconos is for stocked trout. I've caught smallmouth bass and see carp so there are no wild trout there. The club members mostly are catch and release fisherman and just stop fishing all together when water temperatures start to rise in the summer.
Many of those stocked trout holdover until the next season. They become very different fish because there are plenty of ospreys and otters that prey on them that they have to learn how to avoid. I'm not saying that they morph into truly wild trout, but they have to learn how to survive.
Many of those stocked trout holdover until the next season. They become very different fish because there are plenty of ospreys and otters that prey on them that they have to learn how to avoid. I'm not saying that they morph into truly wild trout, but they have to learn how to survive.
wbranch
Well-known member
I lived in NJ all my life until I took a transfer with my job to York, PA. But when I was 12 I fell in love with fishing and can remember my first Opening Day on the Pompton River in Wayne, NJ. My Dad bought me and him a pair of vinyl chest waders and black high top sneakers as our wading shoes. I caught two trout on worms just hanging in the current downstream from me.
I loved Opening Day for years! My buddies and I would water the lawn so the night crawlers would come out then we would go out with our flashlights and get a couple dozen. We also used Mike's Salmon eggs on those tiny #16 gold up eye hooks with the single barb on the shank. I think though our best bait were the cased stick caddis. We would get about 50 each and put them in little boxes and gently pull them out of their cases. If there were trout in that riffle or pool they usually couldn't wait to eat those caddis larvae. Back them we would keep our limits and fished all day Saturday and Sunday.
I bait fished for trout diligently for eight years until I turned twenty. Then I started to fly fish a little but would still spin fish with my 6' ultra light rod, Mitchell 308 reel, and 4# line. When I turned 21 I read an article about the Beaverkill and the next July 05 of 1965 I went up for the weekend. I caught my first Beaverkill trout on a #14 Hares Ear nymph that was just hanging below me in the current. I was hooked after that and put the spinning rod away for about forty years. Now I spin and fly fish for smallmouth and steelhead but only fly fish for wild trout about 90% of the time. I still fish the Tully a lot in March and April when the Delaware system is too high and cold for consistently good trout fishing.
If I hadn't had stocked trout in New Jersey I likely would never of fished for trout as there were many good WW lakes to fish in NJ for bass, pickerel, and other WW sport fish. I am though very glad they did have stocked streams and a couple close enough we could get there on our bikes,
Without my introduction to bait fishing for stocked trout I would never of had the opportunity to fish in so many beautiful places and see so many great trout and salmon rivers.
I loved Opening Day for years! My buddies and I would water the lawn so the night crawlers would come out then we would go out with our flashlights and get a couple dozen. We also used Mike's Salmon eggs on those tiny #16 gold up eye hooks with the single barb on the shank. I think though our best bait were the cased stick caddis. We would get about 50 each and put them in little boxes and gently pull them out of their cases. If there were trout in that riffle or pool they usually couldn't wait to eat those caddis larvae. Back them we would keep our limits and fished all day Saturday and Sunday.
I bait fished for trout diligently for eight years until I turned twenty. Then I started to fly fish a little but would still spin fish with my 6' ultra light rod, Mitchell 308 reel, and 4# line. When I turned 21 I read an article about the Beaverkill and the next July 05 of 1965 I went up for the weekend. I caught my first Beaverkill trout on a #14 Hares Ear nymph that was just hanging below me in the current. I was hooked after that and put the spinning rod away for about forty years. Now I spin and fly fish for smallmouth and steelhead but only fly fish for wild trout about 90% of the time. I still fish the Tully a lot in March and April when the Delaware system is too high and cold for consistently good trout fishing.
If I hadn't had stocked trout in New Jersey I likely would never of fished for trout as there were many good WW lakes to fish in NJ for bass, pickerel, and other WW sport fish. I am though very glad they did have stocked streams and a couple close enough we could get there on our bikes,
Without my introduction to bait fishing for stocked trout I would never of had the opportunity to fish in so many beautiful places and see so many great trout and salmon rivers.
