How do they do it? TCO/Orvis

Risen fly.... which is owned by Ryan Goldsberry a member here.... opened a fly shop a few years ago in Beaver county... he is doing fantastic, actually needs a bigger shop
 
China can produce superb quality as well as poor quality. It all depends what the client contracts. The products are cheaper because manufacturing is not hamstrung with insanely high union wages. This belief that all things made in china are junk is flat out wrong.
 
poopdeck said:
China can produce superb quality as well as poor quality. It all depends what the client contracts. The products are cheaper because manufacturing is not hamstrung with insanely high union wages. This belief that all things made in china are junk is flat out wrong.
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You mean a living wage?
 
The shops that last have to do a great online business. Foot traffic alone would never provide enough sales.
 
poopdeck said:
China can produce superb quality as well as poor quality. It all depends what the client contracts. The products are cheaper because manufacturing is not hamstrung with insanely high union wages. This belief that all things made in china are junk is flat out wrong.
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There is a pretty wide gap between CCP sweatshop labor and US union labor (I was a Teamster local 776 way back when) to affect buyer brand loyalty
 
If an American company contracts with a Chinese company to make something, the American company must test and verify the quality coming from China. If they don't test or don't give rigid specs for the products then the Chinese will always try to find a cheaper way to make the product. It's incumbent on the American company to test, test, test.
 
Hardy and Loomis are two high end rods I can think of that are made overseas.
 
When I started fly fishing Orvis was much more of a fishing store, as opposed to a high end clothing outfitter. Yes they always had those pricey oil skin hunting jackets and such but they semed to be geared a lot more to the average fisherman. They also routinely sent out really good coupons. Now the coupons always seem to start with "not good on fishing, etc." Sorry but that always rubs me the wrong way.
 
BrookieChaser said:
Hardy and Loomis are two high end rods I can think of that are made overseas.
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GLoomis still makes rods in Woodland, WA.

Hardy's has always been "overseas" -- they are after all an English company, not an American one. Yes, most of their models are now produced in Asia, but the highest end ones are still made in England.

Of course, almost all lower end rods, regardless of manufacturer, are made overseas.
 
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I am loyal to Orvis. Between their in-store beginner lessons, online educational videos, and incredibly helpful associates, they have taught me the basics to get going in the sport. Their customer service has been tremendously helpful as well. The other extremely helpful learning tool has been the videos on Youtube from Scott at PA Woods n Water. I'd like to shake that guys hand and thank him.
I'll shop comparatively, but if all things are pretty much equal, I'll go with Orvis. I'll still shop at all fly shops, but I largely stick with the Orvis brand.
My question is this: How in the heck to they make any money when they BOMBARD my mailbox with catalogs. One or two a week - not exaggerating....
 
I generally like Orvis as a company, except their rods. For some reasons their taper designs haven't been to my liking, not saying low quality by any means, just a personal preference thing. Haven't tried them all and always happy to give any rod a chance. But other gear, yeah, it's good stuff.

How much fishing gear vs. clothing an Orvis shop has I think is entirely up to the store? I've been in Orvis corporate stores, which typically have a heavy supply of clothing. But a lot of local fly shops are heavy on Orvis equipment, including FFP, Slate Run, etc.
 
JeffP said:
You mean a living wage?
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jgish92 said:
My question is this: How in the heck to they make any money when they BOMBARD my mailbox with catalogs. One or two a week - not exaggerating....
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Funny, just got another one today. I really wish they would stop, or do it about 1/4 as often.
Syl
 
jgish92 said:
I am loyal to Orvis. Between their in-store beginner lessons, online educational videos, and incredibly helpful associates, they have taught me the basics to get going in the sport. Their customer service has been tremendously helpful as well. The other extremely helpful learning tool has been the videos on Youtube from Scott at PA Woods n Water.
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Yes, they do a lot towards that. THey give great pro deals for guides and their stuff is really good. It's not a compromise for John to use Orvis waders, rods , line and reels. (John's my friend who guides out of Bozeman). It's great representation and promotion for the company and the products. There isn't a down side.
 
jgish92 said:
I am loyal to Orvis. Between their in-store beginner lessons, online educational videos, and incredibly helpful associates, they have taught me the basics to get going in the sport. Their customer service has been tremendously helpful as well. The other extremely helpful learning tool has been the videos on Youtube from Scott at PA Woods n Water. I'd like to shake that guys hand and thank him.
I'll shop comparatively, but if all things are pretty much equal, I'll go with Orvis. I'll still shop at all fly shops, but I largely stick with the Orvis brand.
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^^^ I agree with much of this. I look at it like this: Fly fishing is a niche sport and there is exactly one company in the entire United States that serves this niche in all aspects and it is Orvis. They sell quality gear of all levels and price points from beginners up to professionals, they sell all necessary tackle and fly tying gear, clothing, hats, books, sunglasses, etc. Store staff are always knowledgeable and the customer service is usually first rate. Just as important, they produce and disseminate expert instructional videos and articles which are easily accessible and FREE online. They are also stewards for clean water, healthy fish and the environment in general. In my opinion it's a no brainer that a company that serves our niche to this degree deserves our support. Yes there are other quality vendors of fishing gear - I buy gear from Fishpond and Simms among others and I buy flies from Lively Legs, and I also like to support local fly shops. But none of them do it all, with actual brick and mortar stores all over the country, like Orvis does. I'd also add that I've never worked for Orvis, I'm just posting this because I think they are a business that is clearly worthy of our support.
 
When I began fly-fishing during the Paleolithic Period in Delco, there were three fly shops to choose from and most importantly, that could be reached via public transportation:
  • Eyler’s in Ardmore (later Bryn Mawr)
  • Cox’s in Bryn Mawr
  • The Sporting Gentleman on Baltimore Pike (later State Street) in Media
All three were Orvis dealers with the Sporting Gentleman being a tad more Orvis than the other two so as a result, Orvis goodies were what I saw and lusted for from the very beginning. An Orvis shop was always a place that felt comfortable & familiar to me.

While I don’t own a lot of Orvis tackle and never did with the exception of two reels and two graphite rods I bought decades ago and bunch of bamboo I’ve picked up in recent years, I have never regretted anything I ever purchased from Orvis and Orvis customer service is one of the benchmarks in my experience.

There were two Orvis shops (Bethlehem & Allentown) close to where I live now that I would visit on occasion for an item or two however; they both closed a long time ago. These days I really don’t have any interest in the closest Orvis option or fly shops in general. The warm fuzzy feeling I used to experience going into one has been absent for a long time so I do all of my shopping on-line with pricing and free freight being the prime motivators as to who I buy from.

In regards to the catalogs, like just about every other catalog I USED to get, a phone call will get you off the mailing list. I never read them and would throw them out as soon as they arrived or at the end of the year, so I am happy to save a few trees and peruse their websites.

In regards to the COO of fishing tackle and everything else; unless it is impossible, I don’t intentionally buy any products from China even if I have to spend three times the $$$ to get something made in the US...

...and it has nothing to do with quality…
 
I haven't thought too much about that, but you're right about maybe being the only company that serves all aspects of fly fishing. I can't think of another who sells rods, reels, waders, boots, flies, lines all branded under 1 name. You could make an argument for farbank, which owns Sage, Redington, and Rio. But that's a holding company of multiple brands, (though Redington itself does wading gear and rods/reels as well as packs, zingers, and such).

And the brand is so associated with fly fishing, that, somebody could literally not have any Orvis gear at all. Could be brand new Simms waders with Korkers boots with a Sage rod and a Lamson reel and an SA line. What do we say? We say they look like they just stepped out of an ORVIS catalog.
 
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Bamboozle said:
When I began fly-fishing during the Paleolithic Period in Delco, there were three fly shops to choose from and most importantly, that could be reached via public transportation:
  • Eyler’s in Ardmore (later Bryn Mawr)
  • Cox’s in Bryn Mawr
  • The Sporting Gentleman on Baltimore Pike (later State Street) in Media
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I miss the original Eyler's on Lancaster Ave in Ardmore. It was the first fly shop I ever visited as a kid, back in the 70's. I remember Mr. Eyler well. Ahh, the good old days!
 
It's also worth noting that there is a difference between Orvis dealers and Orvis owned stores.
 
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