Fly Fishing For the Wealthy Only?

[CaptMatt]

I just read the post about license sales and it brought a thought to mind. Is our sport being dominated by the wealthy and is it becoming too expensive of a hobby to draw more anglers who don't realize it doesn’t have to be? In guiding and fly fishing in salt and fresh water I have made some observations. Unless you are endorsed by a fly fishing company, I have noticed that people who can’t fish or only fish occasionally have the Highest end products to use and cant use them. Intern, people I know who are really really good fisherman make the best use out of their mid priced gear. On a recent guide trip I had a client with a boron 2x rod and the other had a high end sage. Both paid a great deal of money for their gear but never fished. They asked me what I use so I showed them my Orvis TLS power matrix, which I love by the way. I fish all the time and am an okay caster! We need to let the people know that this IS NOT A SPOR FOR "THE ELITE" ONLY! On a side note, I used to work at a shot gun club, the worst shooters I saw all had high end guns. It just seems like those who appreciate the sports the most are having more and more trouble affording them. Case and Point, land sales in Montana etc... the rich own the land and post the streams so 1 week a year they can look at it and head somewhere else. I any of us lived there we would loose our jobs because we fish too much. The money aspect of fly fishing is what seems to draw the most attention rather than the true meaning of it. Which causes uneducated people to say, "hey that sprt is too expensive". Somethings gotta give here.

 

[albatross]

CaptMatt,

I think its these wealthy guys who don't fish very much that give our sport a "snobish" reputation as well.

You say you've observed the same issue with trap and skeet shooting. I'll bet there are similar issues in Scotch drinking circles! :lol:

 

[jayL]

It's a misconception. Look at the members of this board. I'm not sure, but it looks to me that most here have a handle on things and their heads are certainly not up their rear ends like most of the rich, snobby types you mention. I've yet to meet a snobby or super wealthy, yet inept person yet on the streams.

It's not just for the wealthy. I'm a 22 year old student and I fish plenty. I have all the gear I need. Hell, I'm poor as dirt and I've gotten two new rods this year. One was built, and one was purchased from a fellow board member. (Thanks! I'll be fishing it in a month!) People who have half a brain and some ingenuity can get high quality gear within their means. It's the frills, bells, and whistles that I can't afford. Frankly, I don't want them.

(I'll get them in a year when I graduate, of course )

 

[ryanh]

I'm so poor I can't even pay attention. However I have every intention of being rich someday. Does that count?

I think that if you 1.) don't have some one in your family exposing you to FF'ing 2.) or don't live in a rural area where it is done then you will be left with the misconception that it is an eliteist sport that costs a ton of money.

It can be both, but what can't? I have met a bunch of board members here. I may be wrong but you all seem like average joes. (but that Mauriece is a little hoidy toidy.... :lol: ) We as a group are not eliteists or uberaffluent.

Fly fishing is a little more involved then say drinking beer and watching TV and as such probably apeals to different kinds of people.

In addition to your "rich people buying top line stuff they never use" hypothesis here is one of my own.

I have seen many newbies start off with an introductory rod. Once they have ANY success at all they want to go get a Winston or Sage. Like you said get something in hyour range. Don't apologize for it and learn to use it well.

 

[StudentofTheStream]

I also feel this is a misconception usually encountered by an outsider to the sport. People look at Orvis and LL Bean catalogs and surmise that the illustrations are what all fisherman look like which not at all true. I used to fish with some guys that bought rods from yard sales for $20 and could out fish just about anyone. Ist a lot of perception and stereotypes but it's hard to thing of anything that doesn't carry some of those stigmas.

I also believe it's all relative. I usually purchase TFO rods just because I feel they give you the best bang for your buck. When I tell some friends who don't fly fish that I spend between $150-250 for a rod that think that I'm nuts. To someone else or people who know about rods that's a pretty good deal. The preconceived notion from the outside looking in is that fly fisherman are 'elitist' and or 'snobby' but to me I've yet to meet such a person on the stream. It's all relative.

 

[CaptMatt]

For the record, the clients were not snobby but they had money. Even though snobbery can be a problem it is not what I’m particularly talking about. The tv shows and magazines usually feature people who are either sponsored or rich. Using the best tackle money can buy etc... I also have better rods now than I did when I began. The publicity around the sport is focused on 600.00 rods (which I do want a few) and 300.oo gortex coats. This gives a bad impression and categorizes fly fishing as "for the rich". Through boards like this and others we can help reverse that way of thinking.

 

[Acristickid]

I guess maybe because hunting and fishing are sports that you need a piece of ground to paticipate. And the areas where hunting and fishing are good, the land is expensive or not accessable to general public???

I just threw in hunting because there are alot of guys with $1500 shotguns out there. (guys would be better off with a $300 gun and $1200 worth of instruction)

I agree with SOS's post it is all relative. If you own a $600 rod and use it every week for years, I dont see the rod being very expensive with that mindset.

 

[pete41]

It isn't the wealthy thats made fly rods so expensive.It's the average Joe that eagerly pay far more than a fair an reasonable price for someones top of the line rod for the ``pride of ownership.''
This allows everyone else to up their price points.
May sound ridiculous but its true.
If we had all settled for Cabelas,BPS and other chains good enough rods and reels the price through the lines would be considerably lower.
There are only a few companies making blanks and fittings.The rod sellers buy from them.

 

[CaptMatt]

The point is not meant to curse the "high end" product or bash the wealthy (most of them earned every dollar.) It's to attempt to attract more people to our beloved sport. I plan on buying a boron 2x in the future. 600.00 rod plus whatever reel I put on it. It's the point that the focus of our sport, publicity wise, usually is focused on the wealthy. Period.

 

[pete41]

I don't think anybody is cursing or bashing-You seem to have missed the point that attention has always been focused on the people that are interesting to focus on.So if one of the beautiful people dabble at flyfishing it becomes interesting to the media.
As far as attracting more people to the sport it sounds good on paper,considerably less on the stream.lol
For many getting away and enjoying the solitude is the real ``pull''.
However we could always have bass and redfish type tournaments with big money prizes and big stars.

 

[CaptMatt]

pete41 wrote:
I don't think anybody is cursing or bashing-You seem to have missed the point that attention has always been focused on the people that are interesting to focus on.So if one of the beautiful people dabble at flyfishing it becomes interesting to the media.
As far as attracting more people to the sport it sounds good on paper,considerably less on the stream.lol
For many getting away and enjoying the solitude is the real ``pull''.
However we could always have bass and redfish type tournaments with big money prizes and big stars.

Pete, I reread my posts and it could appear that I was bashing them. I'm not talking about celebrities, who I think "beautiful people" is directed towards. I do not however want to see our sport go by the wayside to the wealthy. Or at least I dont want the sport to be perceived in that way.

P.S I hate Redfish Tournaments They have one in the harbor almost every weekend.

 

[Acristickid]

I hear what you are saying. I had a post a week or so ago about how people came into the sport. Seems like most were brought up into flyfishing (family,friend,neighbor) or were spin/bait guys that wanted more out of the fishing experience. Kinda hard to reach some people if they are not already outdoorsy types. Got no problem with rich people who want to fish as long as they feel they don't need to buy where ever their fishing and post it off.

 

[fly_flinger]

I say bring on the wealthy. Makes for some great deals on sweet gear when they quit. Plus I'd rather have someone not catch the trout with a $1000 setup than catching them and killing them with a $50 rig.

I fished with a dude that owned an oil company in Miss. last time I was in Montana. You could tell he had some money by the gear he had but that was it. He wasn't pompas or arragant but was more than willing to help you or teach you something. It's all relative. To someone with millions, what's a few thousand? I personally think people that wouldn't try or ask someone about fly fishing because of a perception they had, especially you have to be rich, shouldn't be fly fishing. More trout for us bums who are steady getting it for the man.

 

[Padraic]

There is a class of goods identified in advertising circles as "affordable luxuries". Stuff like, Starbucks coffee, perfumes in fancy cut crystal containers, high tech gadgets that people buy because they have to overspend just a little to get. It makes them feel like they are getting something special without having to make a major outlay.

Flyfishing is a little like that. Folks can't afford lives of leisure, but they can have a "mini-vacation" on the weekend for three hours. They can't afford heirloom quality handcrafted sporting equipment, but a really good flyrod feels good in the hand and gortex waders keep you comfy. Overpaying a bit makes reflects how much we enjoy the sport.

That said, you don't have to kill yourself to get started. Most of us don't kill ourselves financially at first. Look at Orvis's catalog. They have flyrods that cost less than $100 and others that are over $600. I think most guys who want to get started are going to look at that catalog and make the decision that makes the most sense to them. If they have the money, maybe they will spend the $600. Still it should be obvious that they don't have to.

The high end-elite of any sport or pastime always gets the press. When you look to get started in those hobbies, you find your level. Lots of people go to Vegas, but we don't bet like they do on the ESPN World Series of Poker. Folks go on cruises, but we don't all go first class like they do in the movies.

I found this site before I ever got my hands on my first flyrod. My wife had ordered one for me for my birthday. It hadn't arrived in time for my party, so she wrapped up some other stuff and let me know it was coming. So I did some searching online and ordered an intro-guidebook, signed up for classes at a local shop, joined TU and found this site. The guys here gave me some sound advice and assured me that learning was not as hard as one might fear, nor as expensive.

I'm guessing most people won't follow the same path I did, but folks are generally pretty sensible. They'll figure it out.

 

[TimMurphy]

Dear Capt Matt,

How many guys are cruising your harbor with top of the line and custom built Loomis or Kistler rods and Shimano Stella's, Van Staal's, or one of the recent copycat $ 499.99 spinning reels?

When the Stella's came out I thought who would ever buy one? Now they are mid-priced for top of the line spinning reels, you can easily spend $ 200.00 more.

I have a 40 year old Garcia/Mitchell 300 reel that no fish has ever come close to killing including several that spooled me of more than 200 yards of line. I still use old Penn 900 series baitcasters and Penn "Green" 700 series spinning reels. Someone else will use them when I'm dead too.

I own a ton of flyfishing gear that ranges from "old, ugly and modest" to "what were you thinking to spend that on a fishing pole?" I use all of my gear from time to time though I favor some rods and reels, and they aren't necessarily the newest or the greatest. I like to collect tackle, I pay cash for it and while I'm ashamed to admit I own as much of it as I do I figure I haven't harmed anyone.

It's not the gear that makes some flyfisher's seem snobby and elite, it's their attitude. Fly fishing is just another way to fool something that has a brain the size of a BB, it isn't the be all and end all of outdoor experiences no matter what anybody tries to say.

It's all jes' feeshin' sunnnnnnnnnnnnnhhhhhhh! Now reach in that cooler and grab yerself a cold one! :-D

Regards,
Tim Murphy

 

[Stone_Fly]

Do you guys ever listen to any group of Fly Fishes when they gather, We're all snobs.

 

[Woolybugger]

I haven't found fly fishermen to be snobby. I think they love the sport of fishing a little more than tackle guys. Most could catch more trout with roostertails or cheese balls, but catching a trout with a fly rod is just more fun! I have found that fly fishermen are better educated, but not rich, snobs.

Me, not a rich guy by any standards, actually I'm in the "low income" end of this site......... been screwed so bad by downsizing with this global economy!........... but I still bought a Sage a couple months ago.

The wonderful times I had this past spring with my Sage are priceless to me. I have cheaper fly rods that catch fish, but I just had to get a high end rod for those Heavenly Days I spent in Muddy Creek!..... and I'm not a elitist or a snob!........ just someone who loves to flyfish more than anything else.

Elitists and Snobs, what about Jane Fonda and Ted Turner...... they own hundreds of thousands of acres of the finest trout water in Montana, and it is posted! If I ever walked on their property, I'm sure they would have me arrested. Even if I said that I liked your movies, Jane, she would laugh at me and say "put that working class guy in jail, and disinfect everything that he touched"

When VP **** Chaney goes fly fishing, he tells the government not to fly any planes overhead while he is on the water........ he says it hurts the serenity of his fishing experience...... even if it costs hundreds of thousands more to reroute the planes!

That's what gives fly fishing the snobby name.

 

[Squaretail]

Last year I stepped on my Plateau flyrod and somehow lost my White river reel. If you look close enough you can see the $19.99 Scientific Angler rod I got from Walmart(yuk)and the old Medalist reel with missing handle and all that I ended up using the rest of the year that an old-timer gave me. It took somewhere over 400 trout before a friend bought me an Orvis reel and I was able to get a Diamondback rod on clearance. I had more money in the line than the rod and reel.
Now you know why I didnt post on the thread a while back about listing what kind of equipment we're using.

 

[Cynic]

Woolybugger,

I think that by its very nature, fishing with a rod and reel conveys elitism. Fly fishing is at the top of this hierarchy.

Sorry to hear about your being whacked by the down sizing. But, it so necessary as we have to get to the next level - total globalization where there are two levels or classes - the few, very, very, rich and the many, many, poor serfs!

When crossing the street, please be careful, you would not want to be run over by one of those Mexican Trucks!!!

 

[Spyder20oz]

Are you a snob if you drive a nice car? No one needs a nice car. Why don't you drive a 1980 chevy... it will do the same job as a lexus or a civic. How about own a nice set of golf clubs or a nice tennis racket? Sure no one drives like an indy driver, plays golf like Tiger or hits a tennis ball like the pros but its enjoyable to use the products they use.

How about home appliances... when you buy a starter house should you buy starter appliances?? why not just get the best and never have to worry or feel like there is something better out there.

Capt Matt... do you fish out of a nice boat or an aluminum john boat... certainly you don't need the boat you have but you bought it because you like it. An aluminum john boat with a 15 horse motor will do the trick.

Overall, quit bitching about everyone else and worry about yourself. Why don't you do something constructive and talk about leader setups or talk about the current fishing reports!