First time fly fishing in PA - where to?

[ohmatt]

I'll be spending the night in Dubois 2 weeks from today and have all day Thursday set aside to fish *somewhere* from this base. Friday-Sunday I'll be camping in the Susquehannock backcountry fishing tribs to Kettle Creek.

But where to go on Thursday? I won't mind driving 90+ minutes each way for great water. I have 2#-8# rods available. My buddy is limited to a 9'4# but I could loan him a 5# and use a 6# if that is a factor in suggestions.

I've fished mostly small mountain streams, my stomping grounds are the Monongahela and Smoky mountains. I don't know big streams well but am not against it. My buddy is a new angler, just caught his first 'bow in Hatchery Creek, KY in January. We want to catch some fish, size doesn't matter. We're not looking to release to grease; everything will swim away. We also aren't against hiking a mile+ to get to better water but want clearly defined public access since we're strangers to the state.


Those broad factors in mind - I would really appreciate any suggestions.

Tight lines,
- Matt -

 

[tabasco_joe]

I haven't fished it but if I had a free day in that area I'd be checking out Sinnemahoning Creek. Too many people on this site speak well of it. DKile recently had a video on fishing the area.

http://www.paflyfish.com/forums/Forum-Announcements/Fly-Fishing-Events-and-Meet-ups/Zoom-Presentation--April-Fly-Fishing-in-Northcentral-Pennsylvania/11,50942.html


Doesn't look like the link works.

Anyway its in the Events and Meetups under April FLy Fishing in North Central PA.

Should be a wealth of info for you.

 

[maxima12]

Ohmatt. my suggestion--------Everywhere, you see water! The secret to great fishing, is fishing! You have a pal. Remember, a pal, a friend!

Do the best you can do to make it a "Hero's Delight". Been fishing a lot, been seeing a lot, been meeting friends, old and new!

Boy Scouts=====DO Your Best! You have the chance, to be , Trustworthy, Loyal, Helpful, Friendly, Curtious, Kind, Obedient, Cheerful, Thrifty, Brave, Clean and Reverent! You ask, brother, a spot?

How about a smooth story! Where did you go, and find a memory of a lifetime!

Let me guess---------PENNSYLVANIA!

MAXIMA12

 

[Flashback]

From Dubois you could head east on 80 for about an hour and hit Bald Eagle and Spring Creek. Gives you a chance at stocked and wild fish. 3 or 4 wt rods will suit you well there. I would suggest exploring north central pa that time of year also. First Fork, Driftwood, etc can all be easy day trips from Dubois. Should be plenty of bugs around.

 

[troutbert]

There are many trout streams on public land not far from Dubois. Look at maps of the state forests and state gamelands.

 

[ohmatt]

Thank you very much tobasco_joe and flashback..

Let me clarify here. Based upon a couple of the replies including an aspersion, assumptions are being made. I left my request broad because I'm not wanting anyone to spill their honey hole. I want something like "There's good public access on [road] near [town] on [river] and I've had good luck this time of year. That's it. Even something much more vague would be awesome.

If somebody were to say to me, "I'm going to the Mon - where should I fish?" I'd tell them, "Right now if it were me I'd head to Southern Otter Creek and walk up some tribs." It's not a massive watershed, but a person could spend a week in that area and not cover everything. The hordes of anglers who will find these words on Google sometime in the future won't ruin fishing for me there. Providing that angler advice however would prevent them from hitting a stream with too high levels of tannins or acid runoff which doesn't show up on maps and could ruin a trip. The best fishing day of my life was above Tremont in a tributary of the Middle Prong of the Little River. 83 specs in an afternoon. If masses see these words based upon a google search, they'll probably run for Lynn Camp Prong (which opened for the first time in 80 years in 2015). They can join the crowd on Lynn Camp there let em, my words were vague.

I've spent a month researching and am overwhelmed. Last time I was this confused I was trying to find the right spot was in Driftless. (The great thing about PA is I'm not dodging streams with Mud Snails.) BEC is the first stream that comes up when you're going to driftless but I didn't want to set a foot in it. Even so, I had 2 days to fish on that trip so I packed 2 pairs of boots just in case. Ended up meeting a guy at the conference and taking him to the places I thought would be good. We both caught fish, nothing spectacular but he was thrilled because Driftless is crazy big and his original plan was to hit a very used pulloff on BEC. I digress.

Studying maps, it's insane. You guys are blessed. We have the Mad and Clear Fork in Ohio -- that's it. Below are a few things I have in a document I've been building and pouring over. I'm using gaia maps on areas of interest to get 3D views of the terrain. I've looked over every resource I can, and am really concerned I'll take my buddy to an unproductive area anyways. If I had a week to strike out repeatedly that would be fine. I have one day.

PA Trout streams interactive map
PA Wilderness Trout streams list
Beginner’s Strategy for Locating Small, Wild Trout Streams in the Wilds of Pennsylvania
Class A Wild Trout Waters list 2021
State Park Maps

A fine state park official spent $5 on postage alone (of PA taxpayer funds) providing me with excellent physical maps. One is 35"x22" Recreational map; and several others are 12 pane, double sided beauties. Not as detailed as the spiral bound DelRome book which I bought, but have things it lacks.

Perhaps I'm being gauche here and not observing some person's definition of trout etiquette by simply asking for a river name and place to park. There's valuable information that can only be learned from kind people though. Most fly anglers are the best out there. Perhaps I shouldn't take a soap box out when I'm asking for assistance. I've been fly fishing 30 years and don't need people to lecture me on my values or tell me to get out my gazetteer. I'm always reticent to ask for help on forums, and this is why. Who in their right mind would come to a forum, ask for help, and not expect that #0000 post comic book store guy to show up; but two? Ya got me anyways. Rudeness sucks, particularly from those who virtue signal at the same time. "Enough of me and entirely too many of you."

Please forgive my tirade, if there's anybody else around who would still care to share information I'll be very grateful. I tried to reply to several other threads yesterday to contribute a bit in return.


Tight Lines,
- Matt -

 

[tabasco_joe]

One other thought is to do a Google search on a fly shop in the area. Check to see if they have a WEB page. Call them, or better yet stop in, and ask their advice. Buy a couple flys that they recommend or more to compensate their establishment.

 

[ohmatt]

Thanks Joe, that is definitely part of the plan. For my 2 days Friday and Saturday where I'll be backpacking and camping on the Kettle Creek tributaries, I plan on hitting Kettle Creek Tackle Shop in Cross Fork. It looks like it might also be the closest one to the Sinnemahoning Creek you mentioned earlier.

Once I have a target river - I check for the closest shop and get advice. There are local effective flies you can't find anywhere else. In the Smokies those are Thunderhead, Yallerhammer, and a recent favorite Rob's Hellbender. You might hear about them reading LRO forums but you'd be served much better by talking to Ian or Bill in the actual store and hearing that Quills are hatching early this year. "What? I didn't pack any!" You certainly aren't going to hear about a fly class being taught by Walter Babb at a BPS!

I don't like calling for advice so I can provide them some revenue for the favor. Fishing stores run on small profit margins and big box stores nowadays make it harder than ever. I might have been able to get my Chota hippies or STLs from a discount web store a bit cheaper, but a fly shop got my money. Way back in high school I worked in a little tackle shop. People got great advice for Crappie and Saugeye for the nearby lake from me, (but not my honey holes). The sports writer for the Dispatch called for advice once and I told him he'd need to come in and buy some minnows first. It was only the once.

Tight Lines,
- Matt -

 

[tabasco_joe]

ohmatt wrote:
Thanks Joe, that is definitely part of the plan. For my 2 days Friday and Saturday where I'll be backpacking and camping on the Kettle Creek tributaries, I plan on hitting Kettle Creek Tackle Shop in Cross Fork. It looks like it might also be the closest one to the Sinnemahoning Creek you mentioned earlier.

Once I have a target river - I check for the closest shop and get advice. There are local effective flies you can't find anywhere else. In the Smokies those are Thunderhead, Yallerhammer, and a recent favorite Rob's Hellbender. You might hear about them reading LRO forums but you'd be served much better by talking to Ian or Bill in the actual store and hearing that Quills are hatching early this year. "What? I didn't pack any!" You certainly aren't going to hear about a fly class being taught by Walter Babb at a BPS!

I don't like calling for advice so I can provide them some revenue for the favor. Fishing stores run on small profit margins and big box stores nowadays make it harder than ever. I might have been able to get my Chota hippies or STLs from a discount web store a bit cheaper, but a fly shop got my money. Way back in high school I worked in a little tackle shop. People got great advice for Crappie and Saugeye for the nearby lake from me, (but not my honey holes). The sports writer for the Dispatch called for advice once and I told him he'd need to come in and buy some minnows first. It was only the once.

Tight Lines,
- Matt -

Plan on spending some time in the Kettle Creek Shop. Phil is a character and great guy. Worth the trip by itself.

Last time I was there I bought one of his glass rods.

You're going to enjoy that visit.

 

[troutbert]

Someone suggested Spring Creek. That is a limestone stream with a high trout population. So that is one good option.

The other option is to fish the mountain streams closer to Dubois. For that the maps for Elk State Forest and Moshannon State Forest are very useful.

Those mountain freestone streams are a totally different situation than Spring Creek.

There are some stocked waters in that area, but the stockies are often quickly removed.

Most of the small streams in the public forests have wild trout, but the numbers are typically not very high. A small fraction of what is in Spring Creek.

I like mountain stream fishing in that region for wild trout. But it's not easy. Much of the stream mileage has low trout populations.

There are some very good sections. But they are the minority and they are small streams. You have to pay your dues, fish a lot of miles of water, to find the better sections.

But I like the mountain stream scenery. And there a lot of elk in that region. Seeing elk on fishing trips is enjoyable.

 

[Swattie87]

ohmatt wrote:

Let me clarify here. Based upon a couple of the replies including an aspersion, assumptions are being made. I left my request broad because I'm not wanting anyone to spill their honey hole. I want something like "There's good public access on [road] near [town] on [river] and I've had good luck this time of year. That's it. Even something much more vague would be awesome.

Let me perhaps clarify in response. I agree, your initial post was broad and requested general information. I think you got several good responses, giving you good general advice in response to it.

Despite not asking for anyone to spill their honey hole, in the eyes of many however, your above quoted post likely is seen as requesting, or expecting, too much detail in response.

So in response to your original inquiry, I’ll add the following:

There are numerous large freestone watersheds in North Central PA. These include the Sinnemahoning, Kettle, and Pine drainages, among others, though those are the furthest west, in that relative order, and closest to you coming from Dubois. Their main stems are all stocked Trout fisheries for the most part, but good ones at that, with very good public access. (If you see posted signs, just don’t access there.) Nearly all of the their tributaries contain wild Brook and/or Brown Trout, many of which are on public State Forest and/or State Game Lands, whose boundaries can easily be verified with online SF or SGL maps made available by the state. (Apply the same logic you did in researching the backcountry portion of your trip.)

There are also several larger limestone influenced streams in Central Pennsylvania (general State College area) that are worth consideration. These include Penns, Little J, Spring Creek, and Big Fishing Creek, among a few others. These are more temperamental than the North Central freestone watersheds mentioned above, but can have excellent fishing in the right conditions. They’re a bit of a gamble for a one day outing, but they’re within driving range and worthy of consideration. Hint...If it’s cloudy and/or drizzly, I’d give these strong consideration. If it’s sunny, I’d head north to one of the freestones above. These large limestoners are popular streams, and there is plenty of information available online about where you can safely legally access them. Again, in PA, just don’t walk past Posted signs, unless they specifically say fishing is allowed.

Hope that helps and explains some of the sentiment you’re maybe picking up, and good luck.

 

[ohmatt]

troutbert wrote:
Someone suggested Spring Creek. That is a limestone stream with a high trout population. So that is one good option.

The other option is to fish the mountain streams closer to Dubois. For that the maps for Elk State Forest and Moshannon State Forest are very useful.

Those mountain freestone streams are a totally different situation than Spring Creek.

There are some stocked waters in that area, but the stockies are often quickly removed.

Most of the small streams in the public forests have wild trout, but the numbers are typically not very high. A small fraction of what is in Spring Creek.

I like mountain stream fishing in that region for wild trout. But it's not easy. Much of the stream mileage has low trout populations.

There are some very good sections. But they are the minority and they are small streams. You have to pay your dues, fish a lot of miles of water, to find the better sections.

But I like the mountain stream scenery. And there a lot of elk in that region. Seeing elk on fishing trips is enjoyable.

Thanks troutbert, appreciate it!

Mountain trout, low numbers isn't bad at all. That's generally my thing. Acid rain and Tanin do it in WVA and a geological formation called Anakeesta and oxidation of sulfide minerals drops the PH of everything in the Smokies save for Abram's creek which flows under magical limestone to neutralize.

If you ever visit the Smokies, stop off in Cataloochee. It's a pain to drive into but you'll get to see Elk. You can also get a "Smokies Slam" standing in the same spot if you do your homework.

I like to "blue line" and when I see things like this it's worth hiking to. I think I'll have to ask my buddy which he feels more like.

 

[ohmatt]

Swattie87 wrote:

Let me perhaps clarify in response. I agree, your initial post was broad and requested general information. I think you got several good responses, giving you good general advice in response to it.

Despite not asking for anyone to spill their honey hole, in the eyes of many however, your above quoted post likely is seen as requesting, or expecting, too much detail in response.

So in response to your original inquiry, I’ll add the following:

There are numerous large freestone watersheds in North Central PA. These include the Sinnemahoning, Kettle, and Pine drainages, among others, though those are the furthest west, in that relative order, and closest to you coming from Dubois. Their main stems are all stocked Trout fisheries for the most part, but good ones at that, with very good public access. (If you see posted signs, just don’t access there.) Nearly all of the their tributaries contain wild Brook and/or Brown Trout, many of which are on public State Forest and/or State Game Lands, whose boundaries can easily be verified with online SF or SGL maps made available by the state. (Apply the same logic you did in researching the backcountry portion of your trip.)

There are also several larger limestone influenced streams in Central Pennsylvania (general State College area) that are worth consideration. These include Penns, Little J, Spring Creek, and Big Fishing Creek, among a few others. These are more temperamental than the North Central freestone watersheds mentioned above, but can have excellent fishing in the right conditions. They’re a bit of a gamble for a one day outing, but they’re within driving range and worthy of consideration. Hint...If it’s cloudy and/or drizzly, I’d give these strong consideration. If it’s sunny, I’d head north to one of the freestones above. These large limestoners are popular streams, and there is plenty of information available online about where you can safely legally access them. Again, in PA, just don’t walk past Posted signs, unless they specifically say fishing is allowed.

Hope that helps and explains some of the sentiment you’re maybe picking up, and good luck.

I appreciate your assistance Swattie87. I guess some of us have differing views on what is good to share and not; but opinions can differ without personal attacks. I expect nothing but take exception to rudeness. I'm not soft, just was surprised. As usual the vast majority of fly anglers are extremely generous.

I appreciate what you shared, you don't realize how helpful. One thing I haven't really appreciated until your reply that I need to look into further is Limestone v Freestone. This really seems significant and through all of my cartographic research I hadn't yet considered the geological factors yet.

Tight Lines,
- Matt -

 

[Swattie87]

You bet. Everyone who posted a response here is a good guy and was genuinely trying to help I think, and I don’t interpret any of their responses as rude. Though, some are certainly unique. ;-)

 

[maxima12]

Kettle Creek Tackle Shop, Hammersley Forks, Kinney's Country Store and Jeff's Bar, Cross Forks Pa. 2 separate locations. Todays world is a mix of fast and faster, whereas my world was a learned and passive time! Homework was fun and deliberate. Friends were bond by handshakes.

Today, quite different! Only thing shaking is your head on a computer screen. Too bad! For you! Remember your shaking the last drop, while i shook the first!

New direction, it is o k. Old direction, do it your way, was the "Power". Power of you. Power of mind, Power of finding, Power of purpose and a real Power to the People!

Maxima12

 

[nymphingmaniac]

from Dubois head north on 219 to the branches of the Clarion.