Cold Run Schuylkill County Stocking Cancelled

First of all, Google Maps are far from accurate.

To be 100% sure you would have to look at the property parcel map on the Schuylkill County Website to see who owns what and where the actual dividing line is.

You can also look at the SGL 222 map on PA Game Commission website which SHOULD be accurate but could be a few feet off. That map shows only a short section that is 100% within the SGL 222 boundaries on both sides of the stream.

Bottom line, if the dividing lines are in the middle or edges of the stream. It is hard to fish without technically trespassing.
 
Bamboozle wrote:
First of all, Google Maps are far from accurate.

To be 100% sure you would have to look at the property parcel map on the Schuylkill County Website to see who owns what and where the actual dividing line is.

You can also look at the SGL 222 map on PA Game Commission website which SHOULD be accurate but could be a few feet off. That map shows only a short section that is 100% within the SGL 222 boundaries on both sides of the stream.

Bottom line, if the dividing lines are in the middle or edges of the stream. It is hard to fish without technically trespassing.
Click to expand...

^ Good suggestion.

I checked it out. The stream winds in and out of SGL 222. and you can access it from the GL access road. There is one point where the SGL 222 joins and is on both sides of Catawissa Road. Zoom in here using this map link.

I recommend we keep an eye on this section to be sure no private individual tries to block access to public land and the stream that flows through it to make it their own private fishery.
 
Troy wrote:
I'm still wondering what is and what is not state game lands. From the map Afish posted, it still looks like a lot of it is fishable from the game lands road downstream. It just shows that the area from the game lands road upstream is private. If a creek is adjacent to game lands, does that make it public even though the other side is private?
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I don't know if PGC has the land they own or buy surveyed. That's only part of the problem. The other problem is, deeds aren't as accurate as they should be, things such as the big oak tree at the NW corner of the property usually don't exist forever, so a deed that was written 100 years ago, there's no way of knowing how accurate it is. If you go by the post PGC boundary you're probably okay, unless the owner comes out and says you're on private land. If he or she does then don't challenge it call PGC or in the case of State Forests call DCNR. Both Agencies have problems with marking boundaries.
AS to an aerial map, I wouldn't trust them, because the map makers can't go out and look at every site.
Just remember don't argue with a landowner, it makes a bad situation worse.
This particular stream because of the proximity of the run with the boundary you can go from the SGL to private land by going a few feet and you can access the SGL from the road and fish sections of the creek.
 
afish - I see what you mean about that section where the road (and stream) is completely encompassed within the SGL and access should be legal in theory. That being said it looks like it's only about a 200 yd section of stream...I'll be going elsewhere at this point unless the situation on Cold Run changes.

Again, a shame. It's a fun stream. It was on my list of once a year type streams. Not one of my all time favorites necessarily, but was always worth a stop if I was up that way.
 
If you go to the Schuylkill County Parcel map:

http://gis.co.schuylkill.pa.us/mapviewer/

You can find out the landowners names and the boundaries as determined by the County Recorder of Deeds office. Google maps, SGL maps, topo maps, aerial maps, or anything else for that matter doesn’t mean squat if you end up getting nailed for trespassing unless you want to spend even more money disputing a recorded parcel’s boundaries.

That being said, the ONLY places I saw that have both bank access or any access for that matter to Cold Run in SGL 222 are three short sections, one about 900 feet long, another about 1000 feet long and a third 300 feet long. That is IT!

All the other spots along the creek appear to be privately owned but believe whatever map makes you happy and hope the judge agrees with you if you get caught. ;-)
 
Who in the hell was talking about trespassing? There are spots in the SGL. Totally legal. I am going to check out where the posted signs are beforehand, if I ever decide to try and fish it
 
Using Bamboozle's Schuylkill County parcel map, it's significantly different than Google maps. It doesn't really weave in and out of the Game Lands like Google shows.

Below the mouth of Beaver, only about a 200 yd section of stream and road are on game lands.

There's another short section within the game lands above the mouth of Beaver.

In no place here is the stream the actual boundary. The road quite often is.
 
What a shame

I enjoyed "finding" this one and fishing it a few times per year - generally later in the season and in the fall, avoiding times when the private campsite land there would be in use.

I will need to find antoher similar stream - I really liked the gradient on this one, and the relatively wide open rocky streambed actually made for easy casting.

Any ideas for "similar" style streams to put on the exploration list?

I wonder if "crowdfunding" specific land purchases by the pfbc might be something we would see in the future (e.g. kickstarter). Probably hard to come up with the kind of cash needed in this case, even with generous matching funds, but who knows.
 
I wonder who that one landowner is that owns all that land, anyone know?
 
If you are talking about the one I know, he is a fly angler and has joined us on local stream surveys on his land.
 
Bamboozle's map gives a name. I won't mention it here for a couple of reasons.

1. I don't know it to be accurate, especially since there is an indication here that the land has changed hands recently.
2. Even if it were, I don't want to be responsible for demonizing a guy on a public board when I have no clue what his motivations are.
 
Pcray makes a good point. I did not think that Chaz was referring to the landowner who had recently posted and my response was not referencing that landowner either. My response was referring to a landowner who has substantial holdings in that area ( that is what I thought Chaz meant), is a fly angler, and who has been a friend to fishermen with respect to walk in access to at least one stream in the area, even when it was stocked, if not two.
 
Mike wrote:
Pcray makes a good point. I did not think that Chaz was referring to the landowner who had recently posted and my response was not referencing that landowner either. My response was referring to a landowner who has substantial holdings in that area ( that is what I thought Chaz meant), is a fly angler, and who has been a friend to fishermen with respect to walk in access to at least one stream in the area, even when it was stocked, if not two.
Click to expand...
There is one landowner that owns quite a few parcels of land surrounding the Run and SGL. You are correct I wasn't referring to the landowner that brought the land and posted it.
 
I thought this new guy bought all the land and it is now posted. If he only bought some of the land, how can it all be posted now? Did he encourage others to post their land. What exact land did this new owner post? I am now confused more than normal.

Over the years, I have fished pretty much from Beaver Run down a mile with no issues. The only spot I realized I was trespassing on was the spot above the road and below Beaver Run. I didn't fish that again.
 
from the confluence with Beaver Creek down to the lower bridge.....in that area, about the lower half of that is posted. The upper half is still unposted. It's pretty clear based on the signs, no need to parse out map sections.
 
It's pretty clear based on the signs, no need to parse out map sections.
Click to expand...

Unless the posting wasn't done properly...as in each individual landowner (if there's more than one) posting their own property with signs posted in their own name. Sometimes people will post property in their name that is not actually theirs. Suppose the other landowners did band together and agreed to all post their properties, they still each need to do so with signs indicating the proper landowner for each section. If there’s more than one section and more than one landowner, it all can’t be posted under one name. That kind of stuff could be challenged if someone had the motivation and means to do so.

Again, I'll just fish elsewhere until the situation changes. Not worth having to hopscotch 100 or 200 yd sections that are in SGL or subject to unclear posting. Plenty of streams with good, hassle free public access within the same radius of me as Cold Run.
 
If you go on Bamboozle's map, there's really only 2 landowners in question.

One owns the mouth of Beaver the whole way down to the PGC land, and then an additional section below that. 2 separate parcels, same owner.

Then a different owner has a section from the bridge up to a boundary with the above guy.

The short PGC owned section is about the half way point. If it's posted below that, but open above it, that means guy #2 posted his property, and guy #1 posted 1 of his parcels but not the other?

I tried to make it clear on the map. I drew the red lines for where the stream makes a property crossing, and labeled them as owner #1 and owner #2.
 

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Swattie, you may be grasping at straws in that last one.

If two landowners get together and on agrees to allow the other to post his land, I seriously doubt that is illegal. I'd speculate that if one can lease recreational rights, one can also enter a similar agreement on a handshake.

Furthermore, I don't believe there is any law in PA that states the signs must be signed. I've seen that argument used before, and I am pretty sure it is a false argument.

I've seen all kind of arguments about "improper" signage.

Not signed,
Too high.
Attached to trees and not on separate posts with sign boards.
Improper spacing.

All are BS cept for possibly spacing and that is a long shot. If you can convince the judge that you did not see any signs and that you clearly did not know, you May get off without a fine. But if there is no place where you cannot see a single sign, or you did see a sign but entered anyway, forget about it.

If you want to fish there legally, about all you can do is find out who owns the land, and then ask permission. If he had agreed to allow his neighbor to control access. Well, you would have to ask them.

I personally would not have a problem with asking. The worst they could say is "no." As a land owner, my days of ignoring posted signs are over.
 
I'd ask permission or stay away.

 
Hi Everyone,

I drove down thru there the other day after a soggy day of fishing. Which is probably why I now have the flu. Anyhow, the only section that is now posted that was not before, is the campgrounds down before the bridge. This was always private water just with no posted signs. There is still a decent amount of water that can be stocked. This stream used to get hammered, and I could not see it sustaining any fish if it keeps getting the pressure it use to early in the season.
 
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