Big Spring in Newville

[Pa1Fishing]

Hey folks I am new to fly fishing and have a few questions. I normally fish the Yellow Breeches and with it warming up, I am looking for somewhere new. I live in Cumberland county. I was up at Big Spring today. I was just checking it out. I know it’s very hard to fish there but I am up for the challenge. Can you wade in there? I was told it was silt and I would sink. Is the fly fishing only area the best spot to fish? Are dry flies the best to use there with all the vegetation? Is fishing better upstream or downstream? Also how is the Letort Spring run? It’s 5 minutes from my house. I have only caught 1 trout on a dry fly so far. I am excited to try for more

 

[Jay_H]

Neither Big Spring or LeTort are the best to wade in. The fish are spooky. LeTort in particular you will sink in the silt.

Downstream closer to Newville you have areas that are stocked where the fish may not be as difficult. The FFO section sees a lot of use and the fish are particularly spooky in there.

As far as style of fishing that is all dependent on what you are looking to accomplish and time of year. This time of year might be best for terrestrial patterns. Additionally if you want to nymph look for small midge patterns and simple shrimp/scud styles can be productive.

I can’t offer much on LeTort as I’ve fished it only a few times in my life and have had little success (other than the sinking in the silt suggestion).

 

[jifigz]

I like Big Spring. I have never fished the LeTort. Given both streams reputations, don't go hard on yourself if you take a skunking at either one. I wouldn't call either of them beginner level streams.

I have waded and caught fish on Big Spring. I have stalked the bank and caught fish on Big Spring. Do not just start casting. This is careful wading, careful fishing. Casts need to be accurate and placed well. You cannot false cast over and over and slap the water with bad cast after bad cast. That will equal spooked trout, no doubt.

I would suggest a fairly long leader, say 12- 15 feet, and tapered down to at least 5x, but 6x or 7x would be better. Delicately toss dries and put good casts on the water, and you might have a chance.

 

[Wild_Trouter]

If you are newer to FF, Big Spring and Letort may not be for you (yet). Cold water but highly technical even for experienced anglers. You have options in Shippensburg and Chambersburg that are a little more forgiving, but still not easy. Were it me, I would look into the two areas I mentioned and bring some #14 Foam Beetles with you.

 

[6xAdams(Jones)]

How much is the YB warming up below the Children's Lake outfall? It may not be an ideal fishery right now, but the spring bubbles keep the water pretty cool in the main stream down to the theater. You may be able to find cold water at Clarks Creek - if there's a fishable level below the dam. Clarks is across the big river from you so it's a decent drive from the Carlisle area. (Also, several contributors to this forum don't really like it.)

 

[caddisflyer]

Big Spring and Letort are both a PITA to fish. Very specialized kind of fishing. Certainly not the place for a beginner to have an enjoyable experience. Fish the Breeches when temps are better or better yet fish the Conodoguinet with a streamer for bass etc. this time of year.

 

[wgmiller]

A tactic that can be very effective on Big Spring is to dap/drag sculpin patterns around the weed beds. You'd be surprised at the places trout will call home...

 

[Bamboozle]

Hey folks I am new to fly fishing and have a few questions. I normally fish the Yellow Breeches and with it warming up, I am looking for somewhere new. I live in Cumberland county. I was up at Big Spring today. I was just checking it out. I know it’s very hard to fish there but I am up for the challenge. Can you wade in there? I was told it was silt and I would sink. Is the fly fishing only area the best spot to fish? Are dry flies the best to use there with all the vegetation? Is fishing better upstream or downstream? Also how is the Letort Spring run? It’s 5 minutes from my house. I have only caught 1 trout on a dry fly so far. I am excited to try for more

There is really no reason to wade either Big Spring or the Letort and you'll do a WHOLE lot better if you don't...

Those streams are meadow streams which if you are unfamiliar, they are 99.9% of the time fished from the bank; kneeling, crouching or in the sitting position I prefer at the Letort. If this doesn't sound like what you like or are used to, maybe those streams aren't for you...

That being said, you can wade Big Spring where you see gravel or rocks, where you don't... DON'T because of the silt which can literally get you seriously stuck in the mud. Even so they are short stretches and you WILL have to get out and walk around long sections of deep water or silt.

There are VERY, VERY, VERY few places where you can wade the Letort but you have to know where they are and know them well. I do and I still never wade there except on rare occasions at one spot and that's a very short stretch that is about impossible to fish without wading.

Also, both streams can be a LOT deeper than you assume and once you start sinking in the silt, they are literally even deeper and it gets harder to extricate yourself from the silt and the stream.

If I was you and I didn't already have one, I would invest in a stream thermometer and take some water temps on the Yellow Breeches west of Route 34. You may be pleasantly surprised...

If the water is still too warm there is always the Susquehanna or the Conodoguinet for warmwater fish or take a drive east to Clark's Creek that stays very cool. Just expect to deal with a tangled mess of fallen trees if you fish in Section 4, the fly fishing only section.

Good luck!!

 

[Dave_W]

Good advice from Bamboozle (as usual).

My usual advice to newbies visiting Letort/Big Spring is that these streams are not the dry fly mecca that the books and tradition imply (Books by Marinaro, Fox, et al. are always worth a read however).

The trout in these streams are mostly bottom feeders and you will do betters with scuds and sub-surface stuff. There are a LOT more fish in those creeks than are usually visible, especially Letort. Cloudy and rainy days are your friend.

 

[dudemanspecial]

My usual advice to newbies visiting Letort/Big Spring is that these streams are not the dry fly mecca that the books and tradition imply

Is this something that has changed since the old days when these waters became famous or has it always been the same, and those guys just worked extra hard at the dry fly game?

I have never fished the cumberland valley but it is on my radar to get there soon. I love to nymph and stealth fish and am no stranger to fishing 8 hours and going home with little to no catching of actual fish so it sounds right up my alley.

 

[Bamboozle]

Is this something that has changed since the old days when these waters became famous or has it always been the same, and those guys just worked extra hard at the dry fly game?

I have never fished the cumberland valley but it is on my radar to get there soon. I love to nymph and stealth fish and am no stranger to fishing 8 hours and going home with little to no catching of actual fish so it sounds right up my alley.

I've fished the Letort a WHOLE lot more than Big Springs however in the decades I fished there most often the only hatches I experienced with any regularity were Sulphurs and BWO's and the same goes for Green Springs which was another haunt.

I could also reliably find Tricos on the Letort in the FFO area in one or two "secret spots" I discovered (don't ask ). However, I'm talking about a VERY sparse Trico emergence in a small area which despite always yielding me several fish, they were always small.

Of course there was also a good Trico hatch on Falling Springs.

I haven't visited those Letort Trico spots in a long time or even Falling Springs at Trico time so I have no idea if the mini hatch still happens at the upper Letort or with regularity & intensity at Falling Springs. I also haven't fished the Letort for Sulphurs in a long time...

That being said I can offer some clarification and information...

NONE of the hatches I've experienced with the exception of Tricos on Falling Springs back in the 1980's/1990's was intense. The Sulphurs were a close second but in certain spots, not everywhere. The BWO's that I loved to fish in early spring and late fall were almost as sporadic as the Tricos on the upper Letort.

However, for the most part even when there weren't hatches happening, I was still catching the majority of my fish on the surface because I have the patience of a saint when it comes to fishing the Letort or Big Springs...

IMHO - I believe that patience is the most important attribute you need for success.

I literally sit down and park my a$$ on the bank, light a cigar and WAIT until I see a riser. If nothing happens after a decent amount of time, I move up to another spot and do the same thing versus walking up and down the stream looking for risers.

This waiting game isn't for everybody as evidenced by having anglers walk past me two or more times hunting for risers and getting skunked. They are usually shocked to see me in the same spot or nearby and even more shocked when I tell them I caught a few fish.

Bottom line, if this S-L-O-W-E-D down approach would drive you nuts, expect the Letort & Big Springs to drive you nuts too!!

One other thing, Big Springs is 1000% easier to fish than the Letort since all of the stream improvement work was done several years ago. It is very easy to walk along most of its length and access the stream almost anywhere.

For that reason it gets a LOT more pressure than the Letort and it a lot harder to do the waiting game thing because there are always folks coming up behind you or ahead of you. Regardless, even if you get skunked you can have a fun day learning how to approach the challenge.

However the Letort is physically a PIA to fish, especially in the last 20 years so IF you get skunked on top of that it's like surviving a plane crash and finding out when you get back to the airport that your car was towed...

Good luck when you finally give it a go!!

 

[JimKennedy]

Don’t wade big spring or letort. You will screw up the creeks for yourself and everyone else who fishes that day.

The creeks both flow through what are essentially swamps and briar patches, so boots are essential.

This time of year, show up at first light and fish until the sun is on the water. Fish upstream, paying particular attention to the near bank. It’s counterintuitive, but the fish hugging the near bank are less likely to be spooked.

Fishing both creeks is as much about stalking and hunting as about fishing. Getting close and making a very precise cast produces better results than the pageantry of a long cast, with all of the potential for casting shadows and generating drag.

Best flies will be hoppers and beetles, and streamers.

Hopper dropper rig works ok on big spring, but is hard to manage on the letort, in my experience.

For best fishing experience, don’t fish near anyone else, even if you are with a buddy. Split up to maximize the amount of time you have fishing over places where you are the first one making casts that day.

After the sun is on the water, head on over to boiling springs and fish for stockers in the outflow from children’s lake. It helps ease the sting your soul endures when you get skunked on big spring and letort.

Best of luck!

 

[TimMurphy]

Is this something that has changed since the old days when these waters became famous or has it always been the same, and those guys just worked extra hard at the dry fly game?

I have never fished the cumberland valley but it is on my radar to get there soon. I love to nymph and stealth fish and am no stranger to fishing 8 hours and going home with little to no catching of actual fish so it sounds right up my alley.

Dear dudemanspecial,

One other thing that no one has mentioned so far is that prior to Operation Future in the early 1980's both the Letort and Big Spring received thousands of stocked trout every year. Big Spring as an added bonus had a hatchery located on its source. Many thousands of fish escaped annually.

There were a lot more fish in those streams when Marinaro and Fox plied their banks and far fewer fly fishermen too.

Regards,

Tim Murphy

 

[jifigz]

There are still a lot of fish in Big Spring. It's all Class A (I think) AND much of it gets stocked. It's just hard to find success. These are hard streams. Therein lies the enjoyment, the challenge.

 

[just_jon]

I fish Big Spring on average 30+ days a year and find it best to stay out of the water as much as possible. There are areas (below Nealy Road) where wading cannot be avoided if one wants to fish the main channel. Don't let Big Spring get in your head. There are tons of trout eager to take the fly, but given the fishing pressure, they do not generally tolerate unstealthily approaches and bad casting.

Ninety percent of my fishing is done with a tandem nymph rig using a #16 cress bug with either a #18 scud or #22 red zebra midge trailing. Streamer fishing can be very productive at first and last light. Think sculpin. If you see a riser during the day, odds are that it will take an ant.

 

[Bamboozle]

Dear dudemanspecial,

One other thing that no one has mentioned so far is that prior to Operation Future in the early 1980's both the Letort and Big Spring received thousands of stocked trout every year. Big Spring as an added bonus had a hatchery located on its source. Many thousands of fish escaped annually.

There were a lot more fish in those streams when Marinaro and Fox plied their banks and far fewer fly fishermen too.

Regards,

Tim Murphy

A couple of related interesting facts I discovered perusing my collection of Summary Booklets that goes back to 1948 and is complete from the mid 1960's to the present:

Neither Big Springs or the Letort were listed as Approved Trout Waters in 1960.​

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In 1965 (I don't have 1960-1964) they were both listed.​

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In 1973, both were added (along with the Yellow Breeches) to the "Fish For Fun" special regulation which was fly fishing only with one 20" fish per day harvest permitted. Also interesting is that in 1973, wading was prohibited except at the Breeches.​

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Both the Letort & Big Springs were listed as Approved Trout waters until 1987 when the Letort was dropped from the list.​

Of course the Summary Booklets at that time were not as detailed as they are today so it is hard to know exactly where the stockings occurred. In addition Big Springs is stocked to this day and the Letort is privately stocked once for a kid's fishing derby below the fly fishing only section.

Regardless I found it interesting that the Fish Commission was still stocking the Letort as late as 1987 which probably had to do with the sewage plant being upgraded around that time which allowed the entire stream (save for Section 1) to be upgraded to Class A.