Bamboo Rods?

It's a bout time you chimed in, These guys are ganging up on me. :-D

I know, it is because of your job, and all the grass jokes. Just tell them you don't inhale.
 
Has any one ever cast a bamboo rod loaded with silk line?


A well maintained cane rod will grow in value..
 
sundrunk wrote:
Has any one ever cast a bamboo rod loaded with silk line?


A well maintained cane rod will grow in value..

I did when I was a kid, but the line had not been maintained well. I do have a couple silk lines now that I have cleaned and are ready to restore. Some day. New silk lines are quite expensive and I'm a cheap SOB.

All the rods I have rebuild so far, I have rebuild with larger guides for modern lines. Notice i don't use the term "restore." that is a whole different ballgame. Other than minor repairs, I haven't done any "restorations." But I might do a restoration on a 20s vintage rod this winter. Haven't decided. It's actually a round rod, but still made of split bamboo. 9.5 foot and very whippy. Reel seat looks like the rod might be an old Chubb, but I'm thinking it is an English rod. No name on it, so those are slightly educated guesses. I'm thinking of restoring it, and using a silk line. It would be good practice and will make a nice bluegill rod.
 
My first fly line was a new Gladding Transluent, they have a special smooth feel, due to the way they were braided, it was a level line, double tapered lines were around $10.00 12 bucks then which was expensve then I think the South Bend 290 was $12.50. This is a great thread, arguments the way they should be.
 
You buy bamboo rods on faith; the faith of our fathers. That is bamboo is the best material for fly rods. I did. But it took me about a year to adapt and learn the correct casting stoke for the cane. It’s very subtle. Now I can cast as far as any graphite and with the accuracy to make a proper presentation of the fly. And I like to think that accuracy for that presentation is far better then any plastic rod. Don't get me wrong, I am not a snob and I more often fish graphite (carbon fiber is the more correct term, graphite is in fact a great dry lubricant, as my Dad taught me.). However, it has to be the right bamboo rod. In 1978 I was fortunate purchase a new Palakona 8' 2 pcs 6 wgt made by the old masters at Hardy. Because of it's accuracy, this rod is perfect for the Little Lehigh where presentation is everything and where I primarily fish it. No, this bamboo 6 wgt is not to heavy for the LL. Yes, a 6 wgt, plastic rod is; it doesn't protect the tippet. This 2 pcs bamboo is a beautiful light rod. If such a thing could exist, this is a fast action bamboo rod. But still as a 6 wgt, the single fly for the most trout this rod has taken has been on a #24 trico spinner. Again, due to it’s accuracy & presentation. I don’t have to think at all about the cast; it’s just there.

From my father-in-law I inherited 3 bamboo rods, 2 pre WW2 Grangers, one’s a 3 wgt & the other a 4 wgt and a post War South Bend 6/7 wgt. Those old guys were tough; even though I’m a big guy I can’t cast the South Bend for more then half a day. And they used heavy automatic fly reels to add even more weight. After fishing the 3 & 4 wgt Grangers, I really prefer my plastic rods in the lighter wgts. So I don’t use these 3 cane rods very much. But I still love my 6 wgt.

As to why bamboo has this mythical property of casting ability and the often referred to “feel” so revered by us devotees, the only explanation I have is this: All manmade materials are a transverse woven fabric. They must have a cross weave to support them longitudinally, or else they would collapse along their length. And when the carbon fabric is wrapped on the mandrel to be baked into a rod, the longitudinal carbon strands are in a matrix crisscrossing each other at various angles. Therefore, all glass or graphite rods have a built in oscillation caused by their base material and the manner of their construction. No matter how carefully they are constructed or how carefully you cast, the rod tip will oscillate in a figure 8. Whereas bamboo has all its strength in it’s cells. Both on the interior of each cell and in the bound to each other, they don’t need any transverse support to keep them from collapsing along the rod’s length. If a well made bamboo rod was mounted onto a metronome and set in motion, in time, it will settle into and the rod tip will scribe a path in exactly the same plane. Just like a pendulum on a grandfather clock, as I learned in my high school physics. Then the rod can cast the line in exactly the same plane and thus be on target. Only the caster can input an outside force causing the rod tip to oscillate and deviate from that plane and thus imparting that oscillation onto the line so that it travels in side to side loops and misses the caster’s intended target. But now in the reeeal world how many fly fishers can move the rod in the same plane with no oscillation thus keeping the tip and line travelling in the same plane? I don’t know. There must be some that can consistently. And some of time, I believe all of us are able to do this. So theoretically, due to it’s cellular structure only bamboo is capable of allowing you to become the best caster you can be. But the only way to find out is to get your own bamboo rod and experience the “feel” for yourself. Then you too, can keep the faith.
Tightlines, Larry
 
Larry while I enjoy fishing bamboo, I gotta tell you, my brain just had a hernia! Oh! …. And I’m still a lousy caster.

Rolf
 
Larry, how do you feel about steel rods? Theoretically of course. :-D
 
Larry, the heavier reels did not make casting more difficult back in the day. They actually made it easier on the heavier rods. I have a couple heavy bamboo rods that I use regularly. My steelhead rod is a 9 foot 6/7 weight. My bass rod is closer to an eight weight (but casts a 7 just fine), and the taper is specifically for throwing bass bugs an such (fast action for cane). Both these rods actually cast easier with an old automatic reel especially the bass rod which clearly weighs more (it’s a club, but dang it shoots line well). I have cast it all day with the automatic, but with a lighter reel I feel it sooner. The automatic reels balance those rods. The old automatic reels were never very popular though, because for lighter rods they were definitely too heavy. I don’t use the automatics very often anymore because there is no room for backing (for steelhead), and my bass rod is down for repair so the steelhead rod is doing double (and sometimes triple duty). It is harder to cast with the Okuma reel (shown in the avatar), but I manage. I’ll eventually put a large arbor on it.
 
Attached is a picture of my bass rod before I rebuilt it. this was before I built a steelhead rod. The bass taper was too stiff for steelhead. It WAS a Shakespeare Springbrook Bass Weight (Made by South Bend in probably the 50s). Notice the Shakespeare automatic reel from about the same time period.

Now this rod has a birdseye maple reel seat with detachable fighting butt and a new grip. Everything else is pretty much the same. I was even able to match the windings.
 
Don't know who that Larry guys is but he certainly knows how to describe the casting traits of bamboo. Good job Bud!
 
Following up on what Farmer Dave said
I use what are called rod balancing wts. on my spinning rods.They are lead wts. that go in a rubber sleeve that fits over the butt of the rods.This makes the rods feel lighter even though you are adding wt..Its the leverage factor that causes wrist fatigue,not the wt. of the rod.
Big mistake to use ultra light reels on the longer rods.You want the balance point right at the bottom of where your hand fits on the fly rod grip,not above IMHO.
 
I'm surprised that so many posters on this thread are dismissive of cane rods, many without truly trying them. American made production bamboo rods of the pre-fiberglass era (with exceptions) typically are slow, soft and generally weak sticks designed primarily for wet fly fishing (and to be quickly and cheaply made.) They have little in common with the custom cane rods of the latter half of the 20th century and those made today. As Larry has told us the chief virtue of a good bamboo rod is its ability to place a fly precisely where the caster wants it. In fact this was exactly the comment my dad made after fishing with a rod I gave him in 1975, a rod made by Bob Summers of Traverse City, Michigan. My dad was fond of Fenwick glass rods until that year; he never again fished with a glass rod or any other rod for that matter.

An oft heard criticism of cane rods is that they are too heavy. True, for a given size they are heavier than graphite. To me the weight of a cane rod is a distinct advantage, just as an upland shotgun can be too light, flying so quickly to the shoulder that it bounces around and is difficult to get on and to track the target as the shooter swings it, so too can the fly rod be too light. The cane rod, built of high quality bamboo to a well designed taper, delivers a cast with authority, yet with little effort. It's at once powerful and delicate. A good caster will always know where the tip is and where it's going, and the tip will not collapse when pushed. And the line, leader and fly will surely follow.

Cane rods are expensive. No argument here, but still there are bargains to be found, some for not much more than a Sage or other such high-end graphite rod.

I have owned quite a few cane rods since I first cast a friend's Sharps Scotty on the Little Sandy more years ago than I like to remember, and I currently own 25, ranging in length from 4 ft. to 8 1/2 ft., mainly two piece, but I have a number of 3 and 4 piece rods as well. But I have been building them for over twenty years so the expense has not been great. The one cane rod I own that I did not build is the 7 1/2' Summers that I gave my dad so many years ago. It became mine when he fished around the bend.

Rods by classic makers such as Payne, Leonard, Gillum, Halstead, and especially those lovely parabolic tapers from the Paul Young Company, are marvels of design and craftsmanship, and are casting tools without equal. Those who think cane rods belong to the misty waters of days long gone should cast a Paul Young Perfectionist or Midge or Driggs or Para. 15. Those who revel in the tradition of our sport should do the same.
 
cimarronred wrote:
I'm surprised that so many posters on this thread are dismissive of cane rods, many without truly trying them.

I'm surprised how many are antagonistic of the people who use bamboo. Or those that assume the people who like 'boo rods are historical reanactors or something.

I think a lot of the anti-bamboo rod sentiment is based on strange assumptions.

I like bamboo because it works well for the type of fishing I enjoy. I don't always use it, but I do enjoy it.
 
I am surprised how deeply into physics Larry was willing to delve to justify an expensive habit.
 
If you guys would get me the Orvis anniversary rod i'll give grass a try.
 
Hmmm,

My reading of Larry's post shows that he bought a cane rod in 1978, and he then inherited 3 others. For someone who stands accused of trying to 'justify an expensive habit' he appears to have fallen well short of the 'expensive' threshold.
 
I'm not surprised you took issue with my comments, but I don't see why it had to be interpreted as his habit he was justifying.
 
Now, Jack, see how easy it is to be misunderstood when you play the gadfly.
 
I'm not surprised I was misunderstood. :cool:
 
Good rejoinder, Jack. My compliments.
 
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