Upper Delaware - Cannonsville release question

And then this past October as well. They were pumping 1200+ since almost the end of Sept. one day fishing on the mainstem, they knocked the flow from stilesville from 1200 down to 200. Saw pics of juvenile browns caught in weed beds from the upper west. Youd think the dec would step in here as they killed fish...but nyc has so much money that honestly to me it wouldnt even matter, theyll get away with it. But as anglers we need to realize one thing. Before these reservoirs were built, there were no trout. It was walleye and smallmouth. The reservoirs were built for NYC, not for us anglers. Its a tough situation all around.
 
They were almost out of water....Wallenpaupack was shut off.....no rain. It was a perfect storm of bad things that came together. It sucks but what can you do? I was wading the Main the day the water dropped. Billions of caddis were left high and dry. Huge sections of the riverbed were exposed. Who knows what damage was done. We'll find out in a few weeks. Shortly after shutting off the flow from Cannonsville, the started dumping from Pepacton. They had to because almost all other contributing lakes were dreadfully low and the salt line was moving north.

 
I was floating the main back in oct when they shut it off. We were luckily ahead of it and it didnt really effect is much. But Turpin was up on the west and fishing just shut off and it got ****** real quick. We continued to catch fish on caddis patterns. They should not get to the point where they run out of water. I understand it was a dry summer but pepacton had plenty of water to dunp instead of draining cannonsville, then shutting it off. Doesnt make any sense.
 
Kev,

A few years back, the WB flow was dropped to 0 cfs for an hour. I thin the flow went.....700 cfs release.....to 0 for almost an hour..... and then straight to 1000 cfs. The river was littered with guide boats that were stuck on gravel bars.

You say that no release from Pepacton doesn't make any sense....sure it does. Pepacton has a much higher quality water. The lake is for NYC drinking water. The 2 highest quality lakes (Pepacton and Neversink) will be hoarded and released as a last resort. Once Wallenpaupack and Cannonsville were depleted, Pepacton let water out. Does that help explain the situation a little better?

I wish the summer release at Downsville was 500-600 cfs instead of the standard 125 cfs. It used to get more water and fished longer into the season. But if you do that....it warms by the time it reaches Hancock which would further dilute the cold water from Cannonsville. It's a pretty complex situation.

Next time you see Ben, ask if he has any new info on the aqueduct system. It's been an ongoing project since the late 70's (I believe). Nearly half the water transferred from lake to lake....eventually to NYC is lost through cracks / leaks in the system. IF they ever finish the project, they'd be able to release 1000 cfs from each lake from May 1st through September 1st and be no worse for storage compared to the crap releases of present. They are losing that much water currently to the leaky system.
 
Well, if they released more out of pepacton but not too much to drain it down it would make sense. Fishing would be a longer season on the lower east. They need a plan that works. Cuz whatever they have now is rediculous. Yoyo flows every year.
 
And yes andy it makes sense. I just wish they would make an even release on both reservoirs.
 
And now the latest release ........from FUDR

Hi Everybody,

Here's an update from the NYC Department of Environmental Protection on the recent water releases from the Cannonsville and Pepacton reservoirs to the West and East Branches of the Upper Delaware River:

Hi, folks. I'm following up from my note last week with a quick update on New York City's reservoir storage and release plans.

Because of rain and snowmelt, the past three days have brought a combined total of 17 billion gallons of runoff into Cannonsville and Pepacton. While we're happy to see the reservoirs refilling, DEP must also strive to meet a storage objective in its reservoirs this time of year. The FFMP says we should aim to keep storage no higher than 93 percent as of now.

That is why we began larger releases from Cannonsville Reservoir last week. We have been releasing 1,500 cubic feet per second (975 mgd) from Cannonsville into the West Branch, and we plan to continue that for at least the next week. We will not be ramping down this weekend as previously planned. Doing so would cause the reservoir to fill beyond the objective and cause it to spill earlier.

We have also increased releases from Pepacton Reservoir. We are currently releasing about 835 cubic feet per second (450 mgd) into the East Branch. That will likely continue for at least the next week as well.

I hope this information is helpful. And, as always, please feel free to email or call with any questions.
 
I have only fished the upper east a handful of times when the release is 600+. It was on fire every time.

Krayfish- so if pepacton released 600 cfs, it would warm by Hancock? I assumed the big east got warm because of the bkill influence but I think I missed the bigger picture. What you say makes sense, it's a longer run from downsville to Hancock than stilesville to Hancock. Is a 5:1 release ratio (cannonsville to pepacton) the optimal ratio to keep the main stem cold?
 
Not sure about the optimum ratio. I'm not that advanced. The thing that makes the EB tougher to manage is how much hits it from the Beaverkill and how warm would that water be? Air temps would be a factor as would sun because that river is so friggin wide.

125 cfs from Downsville usually keeps it fishable 3/4 of the ways to the Jaws under normal summer conditions. If it's cool or wetter it can extend to the Jaws or even Fishes Eddy. You then bump that release to 600 cfs of 44 degree water, it might hit 58-60 degrees by the time it hits the Jaws. Add 200 cfs of bathwater from the Beaverkill and the temp at Fishes Eddy gets into the mid / upper 60's. If it's a cool summer, it might not hit 70 until Cadosia which would give a ton more water for fish to stay in all summer. Just be smart and let them alone one the water surpasses 66 degrees.

At the junction, you'd be adding 700-800 cfs of 71-73 degree water. If the WB releases are 400....no bueno. It would cool the Main to Stockport maybe. If the WB were letting out 700-900 cfs, it should be good to Buckingham or Lordville.

If they will release 500-700 from Cannonsville, you should be able to double or triple the Pepacton release. Bumping Pepacton might offer 5-10 miles of additional thermal refuge on the EB. It won't offer any floatable water for the guides so don't expect them to lobby for it. It could also diminish the length of fishable water on the Main if the WB release was on the lower end.

It's pretty damn complex and I wouldn't want the job of releasing water. Lol. At any rate, letting out another 125 cfs from Pepacton could only help by increasing thermal refuge with minimal impact on the Main. Just my opinion based on quite a few years of watching the circus up there.
 
Welp, looks like opening day on the West Branch will consist of tossing meat. Ive never seen flows this high this early from releases. Maybe from torrential rains, but not from the nycdep. Soon enough youll be seeing hendricksons and blue quills.
 
Flows are high already and the bulk of the rain hasn't even gotten here. 3000-5000 cfs is not conducive to good wading. Some a-holes will try it because "it's opening day" and will drown. Get the body bags ready.
 
Streamer water right there. lol. In all seriousness though, I've pulled enough bodies out of the river nearby me (fire dept) to know water is not something to mess with. Its all good, until its not, and then your done for. Looks like a good weekend to tie some more flies.
 
They won't rent you a boat once the water on the WB gets near 2000. I have floated it when it was 5000 at Stilesville and over 7000 at Hale. Best dry fly fishing Wed had. Go figure. Lol.

You must respect the power of the water or get measured for a casket before you set out for your trip.
 
Get ready for meat slinging and bloody wet fingers!! Happy opening day!!
 
Some serious water flows up there for sure!

I have in for vacation two weeks out. And had hopes of fishing hendricksons up there.
But I really doubt that they're be any decent flow rates even then - for wading anyways. Especially if we keep getting rain.
 
The rivers dropped a little bit today, but are still not considered wade-able, except for Upper East near Downsville.
 
They are rising like a rocket. Stilesville remains at a 1400 release but it swells to 3500 by Hale. Almost 2k at Harvard! Fishes Eddy is 5500 and rising hard and the Beaverkill is 4500 and going straight up. Loving it. The bows should have no problem getting in or out of the feeders with the levels that high.

It would be amazing if both branches stayed at 2k til memorial day. Keep the water coming. After last year's drought, we still need lots of slow steady rain to saturate the ground below 3".
 
I'm tellin ya Kray, you better hitch up the boat, she is gonna spill!
 
Hmmm. The full moon is on the 11th, Saturday is the 8th. Close enough? Are their even any baitfish left in the lake after the drawdown?
 
Saw a report that cannonsville is current spilling.

Hmmm...... Far drive to find out the alewives didn't make the trip over the dam along with the water.

Edit: I've heard it doesnt spill until reaching 106% capacity. However, it is only at 98.8. It certainly looks like it will go after this next rain event, but its possible the report I saw was not accurate.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dep/html/drinking_water/maplevels_wide.shtml
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Montana Angler Fly Fishing
Montana Angler Fly Fishing
Harman's North Fork Cottages


Real Time Data From
the USGS Site

Share this page

Back
Top