Timbers - 2018-2019 Thread

[tztrout]

Had a great non venomous encounter the other day. Headed down a game land trail to reach a favorite small stream- patch of grass in front of us started vibrating. I thought it might be an injured bird, but on closer inspection turned out to be a decent sized black racer. It was rattling its tail and assuming strike posture. It was really pissed that we were disturbing the morning hunt! We had to walk well around as it wasn't backing down.

 

[troutbert]

tztrout wrote:
Had a great non venomous encounter the other day. Headed down a game land trail to reach a favorite small stream- patch of grass in front of us started vibrating. I thought it might be an injured bird, but on closer inspection turned out to be a decent sized black racer. It was rattling its tail and assuming strike posture. It was really pissed that we were disturbing the morning hunt! We had to walk well around as it wasn't backing down.

Do any snakes rattle their tails other than rattlesnakes?

It sounds to me like you encountered a rattlesnake.

 

[tztrout]

It was 100% a black racer.It was vibrating it's tail, shifting coils, and generally acting aggressively to try and scare us off. Hognose snakes are also known to do this before resorting to playing dead.

 

[dc410]

troutbert wrote:

tztrout wrote:
Had a great non venomous encounter the other day. Headed down a game land trail to reach a favorite small stream- patch of grass in front of us started vibrating. I thought it might be an injured bird, but on closer inspection turned out to be a decent sized black racer. It was rattling its tail and assuming strike posture. It was really pissed that we were disturbing the morning hunt! We had to walk well around as it wasn't backing down.

Do any snakes rattle their tails other than rattlesnakes?

It sounds to me like you encountered a rattlesnake.

Many snakes vibrate their tails when they feel threatened and take on a defensive posture. God just happened to attach rattles to the rattlesnakes tail. I’ve seen black snakes do it many times and they generally carry a serious attitude with it as well.

 

[Mike]

Used to occasionally catch eastern hognose snakes in the Poconos when I was a teen. Never had one rattle or play dead. On the other hand, the black rat snakes that I caught there and in NW Pa rattled on rare occasions.

 

[Mike]

Ah dc410, you lucky duck. I spent a lot of my youth and even some adult years in the areas of Exeter and Lower Alsace Twsps on the lookout for herps whenever I was in the areas where copperheads have now been officially recorded and never saw one. I feel jipped. I am very surprised that I never saw one smashed on some key roads in those areas as well since I also did a lot of bicycling in the area.

As for work, I surveyed wild and stocked streams around much of the state and never saw a copperhead or timber rattler. My crew, however, ran into two copperheads in the same general location in Berks Co.

Because a friend was doing radio telemetry with timber rattlesnakes, I was able to see a number of those in the wild . Very docile critters. For those watching out where they step, I learned to be very attentive when stepping over or onto blowdowns of about 5-12 inches in diameter in the woods in areas where those snakes generally occur. They lie in wait in a striking position for small mammals using the tops of "logs" as pathways.

 

[tomgamber]

If you're looking for rattlers (although I don't recommend doing so) head up to Cameron and Clinton counties. The high water has them moving and just about everywhere right now. Pics being posted by locals nearly every day on a FB page I frequent.. They were congregating en masse on the breasts of the dams as the water rose a couple weeks ago. The more noise you make along the streams, the less you'll see. A practice of mine.

 

[Acristickid]

Here is a timber rattlesnake I came across walking Lilly on way back to Laurel Mountain ski area.

I see one a year- always in July or August as they are on the move for mates.


https://imgur.com/a/NeUbdZ1]

You don’t need to have the app to view.

 

[FCP]

I believe that Mike grew up in the Mt. Penn area of Reading. He may be unaware of the recent copperhead incident in Mt Penn.

FCP


Wed Jun 19 2019
Woman bitten by copperhead while doing laundry

Snake made attack in Mount Penn basement

BY STEVEN HENSHAW
READING EAGLE

A Mount Penn woman was bitten by a venomous snake Tuesday morning when she went to her basement to do laundry, officials said.

Central Berks Regional police responded along with emergency medical personnel to the home in the 2400 bock of Fairview Avenue shortly before 8 a.m. after the woman called 9-1-1 to report she was bitten in the arm by a rattlesnake.

The woman’s name is Judy Reed, according to her daughter Danelle Reed, who said Tuesday night that her mother was treated and admitted at Reading Hospital and would be staying at least overnight.

“She was in a lot of pain, there was a lot of swelling, and she had tingling in her arm” before she was treated, the daughter said.

The roughly 2-foot-long reptile was a copperhead snake that had been resting on a shelf near the washing machine.

Reed was treated by paramedics and transported to Reading Hospital.

Police called in personnel from the Pennsylvania Fish & Boat Commission, which bagged the snake and moved it to a safer location.

Fairview Avenue sits part way up the southern slope of Neversink Mountain, where copperheads are found.

Detective Sgt. Deron Manndel said Fish & Boat personnel said the snake, likely an adolescent, was probably seeking refuge from the recent soggy weather and got into the basement through one of several holes in the foundation.

Reports of venomous snakebites are rare in the state.

According to the Fish & Boat Commission, the copperhead, the timber rattlesnake and the eastern massasauga are the only three venomous snakes in the state. Copperheads are the most common.

All three species are usually not aggressive and prefer to avoid humans by moving away or keeping still until the person is gone.

Contact Steven Henshaw: 610-371-5024 or shenshaw@readingeagle.com .

 

[Mike]

Thanks FCP,
This just added to the frustration of having not seen any in the area hills in the past, as this one in the story was only about a half mile from my homestead. Probably beyond hope is that harmless and beneficial eastern milk snakes in the area will not be misidentified as copperheads.

A friend near there a few days later had a milk snake under his truck's hood near the rear of the dashboard. They are sometimes attracted to automobiles' engine compartments because mice stash seeds in the cabin filters. When they catch the mice they then leave the vehicle.

 

[riverwhy]

Can anyone tell me if there are copperheads in the Furnace Hills on the border of Lancaster and Lebanon counties? I grew up there and heard stories all the time about copperheads. We saw tons of watersnakes along Middle Creek, and one time someone killed what they said was a copperhead though I now don't believe it was. I have fished a ton and hunted and hiked those hills and still no sightings.

I am also curious how many of you see watersnakes regularly? I have not seen one in probably ten years. Used to see tons sometimes multiple snakes all intertwined. It was terrifying as a kid! I used to see them regularly on Penn's also but not for years. Just wondering if the snake population has crashed for some reason.

 

[Swattie87]

Given their geographic range, I can’t see any reason why they’re not in the Furnace Hills, but I haven’t seen one either, and I’ve fished there a lot. They’re hard to spot though. Statically they’re more common than Rattlers, but I’ve seen a ton of Rattlers in PA, and never a Copperhead. Assume it’s a product of Rattlers being easier to see (and at times hear), and I’m just not noticing the Copperheads. :-o

I would see Northern Waters all the time WW fishing the Swatara, but thanks to the constantly blown out flows I haven’t fished it in 2 years. I would see at least one nearly every trip though. Those things are jerks.

 

[afishinado]

Swattie87 wrote:
Given their geographic range, I can’t see any reason why they’re not in the Furnace Hills, but I haven’t seen one either, and I’ve fished there a lot. They’re hard to spot though. Statically they’re more common than Rattlers, but I’ve seen a ton of Rattlers in PA, and never a Copperhead. Assume it’s a product of Rattlers being easier to see (and at times hear), and I’m just not noticing the Copperheads. :-o

I would see Northern Waters all the time WW fishing the Swatara, but thanks to the constantly blown out flows I haven’t fished it in 2 years. I would see at least one nearly every trip though. Those things are jerks.

I have the same experience as Swattie. I've seen many timber rattlers in PA, but never a copperhead.

I will say, I have a cabin in the Noxen area on South Mountain where the "rattlesnake roundup" is held every year, so it's no surprise that seeing timber rattlers is a common occurrence there, but I've also seen many in other areas of PA in all my travels.

 

[franklin]

jifigz wrote:

laszlo wrote:
Speaking of snakes, as I walked down to the stream this evening I noticed a dead fish at the edge of the stream, about a 8 inch wild brown. Thought this was odd because I never saw a dead fish along this stream before. As I got closer the fish slowly started to move into the water, it was then I realized the fish was being dragged away by a large snake.

I once saw a rather large timber rattler in the middle of my favorite brookie stream. He was happily ingesting a 10" or so stocked rainbow trout. I'm guessing someone caught the trout, it died, and the snake happened upon an easy meal. Or maybe that rattle caught the fish.

I've seen copperheads take live sunnys. Used to see a lot of Copperheads around Leaser Lake in Lehigh Cty.

 

[FarmerDave]

I'm not being critical to anyone, not even you Franklin. ;-)

But...

The vast majority of "copperhead" sightings in PA are actually water snakes. Very similar markings, but with colors reversed. But I do understand copperhead are more common in the southern half of the state.

I've never seen a copperhead in the wild, probably because most of my time in the outdoors in PA has been in NWPA I've however seen a lot of watersnakes, and a few with fish in their mouth. One was floating down the Clarion with a chub in it's mouth. Sasquatch would call that a good snake.

Been seeing a lot of snakes around the farm again this year but so far only browns and garters. Every time I mow, I see at least one. Yesterday I saw one and a third. ;-)

I found the 1/3 snake after the dog carried it to the deck. I always wondered what he would do if he found a snake. Now I know. It's possible I hit it with the mower and dog found a piece of it, but it was clear that he had been chewing on it.

Have seen milk snakes before, but so far none this year. When I was a kid, dad called them house snakes because they were commonly found in basements of older houses.

 

[afishinado]

Found a really nice video about a 42 mile backpack hike through the PA woods fishing in remote streams for brook trout.

While viewing the video, I see the hikers ran into several timber rattlers on their hike (no copperheads, though...lol).

This video pretty much sums up my experiences in the PA woods. It's worth giving it a look.

 

[Swattie87]

^ I watched that this weekend too! These guys make some consistently darn good videos. Good balance of slick production, entertaining, and informative.

They're north of the Copperhead's range in PA, so I wouldn't necessarily expect one up there. But that general area has a dense population of Rattlers. They can become very locally abundant in spots, as was evident here.

For anyone watching, one small piece of constructive criticism of what you see in this video...I know it was early season yet (mid-May), but I'd recommend wearing at least long pants for that kind of excursion. Mainly from a tick perspective, but also Rattlers. (I also wear knee high snake gaiters up in that area.) I was nervous watching them walk through the young undergrowth in just shorts, and crocs at some points. (See the title shot on the link afish posted for what I mean.) By now, those ferns are much taller and you can't always 100% see where you're putting your feet. My experience with Rattlers is they don't all rattle at you (most I've encountered haven't actually), and in some cases I was within one step and striking distance before I saw them. They still didn't move or get defensive, and I think you'd actually have to step on it to get bit, but I think this underscores the value of gaiters.

Maybe the Rattler encounters (especially the night one) will lead them to the same conclusion I came to regarding wearing gaiters up there! Sounds like they learned a good bit from the outro to the video. Good stuff.

Link to the gaiters I have:

Snake Gaiters

Enough adjustability to go over both pants alone, and waders. Mine are about 10 years old and I'm sure I have hundreds or even thousands of miles walked in them. For $50, they're one of the best value purchases I've ever made in terms of FFing gear. I wear them any time I'm north or west of Blue Mountain, or in Michaux SF. Though honestly, I should just wear them 100% of the time as if nothing else, they're very good at protecting your lower waders from thorns and stick punctures.

 

[salmonoid]

riverwhy wrote:
Can anyone tell me if there are copperheads in the Furnace Hills on the border of Lancaster and Lebanon counties? I grew up there and heard stories all the time about copperheads. We saw tons of watersnakes along Middle Creek, and one time someone killed what they said was a copperhead though I now don't believe it was. I have fished a ton and hunted and hiked those hills and still no sightings.

I am also curious how many of you see watersnakes regularly? I have not seen one in probably ten years. Used to see tons sometimes multiple snakes all intertwined. It was terrifying as a kid! I used to see them regularly on Penn's also but not for years. Just wondering if the snake population has crashed for some reason.

Watersnakes - usually see at least one per outing. They tend to startle me at times, particularly when they are up on the bank and you spook them, and they all but launch off the bank into the stream.

Wasn't during a fishing outing, but we saw four of these at Haystacks on the Loyalsock on Saturday afternoon...

This guy hung out on the rock about six feet from where we set up our chairs, for pretty much the whole afternoon. He finally spooked when a couple of swimmers came up to interrogate him a bit.

 

[FarmerDave]

troutbert wrote:

Do any snakes rattle their tails other than rattlesnakes?

It sounds to me like you encountered a rattlesnake.

Other species will vibrate their tail. I think hognose are known for mimicking a rattler.

 

[salmonoid]

From a 6/29 outing in NW PA...

I mistakenly had convinced myself there weren't rattlers in the county we were in (don't remember what map I had looked at), and so the few times I've fished there, I've been rather cavalier about brush busting and wading through ferns. I was particularly bad on this past trip, wading through ferns with somewhat reckless abandon. This guy was up on the bank streamside and buzzed my brother when he got about three feet from him. I had to climb out of the water to see him (high bank), but he was pretty well hidden in the ferns.

I run about 1 in 3 rattlers that I see that actually rattle at me, and usually see one every few years. I was one foot from stepping on one last year on a cool rainy day (never rattled), so I'm keeping pace with the rattling percentage and running above average on sightings.