laurelhighlander
Member
Is it possible for a stocked fingerling to grow up and reproduce?
Stocked fingerlings
- Thread starter laurelhighlander
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5footfenwick
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Oh for sure, adult stocked trout definitely attempt to reproduce. I can’t think of any reason fingerlings wouldn’t follow suit. How successful they are is up for debate. But even a 99% failure rate is a 1% success rate. I doubt it’s that high.
Normally some stocked trout from the spring that survive summer, get on reds and try to do their thing in fall. And they are only in the creeks for one summer. The fingerlings potentially have several years to get with the program. So I would say definitely possible and happens infrequently every year. I would not think this is overly common and few of their offspring would likely make it.
I would say that places that have decent summer temperatures and get a bunch of fingerlings have better odds. I think the little J used to get a bunch. Not completely sure on that. But I would think places like that would have better odds.
Unless they are some infertile variant like a triploid rainbow or a hybrid like a tiger trout, there is no biological reason they can’t theoretically reproduce.
As for actual proof that stocked trout reproduce. I believe that there is a Trojan Y Chromosome stocked trout used by fisheries biologists to eliminate invasive species of trout. They stock these male only double Y chromosome fish to mate with the wild females and only make male offspring. Eventually the genetically induced sausage party tips the scales and the males take over such a high percentage of the population that nobody can find a mate and they all die off.
~5footfenwick
Normally some stocked trout from the spring that survive summer, get on reds and try to do their thing in fall. And they are only in the creeks for one summer. The fingerlings potentially have several years to get with the program. So I would say definitely possible and happens infrequently every year. I would not think this is overly common and few of their offspring would likely make it.
I would say that places that have decent summer temperatures and get a bunch of fingerlings have better odds. I think the little J used to get a bunch. Not completely sure on that. But I would think places like that would have better odds.
Unless they are some infertile variant like a triploid rainbow or a hybrid like a tiger trout, there is no biological reason they can’t theoretically reproduce.
As for actual proof that stocked trout reproduce. I believe that there is a Trojan Y Chromosome stocked trout used by fisheries biologists to eliminate invasive species of trout. They stock these male only double Y chromosome fish to mate with the wild females and only make male offspring. Eventually the genetically induced sausage party tips the scales and the males take over such a high percentage of the population that nobody can find a mate and they all die off.
~5footfenwick
Tigereye
Well-known member
With the domestic strains of rainbows commonly used in hatchery systems, that have been manipulated to spawn in the fall, water temperatures often lead to unsuccessful spawning.
rustbeltwilds
Well-known member
Trout lodge rainbows are used mostly now😉
The long standing (at least 5 decades) wild brown trout population that has been present in Codorus Ck from Spring Grove upstream to the confluence of the West Br Codorus (inflow and exiting stream from Lake Marburg) was originally established through reproduction of PFC stocked adult brown trout.
I think all the non-native wild browns and rainbows in the east and brookies in the west show stocked trout can succeed. Ok, maybe the earlier plants were closer to wild fish than todays hatchery output, but still can reproduce with maybe different success rates. BTW, I live in a state (NJ) that has only 2 freshwater game fish: brook trout and chain pickerel. Basically everything I fish for is introduced. 20 years ago Pat Hamilton did DNA studies with NJ's brookies and the indicators were that most streams likely had native fish (no pre-stocking samples to be definitive). However, a few showed a significant proportion of DNA from the Nassau NH strain of brookies stocked by NJ at the time. So I guess those stockies can get it on with the locals.
Very large numbers of fingerlings used to be stocked annually in the Little Juniata. But that does not mean that significant numbers of them survived long enough to reproduce.
There were many wild brown trout in the Little Juniata River and many of its tributaries long before fingerling stocking began. No one really knows when these populations were established, but it was probably in the late 1800s.
One of the "narratives" that was written in many places was that the Little Juniata was a "dead" river back when it was polluted by the paper mill at Tyrone. But during that time local fishermen caught big wild browns. One old timer told me that the fishing for big wild brown trout was much better BEFORE the paper mill pollution was cleaned up, and before stocking began. Which is not at all surprising. Because the water was turbid and smelled bad, most people assumed it was a dead river and didn't fish it. Only a few locals knew that it held big wild browns.
During the period the fingerlings were being stocked, there were many arguments about whether the adult trout were mostly from the fingerlings or mostly wild trout. Some of these arguments got pretty heated.
Then the Little Juniata River Association proposed a study to answer this question, and volunteered their labor to help, and the PFBC accepted their offer. And the study found that the great majority of the adult trout in the river were wild trout, and few were from the fingerlings. So, they quit stocking fingerlings and the trout population has remained good.
Are their examples where fingerling stockings have had good results? I'm not sure. Maybe people more familiar with other waters that receive fingerling stockings can answer that
I believe all of their fish they produce are sterile.
rustbeltwilds
Well-known member
Yeah trout lodge are all sterile females
A similar situation existed on the lower Letort for many years. Polluted and smelly, it was cleaned up and stocked with fingerling browns and turned into a fine Class A fishery. The fingerling program was dropped. To what degree the fingerlings played a role in the recovery of lower Letort is debatable but many of us tend to believe the answer is probably minimal or no influence at all. The movement of wild fish from both upstream and downstream is likely the reason.
The fingerling brookie program on Big Spring in the early 2000s is also widely regarded as a failure and unnecessary (in hindsight) as studies revealed almost non-existent survival of stocked fingerling STs. Other recent fingerling programs in the Cumberland Valley have also failed to produce enough fish that thrived and grew to "catchable" size.
While I remain an advocate of fingerling trout stocking and feel PFBC should continue to try out this management strategy, truth be told fingerling trout efforts across our state have, at best, a mixed history with a lot of cautionary tales.
Ggrove
Member
Maybe im stupid, but what is the point of stocking fingerling if they arnt going to spawn?
I can think of 2 reasons, although they arn’t good.
A). Supplemental food for a different sport fish (first one to come to mind is musky)
B). Give them time to grow so it FEELS like there is more of a wild aspect to them
Once again, maybe im stupid, but other than that, whats the point in sterile fingerling trout? Or maybe pfbc is the stupid one?
I can think of 2 reasons, although they arn’t good.
A). Supplemental food for a different sport fish (first one to come to mind is musky)
B). Give them time to grow so it FEELS like there is more of a wild aspect to them
Once again, maybe im stupid, but other than that, whats the point in sterile fingerling trout? Or maybe pfbc is the stupid one?
PennKev
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Fingerling fish are cheaper to stock since they don't need to be housed and fed for as long as adult stocked fish. If the habitat is right to grow them to adult size, its an economical way to create or supplement a fishery when it works. The bonus is a more naturally appearing fish/fishery. That said, fingerling success in PA seems very hit or miss, mostly miss from what I've seen. It really seems that most creeks that can support trout long enough for significant growth already have as many trout as it can support in the form of wild fish.
As for being sterile, I'm not aware of PA stocking intentionally sterilized fingerlings.
Does anyone know of a stream or river where fingerlings are stocked where it results in good numbers of adult trout?
How about the Lehigh River? Or the Youghiogheny River?
How many of the adult trout in those rivers are from fingerling stockings, or adult trout stockings, or natural reproduction (wild trout)?
How about the Lehigh River? Or the Youghiogheny River?
How many of the adult trout in those rivers are from fingerling stockings, or adult trout stockings, or natural reproduction (wild trout)?
CRB
Well-known member
Yes. but not as prevalent as 50 years ago or more.
Between 1940-mid 70s I've heard a bunch of stories that have flown under the radar.
Some I've been sworn to keep silent about.
Between 1940-mid 70s I've heard a bunch of stories that have flown under the radar.
Some I've been sworn to keep silent about.
tomgamber
Well-known member
I'd say Yough. I'd also suggest Lake Erie Tribs...no?
tomgamber
Well-known member
Here is a link to fingerling stockings Mike posted a couple years ago.
