Start with the City of Reading

[Chaz]

The City of Reading owns a lot of stream frontage in the area of Sal's stream. They abuse the tish out of them, one with a golf course and several pond on a wild rainbow stream the other one channelized in the thirties and the tributaries of these streams. As for the ditched stream, should we accept that it will be lost because everyone is standing around scratching their heads wondering whats wrong? No!
We need to first get the TU chapter to get some data, water quality samples on the stream. PFBC needs to survey the entire stream and find out what we've got and try and figure out what has changed. This is a stream that has gone from appox. 90 kg/ht to near nothing and has only been stocked once. Once these fish are lost we'll never replace them, they have evolved in an environment that is very specific, water temperature varies only about 3 degrees during the year, from the coldest days to the hottest. You won't find any stream with that narrow a temperature gradient anywhere in PA, to my knowledge.
OK, maybe it is only 3/4 of a mile long and only a few people fish it, but is that any less important than Spring Creek? I say no! What is important is that we stop the slide to oblivion, and do it now.
Disclaimer: I am by no means picking on Sal or the Local TU Chapter I haven't anything against them, but action needs to be taken and it needs to be taken now if we are to prevent another brookie stream from being lost forever.

 

[tomgamber]

See, I don't have a problem with what was done to that stream in the 30. First, it was the 30's and WPA was looking for anything to give a skilled worker a job. Second, this was established as a drinking water supply and walling it in or channelizing it as you call it probably actually reduced the amount of siltation and bank erosion that may have occurred over the years. And last, its only a few hundred yards long from source to mouth. There are many other streams that should raise more concern. It is what it is. As far as we know they brought that spring to the surface and without doing so it may have run underground before emerging in the lake bottom.

 

[mediclimber]

Chaz,
You need to help me out here a little. Where exactly is Sal's Stream? I don't understand why a golf course being alonside it is a bad thing, do they use tons of pesticides and fertilizers? I would think that their grounds keepers would be doing a fine job of stopping bank erosion and silt prduction. The stream that was channelied in the thirties, why was that done? Was or is there a flooding issue or does the level drop during summer to the point where it's stagnant and a fine location for mosquito reproduction? Is it possible the channelized stream was a part of the sewer system way back, they did things like that in cities years ago. Now, if it turns out that the stream or streams in question are go to go for trout, why can't a bunch of us get together and put a few dolars in a fund to stock the damn things ourselves? Is it cost prohibitive, like more than twenty bucks a head for say ten to twenty people? I know nothing of these streams, but it seems if the water flow, temp, and quality are "within normal ranges" maybe a grass roots stocking effort would be a good way to get the ball rolling while the local Trout Unlimited Chapter gets up to speed on these streams. I know that there are thousands of small streams all over PA, particularly in this area that at one time had much better conditions and held trout. Now some are just a bunch of damp rocks and mud.

 

[tomgamber]

Its a city water supply. No one is gonna let you put anything including fish in it.

 

[mediclimber]

Ah, so there it is.

 

[Cynic]

"Its a city water supply. No one is gonna let you put anything including fish in it." by TG


But, I have a suggestion who we might put in it. But, I'd probably be arrested for even suggesting it!

Right on Chaz.
Too many people take the easy path of accommodation.

 

[mediclimber]

Cynic, you'd probably have to make a list and take a vote on who goes in first. :-D

 

[Chaz]

Medi and others, We're talking about 2 different streams. The little one with the stone walls is a spring creek that was probably 1 1/2 miles long, it is not the water supply, but it flows into a water supply, the main source of the water supply is Maiden Creek. I don't have a problem with what happened to the stream in the 30's, but what was done has out lived its usefulness. The stream should be restored to a natural channel.
It has about as steady a flow as any stream I've seen, as I said before, the temperature varies only a couple of degrees a year.
There are several golf courses in the area, and with the stream being a true spring creek pollution could be coming from miles away if that is the problem. I don't think it is, I think the problem is harvest. But golf courses use all kinds of bad crap that eventually gets into our streams, and if ou've got a Class A Exceptional value stream which this creek is, then it should be protected and restored, the largest expenditure would be manpower.
As for the other stream, it is a spring creek that starts in Kutztown, and has 2 gold course right on its banks. Both of the golf courses dam the stream and use water from the stream, and no doubt do the things that all golf courses do, like use pesticides and heavy use of fertilizers probably right up to the stream banks, not to mention mowing along the stream to the waters edge. This lind of stuff can be deadly to trout streams. The reason golf courses can get away with it, they are zoned as agricultural.

 

[steveo]

Chaz,
You, more than most people must realize that any TU chapter can not ignore everything else that is going on in the area and put all our efforts into one stream. We're already stretched way too thin. I really have a problem with 2 points that you made.

1. If the reason the trout population is down because of harvest there's not much our TU chapter can do to help that. I guess we could stake out the steam 24/7 to guard against poaching.

2. You said "Once these fish are lost we'll never replace them, they have evolved in an environment..." These fish have not evolved in this stream, they were stocked. They may have made some minor adaptations but not much evolution takes place in 70 years.

Don't get me wrong, I love this stream and it is a very special place. I also love all the other many wild trout streams that we have in our area. We do our best to protect them with the limited resources available. I also don't see a problem identifying such a stream on this forum. The more friend these places have the better off they will be.
Steve