Spruce Creek access

not all the people are rich, but some are. Maybe it depends on the definition of wealthy. A significant concern is the loss of value of their property. My feeling is that was up to them to do due diligence before they paid a premium price (those who did not inherit). Their land will still be valuable, maybe not as much.
I'm not sure how a loss of value of your property is established because a fly fisherman is enjoying himself in front of a cottage/property. I'm sure it will be catch and release only. I'd love to fish it. I wouldn't destroy their property. I wouldn't wade across the stream and walk onto their property. I'd enjoy the beautiful stream, watching the rays of sun shine glimmering thru caddis wings on a good hatch. Setting the hook on a nice brown or rainbow will cure anyone's bad week. Lol.
 
DCNR owns one side of the creek. So, the public has the right of access on that side. It's pretty simple.

Does anyone think there is any legal question or uncertainty? If so, what?

Don't get distracted by stuff like whether they are "wealthy" or not. That's totally irrelevant.
 
OnX isn't perfect, but after reviewing their property maps on my phone, that section of Rothrock would open a fairly substantial stream length to public fishing. People could even easily trek through the woods past the small, 1 acre property owned by the Edward Karlik Trust and access another short stretch of water that would be owned by the state. That would be great.
 
I'm not sure how a loss of value of your property is established because a fly fisherman is enjoying himself in front of a cottage/property. I'm sure it will be catch and release only. I'd love to fish it. I wouldn't destroy their property. I wouldn't wade across the stream and walk onto their property. I'd enjoy the beautiful stream, watching the rays of sun shine glimmering thru caddis wings on a good hatch. Setting the hook on a nice brown or rainbow will cure anyone's bad week. Lol.

  • How do you know it will just be fly fishermen?
  • If it is a DCNR fight for public water, should it be FFO?
  • How do you know it will be catch & release?
  • Could the non-public side be harvest while the public side isn't?
  • How do you know other people won't destroy their property?
Therein lies just SOME the quandary of allowing access...

I fished ONE stream in my life (a Class A) where I had landowner permission but in a certain stretch the landowner only owned to the middle of the creek. Quite frankly it was a pain in the a$$ to stay on MY side and in a few other places it was about impossible to exit the stream on the side I was fishing.

I never went back...
 
  • How do you know it will just be fly fishermen?
  • If it is a DCNR fight for public water, should it be FFO?
  • How do you know it will be catch & release?
  • Could the non-public side be harvest while the public side isn't?
  • How do you know other people won't destroy their property?
Therein lies just SOME the quandary of allowing access...

I fished ONE stream in my life (a Class A) where I had landowner permission but in a certain stretch the landowner only owned to the middle of the creek. Quite frankly it was a pain in the a$$ to stay on MY side and in a few other places it was about impossible to exit the stream on the side I was fishing.

I never went back...

  • How do you know it will just be fly fishermen?
  • If it is a DCNR fight for public water, should it be FFO?
  • How do you know it will be catch & release?
  • Could the non-public side be harvest while the public side isn't?
  • How do you know other people won't destroy their property?
Therein lies just SOME the quandary of allowing access...

I fished ONE stream in my life (a Class A) where I had landowner permission but in a certain stretch the landowner only owned to the middle of the creek. Quite frankly it was a pain in the a$$ to stay on MY side and in a few other places it was about impossible to exit the stream on the side I was fishing.

I never went back...
Lol, understand your point. Flyfishing only! Sorry miss spoke. Catch and release is a good compromise for anyone asking a property owner for some access to a good day of fishing. Being a pain in the a$$ to stay on one's side I think I understand. I've been taught, (no offense) why wade up thru a stream you can easily cast across. I've had some good advice from many great fisherman before me. Spruce creek isn't like the little J. I love wading honestly I just understand what's under my feet, and would be more cautious about wading for a hundred yards up spruce creek vs the little J.
 
OnX isn't perfect, but after reviewing their property maps on my phone, that section of Rothrock would open a fairly substantial stream length to public fishing. People could even easily trek through the woods past the small, 1 acre property owned by the Edward Karlik Trust and access another short stretch of water that would be owned by the state. That would be great.
I used to have Onx, and your correct on accuracy but it's closer to accurate vs Google or rothrock maps. I remember as a kid going to colerain park in the 60s and 70s was just gorgeous. We would hike up along the stream above the park to see the ice caves in the summer and cool off. I don't know if that trail along the creek is there anymore but it's beautiful from what I remember.
 
I used to have Onx, and your correct on accuracy but it's closer to accurate vs Google or rothrock maps. I remember as a kid going to colerain park in the 60s and 70s was just gorgeous. We would hike up along the stream above the park to see the ice caves in the summer and cool off. I don't know if that trail along the creek is there anymore but it's beautiful from what I remember.
I have actually never been to the park, and I have never wet a line in Spruce Creek. I should go check Colerain out, though, and walk that part of the MST.
 
I'm not sure how a loss of value of your property is established because a fly fisherman is enjoying himself in front of a cottage/property. I'm sure it will be catch and release only. I'd love to fish it. I wouldn't destroy their property. I wouldn't wade across the stream and walk onto their property. I'd enjoy the beautiful stream, watching the rays of sun shine glimmering thru caddis wings on a good hatch. Setting the hook on a nice brown or rainbow will cure anyone's bad week. Lol.
I don't own any land, but sole access= less pressure and ability to fish when you want. It's a perk that increases the value
 
I have actually never been to the park, and I have never wet a line in Spruce Creek. I should go check Colerain out, though, and walk that part of the MST.
I drive by it on my way to fish the J or another stream probably 50+ times a year. In 20 years I haven't fished it once. The whole situation just gives it a stench in my view. I've been invited to the "club waters" a few times. The guy is nice and it was a nice gesture, but I make an excuses and politely decline.
 
I've been invited to the "club waters" a few times. The guy is nice and it was a nice gesture, but I make an excuses and politely decline.
Joe, I feel honored that you turn down prestigious club opportunities with nicely manicured banks, a beautiful lodge, and delicious food to hang out under a vinyl tarp eating beans and chicken wings after floating on the Juniata in the pouring rain with Chris for 10 hours. Lol.
 
I have actually never been to the park, and I have never wet a line in Spruce Creek. I should go check Colerain out, though, and walk that part of the MST.
The George Harvey section is fun fishing on spruce creek, also the section in front of Indian caverns is I nice spot to stop throw a few casts. I think off hand the state calls it section 3. I wish the university would spend some money and improve the access and do some quality stream improvements at the George Harvey section. I used to be able to fish lots of spruce creek in the 60s and 70s but I knew the land owners/farmers. I've caught some gorgeous brook trout and have seen 30+ inch browns in Spruce Creek. An old land owner below Indian caverns had a fish he caught so many times the fish learned its name. I thought he was drunk on scotch at first but the fish did come 50 yards down stream when he called it. Doc put a handful of food on a flat rock at water level and the 28" hog popped his head out of the water to get to the food on the edge of the rock. The craziest thing I've ever seen. Lol, and yes you don't have to believe that story but I saw it.
 
The George Harvey section is fun fishing on spruce creek, also the section in front of Indian caverns is I nice spot to stop throw a few casts. I think off hand the state calls it section 3. I wish the university would spend some money and improve the access and do some quality stream improvements at the George Harvey section. I used to be able to fish lots of spruce creek in the 60s and 70s but I knew the land owners/farmers. I've caught some gorgeous brook trout and have seen 30+ inch browns in Spruce Creek. An old land owner below Indian caverns had a fish he caught so many times the fish learned its name. I thought he was drunk on scotch at first but the fish did come 50 yards down stream when he called it. Doc put a handful of food on a flat rock at water level and the 28" hog popped his head out of the water to get to the food on the edge of the rock. The craziest thing I've ever seen. Lol, and yes you don't have to believe that story but I saw it.
I fished the Indian Caverns stretch for the first time this Summer on my way home from Little J. Looked like it had potential but I only saw three fish. I'm sure there were more there that were hiding under the banks out of sight. The bulk of the time I drive by it, there is almost always someone fishing it. This is all to say that I won't go out of my way to fish it in the future. I've fished the Harvey section no more than 5x in the last 10 years. If they resolve the Colerain stretch, I'll try it to say I did. Honestly, there are way better fisheries in the area that I devote my time to.
 
Fished the upper public section of spruce this past autumn for the first time in my 60 years on the way to the Juniata.

Maybe it’s because I’ve read so much about it over the decades and was bound to be disappointed. But I was disappointed.

Got one 9 incher wild looking brown on about my 10th cast. Then about a half dozen guys pulled in, hopped into the creek and started what I think they believed was “fishing.” They left after walking through the entire section.

There’s a big pool with a bunch of stockers in it, and when they settled down, my cousin got a solid hatchery brown.

We left unimpressed.

It seemed to me to be like one of the fly only trophy trout spots from the 1970s and’80s: masses of stockers that were as used to people as zoo animals, and swarms of anglers.

It was not the sublime experience I was expecting.

Since this reads like a restaurant review on yelp, I give it a 1 star rating.

Maybe if I lived closer and had more opportunities to fish it, I’d have a different opinion. To my way of thinking Penns, letort, falling springs, big spring and several others that are open to the public and managed for wild trout are far superior.

It’s going to take a lot more than opening up a short half section to turn a paradise for stocked trout into something half as good as big gunpowder in Maryland.

That said, the public has a right to fish on public property.
 
Fished the upper public section of spruce this past autumn for the first time in my 60 years on the way to the Juniata.

Maybe it’s because I’ve read so much about it over the decades and was bound to be disappointed. But I was disappointed.

Got one 9 incher wild looking brown on about my 10th cast. Then about a half dozen guys pulled in, hopped into the creek and started what I think they believed was “fishing.” They left after walking through the entire section.

There’s a big pool with a bunch of stockers in it, and when they settled down, my cousin got a solid hatchery brown.

We left unimpressed.

It seemed to me to be like one of the fly only trophy trout spots from the 1970s and’80s: masses of stockers that were as used to people as zoo animals, and swarms of anglers.

It was not the sublime experience I was expecting.

Since this reads like a restaurant review on yelp, I give it a 1 star rating.

Maybe if I lived closer and had more opportunities to fish it, I’d have a different opinion. To my way of thinking Penns, letort, falling springs, big spring and several others that are open to the public and managed for wild trout are far superior.

It’s going to take a lot more than opening up a short half section to turn a paradise for stocked trout into something half as good as big gunpowder in Maryland.

That said, the public has a right to fish on public property.
Everyone should be disappointed. It used to be one of the great spawn areas on spruce creek. Now its 600' of double mud sills. No real cover or over hanging brush clumps for trout to hid to when humans show up. Looks like a tube slide at an amusement park. A crap load of stumps and toe wood would have made it more productive. But it's all grant money, get in, get out. Plant some trees. Do the least amount of common sense and make a huge profit.
 
The ladt time I fished Spruce on the way home from the Jam I had one of those leftover Donny B torpedos come shooting 3ft out of the water on a slow pool. I laughed, threw a bugger through the pool and walked back to the car, drove to the tavern and called it a trip. It's a really nice stream but I've only caught a few fish. Agree about should keep driving to the little J.
 
The ladt time I fished Spruce on the way home from the Jam I had one of those leftover Donny B torpedos come shooting 3ft out of the water on a slow pool. I laughed, threw a bugger through the pool and walked back to the car, drove to the tavern and called it a trip. It's a really nice stream but I've only caught a few fish. Agree about should keep driving to the little J.
Lol, not sure how you would know it was a left over Donny B torpedoes. I used to enjoy watching the spawn on spruce creek at different locations. It is a strong producing native stream and yes it has its share of raised fish. I'd love to fish at colerain park again. A trout on a rod is always a good feeling, stocked or native imo. I've helped with the "on the fly" charity event on spruce creek and have fished there a couple of times after the event. I do love the caddis and sulfer hatches on the little J, always makes good memories.
 
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Lol, not sure how you would know it was a left over Donny B torpedoes.
Well, I won't speak for Tom, but one possible explanation is that he saw it was an unnaturally large rainbow trout that leapt from the water. Does anyone else plant humongous rainbow pellet pigs in Spruce Creek other than the Beav?
 
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