Spring & Fishing Creek Question

On these three streams (spring especially) you don't have to worry about fish not being there. If a spot looks fishy, they are there.

I tend to only fish dries when fish are rising. You can absolutely catch fish blind casting dries, but I always catch more by spending that time nymphing. As far as dries go like Brookie said you can catch a dun and match your fly to that dun.

For nymphs you can flip a rock or use a standard nymph (hares ear,pheasant tail, various stoneflies, scuds, etc.) Try nymphs in some spots that look "fishy" and nothing happens, try a new nymph.

It's pretty much just familiarizing yourself with the streams and the aquatic life that lives there.
 
I guess I can make the assumption then if there's not a hatch going on or I don't see any surface activity then I might be better off nymphing. Which brings up a whole new set of questions.
 
Generally that's true but of course there are exceptions. And it's also not uncommon for beginners not to see rising fish, especially in broken water. i.e. in that long glassy flat pool, rises are pretty obvious from the ring in the water that slowly expands from the epicenter. But in some choppy current, all you may see is a beak. It just depends.

The truth is, when I'm EXPECTING rising fish, I look hard to see them. It's usually not smack in the middle of a heavy riff. It's on current breaks between those riffs and a slower side area. It's in eddy's. It's in tail outs. Right against side rocks, or on the edges of (but not in) deep holes, etc.

The most obvious rises are in those long, flat, glassy pools, and frankly, I avoid them like the plague. Fish in slow water are harder to approach, and more picky in terms of drag and fly selection as they have far longer to inspect it.

Anyway, whether dry flies or nymphing, familiarizing yourself with the typical hatches of the stream and their behavior and timing will help tremendously. When nymphing, you generally wanna use something resembling the nymphs of the most active insect. And the nymphs of mayflies get active even in the weeks leading up to a hatch, or during the morning hours even if the actual hatch doesn't happen till evening. And they inhabit different areas of the stream.

For instance, March Browns are clinger mayflies. They inhabit rocky riffles. Prior to emergence they try to make their way towards the slower water on the edges, behind rocks, etc. But they move by crawling. In the process they become dislodged. So even if they aren't hatching at this moment, nymphing strategy during March Brown periods should focus on heavy riffs, and fish them deep. Get that nymph to roll around the bottom in the pocket water.

On the other hand, Green Drakes are burrowing mayflies and their nymphs inhabit slower, siltier sections. Prior to emergence, they're often crawling around the bottom of deep, slow holes, and your nymphing strategy should be as such.

Sulphers, on the other hand, are swimmers. They tend to be in more moderate currents. And have some interesting habits. For instance, lets say you think the hatch will begin around 6 p.m. Well, you may deep nymph all morning. But come 4 or 5, no bugs popping yet, no rises. But those nymphs are actually starting to swim around like slower versions of minnows, schooling up. So now your fishing moderate currents. Tailouts and glides, and the need to be right on bottom is much less. Just prior to (and during) emergence they'll be swimming around JUST below the surface film. They actually get slow and clumsy as they molt fractions of an inch below the surface. You start to see rises. Many get frustrated because they can't seem to catch them on the duns. They ain't eatin duns, they're eating surface nymphs. This is why many recognize that low sitting flies like comparaduns and parachutes work better than catskill style dries, as the body sits below the surface. I like using a high floatin catskill tie, but an unweighted nymph dropper a few inches behind it. And forget drag. Actually intentionally add it. Those nymphs are swimming a little. I'll treat it like a slow streamer. Can be deadly. Is that nymphing? I dunno, but it works.

For caddis, there are "hatches". But just as commonly, there is no active hatch, but there are adult egg layers zipping around the surface occasionally dipping into the surface dropping eggs. This is when you see sporadic, splashy rises and the occasional fish launch. Forget the CDC crap. Get yourself an elk hair or something that floats like a cork. Cast well beyond fish holding water and skip it back to you. Skip, let drift, skip, let drift. Even in places where you saw no rise. Takes can be savage, sudden rod bending affairs. This is quite fun. For me, anyway.
 
Everybody, this is a lot to absorb. You've all been so extremely helpful and willing to share your knowledge that I can't thank you enough. All your advice will help me as I get back into the swing of things. Obviously, you've all been doing this for a long time. I'm sure I'll have more questions for this forum but maybe we'll meet up on the water someday and I'll be able to ask you in person.
Thanks again.
Steve
 
swany50 wrote:
This is all good stuff. I really appreciate it. Will definitely be taking your suggestions. Don't think I ever caught a trout over 10" fishing the Tully and Valley Creek. On those, I would only use a 7x or 6x. Down my way I seem to only find the little ones. Suggesting 4X & 5x for up there gives me hope for something bigger.

I've never found an instance on spring, BFC, or penns where 7x is needed, and the only reason I would ever use 6x on one of these streams is because you are fishing with trico's or midges. The only reason I would use them then is because the of the size of the fly. As a matter of fact that is really the only time I would ever use 6x or 7x.

 
pcray1231 wrote:
Generally that's true but of course there are exceptions. And it's also not uncommon for beginners not to see rising fish, especially in broken water. i.e. in that long glassy flat pool, rises are pretty obvious from the ring in the water that slowly expands from the epicenter. But in some choppy current, all you may see is a beak. It just depends.

The truth is, when I'm EXPECTING rising fish, I look hard to see them. It's usually not smack in the middle of a heavy riff. It's on current breaks between those riffs and a slower side area. It's in eddy's. It's in tail outs. Right against side rocks, or on the edges of (but not in) deep holes, etc.

The most obvious rises are in those long, flat, glassy pools, and frankly, I avoid them like the plague. Fish in slow water are harder to approach, and more picky in terms of drag and fly selection as they have far longer to inspect it.

Anyway, whether dry flies or nymphing, familiarizing yourself with the typical hatches of the stream and their behavior and timing will help tremendously. When nymphing, you generally wanna use something resembling the nymphs of the most active insect. And the nymphs of mayflies get active even in the weeks leading up to a hatch, or during the morning hours even if the actual hatch doesn't happen till evening. And they inhabit different areas of the stream.

For instance, March Browns are clinger mayflies. They inhabit rocky riffles. Prior to emergence they try to make their way towards the slower water on the edges, behind rocks, etc. But they move by crawling. In the process they become dislodged. So even if they aren't hatching at this moment, nymphing strategy during March Brown periods should focus on heavy riffs, and fish them deep. Get that nymph to roll around the bottom in the pocket water.

On the other hand, Green Drakes are burrowing mayflies and their nymphs inhabit slower, siltier sections. Prior to emergence, they're often crawling around the bottom of deep, slow holes, and your nymphing strategy should be as such.

Sulphers, on the other hand, are swimmers. They tend to be in more moderate currents. And have some interesting habits. For instance, lets say you think the hatch will begin around 6 p.m. Well, you may deep nymph all morning. But come 4 or 5, no bugs popping yet, no rises. But those nymphs are actually starting to swim around like slower versions of minnows, schooling up. So now your fishing moderate currents. Tailouts and glides, and the need to be right on bottom is much less. Just prior to (and during) emergence they'll be swimming around JUST below the surface film. They actually get slow and clumsy as they molt fractions of an inch below the surface. You start to see rises. Many get frustrated because they can't seem to catch them on the duns. They ain't eatin duns, they're eating surface nymphs. This is why many recognize that low sitting flies like comparaduns and parachutes work better than catskill style dries, as the body sits below the surface. I like using a high floatin catskill tie, but an unweighted nymph dropper a few inches behind it. And forget drag. Actually intentionally add it. Those nymphs are swimming a little. I'll treat it like a slow streamer. Can be deadly. Is that nymphing? I dunno, but it works.

For caddis, there are "hatches". But just as commonly, there is no active hatch, but there are adult egg layers zipping around the surface occasionally dipping into the surface dropping eggs. This is when you see sporadic, splashy rises and the occasional fish launch. Forget the CDC crap. Get yourself an elk hair or something that floats like a cork. Cast well beyond fish holding water and skip it back to you. Skip, let drift, skip, let drift. Even in places where you saw no rise. Takes can be savage, sudden rod bending affairs. This is quite fun. For me, anyway.


This is a bit much if you are new to fly fishing. Not sure how new you are but..... take it slow. Trying to learn everything all at once can not only be confusing but also intimidating.

Start by knowing where you are going and looking at a hatch chart (internet) for the time you will be there. Go and buy some of those flies, then buy some standard nymphs that work anywhere, or ask the fly shop which nymphs to get. Fish will typically eat anything under water.

If fish aren't consistently rising nymph. If they are rising a lot throw on a dry.

 
Csoult, you're right but it's still helpful and good insight. Last time I fished was about 5 years ago. Before I had kids I was pretty active but now that they're in college I'm trying to get some of that time back. Gonna take a while to get back into the swing of things so I'll be taking it slow for awhile.
 
Yeah, I agree and Pat's one of the most knowledgeable guys on this site and a heck of a nice guy. That was no cut on him and I'm sure he knows that. I think sometimes we just forget how overwhelming all of this information is to a new guy (sorry I thought you were new).
 
Oh, believe it I still consider myself a newbie even though I fished a bit before kids and had some opportunities while they were growing up. Just that I never knew a lot of this stuff back then. Sometimes I didn't care if I caught any fish, I just liked standing in the middle of a stream and flinging my line around. I pretty much practiced "match the hatch" and hoped I had a dry fly on me close enough to what's buzzing around that I'd catch a fish. If I lost that one fly I was pretty much #censor# out of luck. I think I tried nymphing once or twice in all my years but had no idea what I was doing. Everything was basically trial and error, but I did become an expert at losing all types of flies and no one could outdo me when it came to snags & wind knots. Fly shops loved me. Everyone has been so helpful and I'm a bit more knowledgeable so now it's a matter of getting out on the water and practicing.
 
Here are a few good articles with some solid advice that may help. Get out there and try different things and have fun.

http://www.flyfisherman.com/how-to/beginners/fly-fishing-for-trout/

http://www.orvis.com/s/basic-nymph-fishing-techniques/566

http://midcurrent.com/techniques/nymphing-no-nos/
 
Thanks, afishinado. Excellent articles.
 
Back
Top