Place your head between your knees, and kiss your .................

[TimMurphy]

Dear Board,

In anticipation of the coming regime change in Harrisburg the first white flag has been raised. It's all downhill from here.

http://www.pressconnects.com/article/20101216/NEWS01/12160411/Dimock+water+settlement+leaves+town+divided

I used to live up that way for 11 years just over the line in Windsor NY. Beautiful country and while the trout fishing close by wasn't the best the Susquehanna River up there fished better on a bad day than it ever did on it's best day as you traveled downriver.

But the area is economically challenged. Once home to Endicott-Johnson and IBM it is now a shadow of it's former self. The gas rush is seen as a re-birth for the area on both sides of the stateline. While NY is taking it's time in opening up lands to drilling the same cannot be said for PA.

I see nothing good whatsoever coming out of this drilling craze. I was born in dying coal town and while some things have changed since my youth the changes are too slow to come. Unfortunately, I see same thing on the horizon for the Northern Tier of PA and the Southern Tier of NY.

Fish hard and fish fast this year and you may as well keep everything you can because it will all be gone in a few short years.

PENNSYLVANIA - WHERE THE FUTURE IS ALWAYS IN THE PAST!

Regards,

Tim Murphy :-(

 

[salvelinusfontinalis]

I see nothing good whatsoever coming out of this drilling craze. I was born in dying coal town and while some things have changed since my youth the changes are too slow to come. Unfortunately, I see same thing on the horizon for the Northern Tier of PA and the Southern Tier of NY. Fish hard and fish fast this year and you may as well keep everything you can because it will all be gone in a few short years. PENNSYLVANIA - WHERE THE FUTURE IS ALWAYS IN THE PAST!

Just dont tell anyone what streams you fish ;-)

 

[bikerfish]

I hope your wrong tim, but I don't think your too far off the mark.
I think more people need to be educated about this industry. last night I was at a christmas gathering of friends and neighbors and someone casually mentioned some nearby gas wells that are being drilled. I started asking everyone how much they really knew about it, they knew very little if anything. I gave a short talk and explained the limited facts I know about it and they were amazed. most folks were going to look into it much more. all of these folks were concerned about their water supply and the local streams.
I think more of this needs to be done. once people are educated about it, the gas companies will have a harder time doing things half assed.

 

[osprey]

bikerfish.............Don't it seem like that is the case with many pressing issues of today , education changes the way folks view things. It's the process of getting folks educated about it that's the tough part , folks just don't have the time and resist having to take the time to learn about something they feel they have no control over anyhow. On this issue though , along with the education process comes the realization that we DO have some control over this. TimMurphy........I also hope you are wrong about that but if you come from the Coal region , I can understand how you feel the way you do. How long has Centralia been on fire? Maybe everyone learned something from all that destructive coal mining long ago and will think a little more and a little longer this time? I can't help myself , i'm an eternal optimist and since my accident always try to find the "silver lining" to things after being given another chance. Maybe that's the thing , we did what we did with coal and though we screwed up big time things eventually started to come back. Let's not repeat the same mistakes with the Marcellus deal that we did with coal. There was an article in the local paper here this week about a local guy who has applied for patents on a device that evaporates the left over water that is there when they are done drilling. The whole thing fits on the trailer of a big rig and can be moved easily from well site to well site. The left over water is one of the things that has the potential for disaster , apparently the "ponds" of left over water from the drilling out west was not a problem because if left alone the water evaporated on it's own , here however it needs some help evaporating because of our environment and weather. I hope this fellows idea works out and I wish him success with it. This fellows name is Mike Richardson and he is GM of a company in Somerset county called Chemstream , his name is familiar to me but not the name of the Company. Don't we have a guy on here with that name?

 

[osprey]

OOOPPSS!!! Sorry about that , the fellow who invented the "frackinator" last name is Kaufman not Richardson , I got the company name right it is Chemstream and they deal with "environmental water treatment"

 

[DGC]

The main agent that has the teeth to do something about it, namely government, is not particularly popular these days, and in many circles is seen as somewhere on the continuum from incompetent to evil. And now that the people elected to lead that hated government got there by being anti-government themselves, there's not much you can count on from them, with contributions from big energy groups only enhancing that tendency.

About the only way PA government is likely to tighten up adequately is by losing some big legal challenges for inadequate environmental protection. But with immunity laws (typically appropriate, I might add), that is a tough nut to crack. The last time I read about it happening, it was precisely because PA government actors were seen as too heavy handed in their response to an alleged environmental regulation violator.

I used to be more much more optimistic, but now it appears that only with a public uproar, with very large protests, is it likely that adequate safeguards will be created along with adequate enforcement, adequtately funded.

 

[osprey]

DGC...........At the November 6 protest rally in Pittsburgh , Josh Fox the fellow who made the film "Gasland" called for public disobedience in the face of the Marcellus onslaught i.e. massive public uproar with large protests. A couple days after the protest the city council voted to ban hydro fracking in the city , several townships and municipalities followed suit and banned fracking. Seems like they were successful in their protest , I guess i have to wonder if folks will do what it takes or just let it happen?

 

[bikerfish]

hell no we won't go!! oh wait, that was for something else. I guess we'll have to come up with a new jingle for our "sit-ins"!
I think we do need to be more vocal, remember, the squeaky wheel gets the grease!

 

[franklin]

bikerfish wrote:
hell no we won't go!! oh wait, that was for something else. I guess we'll have to come up with a new jingle for our "sit-ins"!
I think we do need to be more vocal, remember, the squeaky wheel gets the grease!

Are you opposed to any gas extraction?

 

[bikerfish]

I'm not opposed to doing it right. I just don't trust the gas companies or our state government in any of this. everyone is after the fast dollar and could care less about what happens 20 or 40 years from now.
I AM opposed to the leasing of our state forest lands for PRIVATE profits. sure, the state is making a couple bucks off it, but the gas companies are making billions. all the while ruining our forests. yes, ruining. these sites take at least 5 acres each, as of now there are approx 1/4 of our lands leased. I'm sorry, but I think that is more than enough.
I love the fact that the state gets pissed about me putting a tent up in the wrong place to camp for a night, but they have no problem with a companie bulldozing the same land for profit.
like I've said a hundred times, this IS all about the money. I'm tired of hearing the bs about evergy needs. if we were concerned with that, we would all cut back our own needs. do we do that? hell no. we drive the biggest suv's money can buy, we live in huge houses and heat rooms we never use. we are the most wasteful society in the world.
that said, I'm not against drilling for gas, but there needs to be tougher regs in place, there needs to be accountability for peoples water supply should it get contaminated. there needs to be more safegaurds in place.
would you want a company drilling past your water well?
I think NY is doing the right thing by having a total moratorium on it till more is known. of course, the gas companies don't want us knowing more, it's gonna cost em!!
there is potential for great economic benefit, also great environmental disaster.
are these companies here to get our gas and make huge profits and leave us with a total mess to deal with, or are they here to benefit our state, our communities. are they willing to invest in our future, not steal it. I really don't think these companies give a rats *** about us or our future. they'ed be just as happy if we all left so they could get to their profits easier.
as of now, at least where I'm from, this topic is pulling communities apart. it is pitting neighbors against each other. greed usually does have a habit of doing this.
it is up to us, the citizens of this state, to moniter and police it. our government, and especially, our new governor, cannot be trusted. they are deep in the pockets of the industry.

 

[Chaz]

I have to agree with Bikerfish, we are getting screwed big time in this mess and we will be left with the clean up if we don't take our land back and it is our land not the states. they hold the land in trust for all Pennsylvanians.

 

[jdaddy]

Franklin and Chaz,

I know you are both very involved in TU. Please do yourself a favor and bring the TU MS drilling expert in for a presentation. He was at our last meeting and it was literally standing room only. What a great and knowledgeable guy! He is really trying to get to the SE chapters and get them up to speed since these chapters are really out of the loop versus those chapters with pad in their back yards. PM me for details. Seriously. . .. great guy.

 

[osprey]

jdaddy........from the maps posted on here and elsewhere you folks (in Reading) are at the edge of the belt of Marcellus Shale that runs up through Pa , if you haven't seen drilling activity yet you probably will. I'm also a TU member have been for 30 years , can't say enough good about TU and i'm glad to hear you have someone involved right up front there. That is excellent service to the dues paying members and a great example for the rest of the non-profit organizations to follow. Keep the pressure on. I'm not opposed to extraction either , just don't want to see another disaster like coal , and i have faith that it can be done without a disaster if rules are set followed and enforced (violators fined and jailed) bikerfish..........i'm with you on the ban in state forest , State Gamelands etc. that property is technically "our" property but you are right on with what you said about the tent and the gas companies , before we let 'em on there let "US" vote on it. I'm also with you on the rules and regulations part of it , with ACCOUNTABILITY at the top of the list. The rally and protest and resulting bans in Allegheney county are an example of what we can do if we want. Also it has spread out to other counties and municipalities. If folks get involved we can do this without an environmental disaster and have energy for the future both.

 

[bikerfish]

I think accountability is one of the most important parts of this. for the gas companies as well as the property owners who sell leases. it's just not fair to other neighbors who don't have leases, then get their water contaminated, and then have the gas companies say, "oh, it couldn't have been us"!! hmmm, water was fine for the past 100 years, but within months of drilling, water is on fire, hmmmm. the property owner should be held accountable as well. they are making huge money from the lease, while their neighbor has to move and can't sell their land because it has no drinking water. plus, it might make some folks think twice and do a little more research before they sign on the dotted line.

 

[osprey]

bikerfish........with everything being the way it is I don't think you'll get folks to not enter into the leases but when it comes to accountability the landowners should have to pony up if they sign. I worked for a geo-physical research company when i was laid off from the steel mill in the late 70's , there were many locals employed at that time and the area we covered is almost identical to where the shale runs , they told us at the time we were documenting the reserves , now i kinda wonder if that is really what we were doing. They would drill a 90' hole , line it with PVC pipe for casing , a 20 lb charge of plastic explosive was then put in the hole , after placing sensor equipment along both sides of the test hole (geo-phones) they would detonate the explosive and the sensors would feed the info to a seismograph where a geologist could observe the info and make a determination of what was down there. If they weren't looking for Marcellus back then , I'll bet they used those tapes (everything from the seismograph was recorded) to assist them in determining where to drill. Doesn't seem to me to be many locals working on this end of things. Do you know anyone who works on Marcellus project? They use the "JOBS" in all their ads but?????

 

[osprey]

I'm gonna have some fun. I caught the end of an Ad on WDVE yesterday right before the Steelers game , on my way to a friends house to watch it. The Ad was from a Co. asking if you were interested in leasing your property for drilling. They gave an 800 number which i will get and i'll give 'em a call. I'll let you folks know how it goes. One more thing then i'll shut up , The "old" DVE wouldn't have aired that AD , they would have found a way out of it , "Clearchannel" well................Younz know.