Overwhelmed with starting out

[JSOutdoors]

So long story short, kinda…I have been fishing all my life (with spinning rods). I’ve grown bored of baitfishing with worms and spinners and just haven’t gotten lucky with catching fish. I catch a ton of panfish and everything in between, but my rainbow and trout hookup has been very poor.

My only experience with fly fishing was with a relative in Alaska during my extended stay. It was so much fun, but again it’s Alaska and this is PA so I realize my expectations.

It just seemed easier to set the hook and get a good fish on with the fly rod. So I got my beginner combo set (TFO Black Label NXT) in 9’ length 5 wt.

I made a welcome post describing how I picked up a nice lot of fly tying materials/tools and that’s what kinda jump started my interest.

I have some general ideas of what flies to use and I’d like to try out the Tulpehocken sometime this Fall. I’ve read that Zebra Midge and other nymphs do well here , but I have no idea what kind of rig to have. Do I need two flies on my line? Is one not good enough? Do I need a strike indicator/weight?

I’d also like a good pair of waders and felt boots but I’m not looking to spend $1000. It seems everything less than that is poor quality.

So I guess my main questions are what wader setup to get and how to setup my rod for fall trout fishing. Thanks!

Here’s a photo of my rod setup it feels great for what I paid. I also tied on a little dry fly on the end just for fun….before I read that midges work best in Fall time. Also took a photo of a few of the flies I received that were tied by an angler.

 

[Billr]

I would be careful with felt soles as many streams have outlawed them.

 

[JimNovo]

So not to be critical here….

Nice rod/reel.
Terrible flies.

If you are starting out nymphing, I’d focus on finding some decent Pheasant tails, Hares ears, Walt’s worms, Frenchies, Copper Johns and zebra midges. Theses flies will work nymphing. Happy to tie som for you if you like. PM me….

For a setup, you can go indicator style or Euro for nymphing. Lots written on these topics. You don’t need to make this complicated either. Indicator, 4x tippet, 1-2 flies and you can catch fish.

For waders and boots, if you pay more than $500 you are wasting your money in my opinion. Orvis and Reddington make decent gear that shouldn’t cost you a fortune. Lots of other options out there too.

 

[JimNovo]

I would be careful with felt soles as many streams have outlawed them.

In what states?

 

[ROVERT]

In what states?

Yeah, I've never heard of stream specific felt bans. There are states and national parks that have felt bans. PA is not one of them.

I've had good service from waders costing much less than $1000, Orvis and Paramount, specifically. My son uses some waders from Amazon (less than $100) and they're holding up well and have lasted much longer than I expected.

 

[poopdeck]

You don’t need to tie on two flies. Stick with one starting out. Jim nova recommendation on flies is spot on. I would just get some hares ears if you really want to catch trout.

as for waders, all waders leak. my current pair cost me 125. They are cabelas brand. They have never failed me prematurely. Boots, I had the Cabelas featherweights and they lasted 3 or 4 years Which was fine. I grabbed a pair of korkers for a couple hundred currently. bottom line is buy what you can afford and take care of them. There is no need to spend 500 on waders when starting out or ever for that matter. Learning how to fish is free with a little investment in time and you won’t need to buy the hype.

 

[BruceC2C]

Imo, This is excel advise in link below.

 

[mt_flyfisher]

Welcome, again, to the forum. As you can see, when you ask a question or 2 here, there is no lack of guys willing to give you advice.

Your flies are NOT terrible; many of them are just not the BEST patterns to use around here (Lancaster County), or at this time of the year, or on the Tulpehocken Creek, which you mentioned, to catch trout. I see some Elk Hair Caddis patterns, for example, among your flies, and these are some of the BEST trout flies, however, they may or may not be the best sizes and/or color choices for this time of the year, or on the streams you may be fishing. My advice is: decide where and when you’ll be fishing, and then seek out local, knowledgeable fly fisherman for recommendations.

There is NOTHING wrong with felt soled wading boots, in my opinion, unless of course you’re going to be fishing where they’re prohibited, which I believe may be only 6-7 states at this time, plus YNP, as mentioned. Maryland may be the only nearby state that has banned felt soles. ?? If you decide to get felt soled boots, it’s a good idea to clean and dry them thoroughly after using them, especially if you plan to fish different streams so as to not transport invasive species between watersheds. If you decide to get rubber soled wading shoes, they can be very slippery, so you’ll probably want to put metal cleats or spikes on them.

ALL waders do NOT leak, or most waders do not leak at least until they have been used for a time, and like everything, how long they will last without leaking depends on the waders’s quality, AND how you care for them. I have a pair of Simms waders that I’ve had for about 5 years now, and at least 100 days of use, and zero leaks so far. I’ve had other Simms waders in the past that developed many pin hole leaks after I walked through some wild rose bushes, but I fixed the leaks myself with 100 dabs of Aquaseal!

If you shop around you can often find good deals on waders, particularly at the season’s end, like we’re getting close to now, or when there are model changeovers. If you buy them online, make sure you get the right size (you’ll generally want to get wading shoes that are one size larger than your normal shoe size). In addition to places like Orvis or Cabelas, already mentioned, you might also find good deals on waders at places like Sierra Trading Post, or Moosejaw, for example. Moosejaw Is offering 30% off in “points” right now, than can be applied against subsequent purchases.

Since you mentioned possibly fishing the Tulpehocken, for example, in addition to asking locally for suggestions on the best flies to use there at this time of the year (which I already mentioned) - I’ve fished it many times in the past, but I’m certainly not the best person to give you advice on the better flies to fish there now, I suspect that most of the recommendations you‘d get would be to use mostly smaller nymphs or dry flies (sizes #18-#22) this time of the year, and use correspondingly smaller leader tippet sizes, 5x at the maximum, but better yet 6x, or possibly even 7x. You can also catch trout on streamers in larger sizes on the Tulpehocken, or on larger attractor type flies. (think squirmy wormies or San Juan worms, for example.)

That’s a great offer that @JimNovo made for flies; if you’d also want to meet locally for coffee some time to talk more about fly fishing for trout, as I suspect I live close by you, send me a PM here.

 

[tomgamber]

That’s a great offer that @JimNovo made for flies; if you’d also want to meet locally for coffee some time to talk more about fly fishing for trout, as I suspect I live close by you, send me a PM here.

This, and just keep trying. If you lived in WPA, I would have a set of waders to give you. Its an older neoprene set but they don't leak and they're warm.

 

[Nocktavius]

Best advice: Find somebody local (on here or otherwise) and head out a few times together. You can learn so much more fishing with others than you’ll ever learn either watching YouTube vids or trial and error. Almost everyone who fly fishes has had a mentor of sorts. Gear doesn’t matter much. Hell, you can get by with a 50$ pair of cables hip boots in most of our local water. If you’ve got a rod, reel, and fly line you’ve got plenty of gear.

Also, echo people’s comments that those nymphs ain’t it for PA. For nymphs: Walt’s worms, frenchies, Pats rubber legs, and perdigons will get you trout in every river in the world.

 

[Shawn Joseph]

@JSOutdoors you don’t need to spend $1k on waders. I have a pair of Redingtons that cost $200 that I bought at French Creek outfitters(miss that place). Going on 4 years with them. No leaks. Still holding up great.

You’ve gotten some good advice on flies from others here.

Start with fishing one fly. As you get better then play around with two. Keep it simple while you’re learning. Have fun!

 

[DomR]

Imo, This is excel advise in link below.

This is exactly how I was taught to nymph 40 years ago, still employ this tactic today. I also fish wet flies and soft hackles in the same type manner.

 

[Silent Ocelot]

Best advice: Find somebody local (on here or otherwise) and head out a few times together. You can learn so much more fishing with others than you’ll ever learn either watching YouTube vids or trial and error. Almost everyone who fly fishes has had a mentor of sorts. Gear doesn’t matter much. Hell, you can get by with a 50$ pair of cables hip boots in most of our local water. If you’ve got a rod, reel, and fly line you’ve got plenty of gear.

Also, echo people’s comments that those nymphs ain’t it for PA. For nymphs: Walt’s worms, frenchies, Pats rubber legs, and perdigons will get you trout in every river in the world.

Best Advice (from personal experience): fish with Nocktavius

This is the list of flies you want to go off, but there was one VERY important fly that was omitted... the mop fly.

 

[Bamboozle]

A couple of things:

The good news is the Delayed Harvest Section (Section 7) of the Tulpehocken is supposed to be stocked today. Fresh stockers should increase your odds of catching something.

You can call the TCO Fly Shop in West Lawn for some suggestions on flies that are working and buy some there, elsewhere or take Jim Novo up on his generous offer.

In regards to waders, IF I was overwhelmed I'd buy less expensive waders from Cabela's or Orvis as both companies are more flexible than most regarding warranty issues if something goes wrong.

IF you had a problem, both would also probably be more receptive to credit you with the failed product price towards an upgrade to a better product.

You do get what you pay for but if it was me, I'd rather get on with it and be fishing than spending precious hours researching and agonizing over the best waders for the price...

Good luck & good fishing!!

 

[Silent Ocelot]

So, the rundown.

Rod and reel should get it done. I'm not a fan of TFO but the rod will do all that you ask of it for now.

As for waders I personally think $1,000 for boots and waders is ABSURD. They're still wear items and I don't care how durable someone's $1,000 waders are or how long they lasted them. One major puncture can put you out for the day, and that means no fishing for the rest of the day, but I suppose that can happen to any set of waders. I buy waders annually and pay around $150, although the Simms Tributaries I just picked up were a whopping $229! I should have just bought the Orvis convertible ultralights if they are still $300. As for boots I like my Orvis Clearwaters that are about $200 with studs.

If my car gets back from the shop today and is no longer in limp mode with multiple misfires I'd drive out and fish the Tully with ya. My favorite spots on there are known as Palisades and Waterworks. In Nov of 2017 I caught my very first 20 inch trout out of the stretch below the bypass, and I should have lost that fish because I had so much slack in the water. I may have fished it once last year. I'm not too big on it as I'd rather drive 1-1.5 hours longer to get into some good trout. If you are dead set on fishing the Tully I will fish it with you and show you the flies I use there which are just heavy beaded perdigon variants that I find always pick up a few fish. You can also grind away at some suckers if you want (no shame in my game). Tight-lining it is a good idea and effective as some of the areas have some nasty cross-currents. I indicator fished in every time and did alright. The time to hit that creek is Spring when the flows should be up and they are dumping the 24 inchers into it. Keep in mind this creek gets a lot of pressure so you will have to compete for spots. I'm just no longer willing to go to it solo and have to compete for stocked fish considering I just did a salmon trip and had a whole hole to the group I was with. That place has gained notoriety and people hit it hard. The crowds should be cooling off now. You'll see a bump during the holidays. I like to fish it in winter as it can be productive and the fair weather crowds have long since disbanded it.

 

[DomR]

FYI - Sierra Trading Post has Simms Tributaries for $119 so long as you aren't looking for larges. They have a couple other reasonable pairs as well.

 

[hooker-of-men]

FYI - Sierra Trading Post has Simms Tributaries for $119 so long as you aren't looking for larges. They have a couple other reasonable pairs as well.

I had the same instinct, Dom, and I think I saw larges under a different listing (since the Sierra search function is sometimes wonky). @JSOutdoors Those are good waders for cheap. Secondhand boots can also result in great products for a very nice price, and condition can be assessed much more easily than used waders.

@Silent Ocelot If it makes you feel any better, they're the past season/older model Tributaries. I got mine from Sierra on the cheap and am very happy, but they are not the recent release (from earlier this year?).

 

[greywolf]

So not to be critical here….

Nice rod/reel.
Terrible flies.

If you are starting out nymphing, I’d focus on finding some decent Pheasant tails, Hares ears, Walt’s worms, Frenchies, Copper Johns and zebra midges. Theses flies will work nymphing. Happy to tie som for you if you like. PM me….

For a setup, you can go indicator style or Euro for nymphing. Lots written on these topics. You don’t need to make this complicated either. Indicator, 4x tippet, 1-2 flies and you can catch fish.

For waders and boots, if you pay more than $500 you are wasting your money in my opinion. Orvis and Reddington make decent gear that shouldn’t cost you a fortune. Lots of other options out there too.

I would start with size 14 - 16 flies in the types mentioned above. The flies you show look too big for many pa streams

 

[TimMurphy]

Dear JSoutdoors,

I've been flyfishing for well over 40 years and I can assure you that you can get into quality stocking foot waders and boots for $ 250.00 or less. A lot depends on your physical stature though. Without being critical of anyone if you are 5'7" and weigh 250 pounds, or if you are 6'5" and weigh 150 pounds finding waders can be a chore.

But if you are 5'9" to 6'3" and weigh between 150 and 250 pounds just about any wader maker has a size to fit you. Like others mentioned, Sierra Trading Post is a great place to look for waders if you are in the size range I mentioned. Check out Orvis and LL Bean too as they often have waders on clearance. I'm 6'5" and 350 pounds, and I'm on my second season with Caddis waders I bought from Amazon for $ 85.00. So far, so good!

Wading shoes are again a matter of personal choice. I wear a 12EEEE shoe, and I can tell you that I have worn size 13 wading shoes from Orvis, Hodgeman, Cabela's, Simms, LL Bean, Weinbrenner, Pro-Line, Ranger, and a couple of others. They all fit me fine with room to spare. The one thing you need to keep in mind with wading shoes is that as long as you don't buy shoes that fit like Bozo the Clowns shoe's you can always fill up excess room with socks. Thin liner socks and thicker 100% wool or synthetic socks work best. The liner sock is key, it wicks the sweat off of your skin and into the thicker socks. You need to know that cannot make room in tight fitting wading boots, and tight boots = cold feet and misery. You need some wiggle room for your toes in your boots so maybe they are something you need to head to a store to try on?

But there are plenty of places for you to still go out and flyfish without getting your feet wet. Don't be afraid to try learning casting and retrieving a fly line at a pond or a lake fishing for bass and panfish. There is still a lot of the Fall season left and bass and sunnies excuse mistakes much more readily than trout. Getting the feel for casting, hooking and line handling on fish like those will translate to trout fishing too!

Just take your time and have fun!

Regards,

Tim Murphy

 

[JSOutdoors]

Thanks for all the replies! I actually went to the Tully tonight and was surprised I saw maybe 7-10 anglers near and around the red bridge. I got my rod and reel out and messed around a little but got tangled and came home. . I’m pretty rusty but it was fun to use it. I definitely need waders and I will take anyone’s offer to fish the creek sometime. Was planning on tomorrow but it’s supposed to rain…and I’m pretty busy the rest of the month.

Really appreciate all the responses, I think I can find a good set of waders. Also those flies I showed were just from the lot of fishing stuff I bought , most of the stuff in it was saltwater stuff.