Wild_Trouter
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Just saw this in the local news:
http://www.centredaily.com/news/local/article192725104.html
http://www.centredaily.com/news/local/article192725104.html
salvelinusfontinalis
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Im sensing a no rebuttal post
salmonoid
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"Nestle spokeswoman Kerrin Garripoli said that potential withdrawal would support two bottling lines and amount to less than 1 percent of the average daily discharge of Spring Creek at Milesburg, which is about 25 percent of how much water Corning used for its operation."
Who or what is Corning? It is the only mention of the name in the article. In this age of media consolidation, I wonder if all the editors have been fired?
Who or what is Corning? It is the only mention of the name in the article. In this age of media consolidation, I wonder if all the editors have been fired?
nymphingmaniac
Well-known member
Corning had a CRT manufacturing plant in state college. The division was bought and ultimately moved out
Maurice
Administrator
Staff member
More extraction of state resources for private company profits. With no compensation to the commonwealth.
All so we can fill the earth with plastic bottles. Who will pay to clean them up? ....look in the mirror.
All so we can fill the earth with plastic bottles. Who will pay to clean them up? ....look in the mirror.
JackM
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Mother truckers.
T
troutbert
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The water was used for cooling in their glass plant. Which was a non-consumptive use. (Except maybe some loss through evaporation.) The return flow went into the upper end of Logan Branch, which is a tributary to Spring Creek.
A bottling plant is a CONSUMPTIVE use of water. Whatever quantity of water they use, the amount of water flowing down Spring Creek would be reduced by that quantity.
So the comparison of water usage with Corning's makes no sense.
M
Mike
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I find it helpful to convert withdrawals expressed in gallons per unit of time to millions of gallons per day and then multiply by 1.5 to convert to cubic feet per second.
afishinado
Moderator
Staff member
They got the heave-ho aka thumbs down in Oregon, Maine, California and mostly recently in the Poconos here, here, here , here, and here.
From the article:
"They identify small, rural communities, many times economically depressed, that they think they can roll over and who they think might be susceptible to promises of jobs and tax revenue," he said.
The company is looking at sites in Spring and Benner Townships in Centre County, he said, and the conceptual plan could include a pipeline between the spring source and bottling facility, which would save on transportation costs.
"Every gallon of water that is taken out of a natural system for bottled water is a gallon of water that doesn't flow down a stream, that doesn't support a natural ecosystem," said Peter Gleick, author of "Bottled and Sold."
Nestlé has faced protests over its water collection in California because of the drought and the fact that this site is on public land. While the company takes about 30 million gallons each year, they pay just $524 to the U.S. Forest Service for the permit.
From the article:
"They identify small, rural communities, many times economically depressed, that they think they can roll over and who they think might be susceptible to promises of jobs and tax revenue," he said.
The company is looking at sites in Spring and Benner Townships in Centre County, he said, and the conceptual plan could include a pipeline between the spring source and bottling facility, which would save on transportation costs.
"Every gallon of water that is taken out of a natural system for bottled water is a gallon of water that doesn't flow down a stream, that doesn't support a natural ecosystem," said Peter Gleick, author of "Bottled and Sold."
Nestlé has faced protests over its water collection in California because of the drought and the fact that this site is on public land. While the company takes about 30 million gallons each year, they pay just $524 to the U.S. Forest Service for the permit.
salvelinusfontinalis
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Isn't flowing water in the Commonwealth owned by every Pennsylvanian?
Where is my tax revenue and jobs? ;-)
Where is my tax revenue and jobs? ;-)
M
mav1958
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For some reason I thought Corning got their water from Bellefonte.
The news article says Nestle in talking to Spring Township. After a quick search, it looks like Spring Township's main water source is a well.
Is Aqua Penn still operating outside Milesburg?
The news article says Nestle in talking to Spring Township. After a quick search, it looks like Spring Township's main water source is a well.
Is Aqua Penn still operating outside Milesburg?
JimKennedy
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Article says 300 gallons per minute, which shakes out to 432,000 gallons per day, to be purchased from Spring Tsp Water Authority. The water authority draws from a 24-acre reservoir on trout stream Kern Run, a trib to Middle Creek.
Spring Township Water Auth. serves about 1,000 people (http://www.elibrary.dep.state.pa.us/dsweb/Get/Document-59524/RS4550011001%20Spring%20Twp.pdf) and typically water resources organizations plan for 180 gallons of water per day per person, or current need of probably closer to 200,000 gallons than the straight math figure of 180,000 because of leaks, fire hydrant uses and such.
Kern Run looks to be pretty tiny, maybe 5 cubic feet per second (37 gallons per second ) or less in summertime (5 cfs X7 .48 gallons per cubic foot=37 gallons per second). Math (37ish gallons per secondX60 seconds per minute X 60 minute per hour X 24 hours) would shake out to 3.1968 million gallons per day in the creek.
That would put the residents needs plus the company's wants at about 600,000 to 630,000 gallons per day, or about, and very roughly, 15 to 18 percent of the total creek (presuming the 5 cubic feet per second estimate is accurate).
Not sure what this means for any trout fishing that goes on in Kern Run, but below the reservoir, I wouldn't count on the stream flowing fast and cold throughout the summer months.
Spring Township Water Auth. serves about 1,000 people (http://www.elibrary.dep.state.pa.us/dsweb/Get/Document-59524/RS4550011001%20Spring%20Twp.pdf) and typically water resources organizations plan for 180 gallons of water per day per person, or current need of probably closer to 200,000 gallons than the straight math figure of 180,000 because of leaks, fire hydrant uses and such.
Kern Run looks to be pretty tiny, maybe 5 cubic feet per second (37 gallons per second ) or less in summertime (5 cfs X7 .48 gallons per cubic foot=37 gallons per second). Math (37ish gallons per secondX60 seconds per minute X 60 minute per hour X 24 hours) would shake out to 3.1968 million gallons per day in the creek.
That would put the residents needs plus the company's wants at about 600,000 to 630,000 gallons per day, or about, and very roughly, 15 to 18 percent of the total creek (presuming the 5 cubic feet per second estimate is accurate).
Not sure what this means for any trout fishing that goes on in Kern Run, but below the reservoir, I wouldn't count on the stream flowing fast and cold throughout the summer months.
JimKennedy
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Presuming I have the right Spring Township...
R
rrt
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I think a water company already draws, or used to draw, water from a building along Spruce Creek, which probably is taking/took the water from the creek. It fills/-ed tankers that go/went somewhere. Is this still in operation? How much damage does it/did it do to Spruce Creek?
Is/was this Nestle?
Anyhow, one in Spring Township sounds like a bad idea.
Is/was this Nestle?
Anyhow, one in Spring Township sounds like a bad idea.
T
troutbert
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Nope.
JackM
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Yes/no
nymphingmaniac
Well-known member
spruce creek.- I have not seen a tanker drawing water from there for 4-5 years now. If it still occurs, it is at a MUCH lower frequency than in the past. I have seen no evidence of activity around the pipe (wet spots, tracks).
AquaPenn- yes, they still bottle water in milesburg.
TB is correct that corning returned a large part of the water, warmed, but returned.
there's a lot of permits/agreements to sell water in the Spring creek watershed. Most have not been realized yet, thankfully.
AquaPenn- yes, they still bottle water in milesburg.
TB is correct that corning returned a large part of the water, warmed, but returned.
there's a lot of permits/agreements to sell water in the Spring creek watershed. Most have not been realized yet, thankfully.
Camp
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There are lots of other waterways that could better support this use. I would reject this permit and suggest they use the Allegheny river.
Chaz
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Exactly!
jifigz
Well-known member
Which you don't. Kern run is dammed and is a small 25 acre reservoir or so in Snyder County just outside of Beaver Springs. That Spring Township is southeast by 30 or 40 miles as the crow flies I'd say.
The article and video never mention where they wanted to pull the water from. They just stated that it would come out of the Spring Creek watershed and that the area is full of high quality springs (which is true.) I browsed Spring Township's website and they did not disclose where they get their water from. As far as I know there are no sizable reservoirs so it almost had to be pulled from a deep well or a flowing water. Given that they are bottling Deer Park (touted as Spring Water) I would not assume the water will come from a well but from a small, high quality feeder spring that feeds Spring Creek. I could see this reducing the amount of good, cold water from this spring that would help keep Spring Creek cold farther downstream.
On a side note First Quality all ready has a bottling plant that pulls water directly from Bald Eagle Creek in Lock Haven. Notice how that water is not branded as "spring water" and is sold as "purified water.". Every bottle of water discloses any and all water sources.
