It aint nothing but a strike indicator

[captbugger]

For all the years i've been fly fishing 90% of my success was focused sub surface. Nymphing high sticking you name it. Tips of the trade for me is when using a nymph rig i always use a xs barral swivel. This helps with using multi fly rig ups. However, the main purpose is when i use an indicator it continues to have a natural looking drift. My main nymph rig is an old leader that has 4 1/2 feet left. This is tied to the swivel then tippet down out to 7ft overall length. For the individuals who really use the longer leader set up no problem. Straight lining from a 7 ft leader to the swivel to the tippet. Set your indicator to the length and no matter what your rig stays taggle free in the drift. This also works for my swingers and streamer boys/girls.

Let me know how this works for you.....

 

[PennypackFlyer]

I use a dry fly as an indicator with a dropper. Depending on the depth of the creek/river will determine length of line to the nymph or midge.

 

[PennKev]

I think if you review the nymph fishing threads on this forum you will see many advocating a similar rig for nymphing with the only difference being the omition of the swivel.

Personally I use a tippet ring, but would use swivels if I could find them consistently in a small enough size. Rings and swivels make changing the front half of the leader a snap.

Kev

 

[captbugger]

Walmart and gmnt carries these swivels also it seems that a loop knot holds it very well

 

[PennKev]

The ones I've seen at those places are too big for my taste. I've seen a few sold for center pin fishing a and carp fishing that are much smaller but are not conveniently available.

Kev

 

[captbugger]

I used to work at gmnt. One day stocking shelves i stumbledonto a pack and thats when i was thinking icpuld use these been using them ever since.

 

[captbugger]

I used to work at gmnt. One day stocking shelves i stumbledonto a pack and thats when i was thinking icpuld use these been using them ever since.

 

[SteelerFan]

The nice thing about using either the tippet ring or barrel swivel is if you break off, it is below the tippet ring or swivel.

 

[Dobeitz]

Not sure why I never thought to seek out an xs barrel swivel. You tie it above your strike indicator??

 

[WildTigerTrout]

I have used XS barrel swivels in place of the tippet ring. IMO the barrel swivels work just as well for nymphing and are ALOT less expensive. I try to buy them in the black matte finish.

 

[PhilC]

My leader set ups are constantly evolving.
For an Indy rig I use roughly 3 sections:
-butt: 4-5 ft; usually 15 lb stiff mono or fluoro. This can go up to 20lb if I need it to turn over better. This can also go down to 12 lb which is harder to cast but helps keep your Indy drag free...
-sinking section: usually 12 lb fluoro sometimes going down to 10 lb. This section tapers down accordingly to the butt with a double surgeons and I don't like extreme difference in diameters which make a weak connection. This section sinks so the thinner the better, but the thinner the harder to cast. So a 12 lb butt with 10 lb sinking section would give the best drifts but be the hardest to cast. The length of this section depends on water depth and ranges from 4-8 ft. Beyond 8 ft it gets hard to cast and you might want to add an extra section to the butt to add some taper and help casting...ie instead of having 10ft of 10ln sinking section split the difference with 5ft of 12ln and 5ft of 10lb. This is the section where you slide your Indy up and down
***swivel***
-tippet: whatever you prefer here. Where you put your weight will effect length. If you weight near the fly or flies (or use weighted flies) then you have to factor the distance from your Indy to the flies or weight to be near the bottom. Some people add weight above the swivel so the sinking section needs to get you to the bottom.

For swivels I've settled on Spro 35 lb'ers. They have them at cabelas and shops with steelhead/pinning gear. There's other brands and the smaller the better. I'd say I prefer swivels over tippet rings in most situations. If you're tight lining a tippet ring is slightly lighter which gives it an edge. And on small to medium creeks it doesn't make at much of a difference. If you use a tippet ring on a big Indy rig on a big river you're line is going to twist up badly...it gets worse with multiple fly rigs
I've run into rising fish while using a swivel and was still able keep dries floating enough to catch those fish. Putting a glob of floatant on the swivel and surrounding line will help extend your float time but I wouldn't suggest this all day...I tippet ring being lighter would also have an advantage here

 

[krayfish]

Phil,

I made you an adjustable thingamabobber rig for our next trip. 6' section of 24# amnesia. Bobber threaded on with old fly line nail knotted above and below it. Loop connection to fly line and tippet ring at the end. You can adjust your bobber 5-6' depending on depth you want to fish. You can run 3-4x fluoro right off the tippet ring. Not sure how they'll work but well give them a shot. The fly line nail knot will wear out after a full day or two of moving the rig but I've got 30 more yards to use up. In theory, it's perfect but we'll see after trial run next Saturday

 

[PennKev]

krayfish wrote:
Phil,

I made you an adjustable thingamabobber rig for our next trip. 6' section of 24# amnesia. Bobber threaded on with old fly line nail knotted above and below it. Loop connection to fly line and tippet ring at the end. You can adjust your bobber 5-6' depending on depth you want to fish. You can run 3-4x fluoro right off the tippet ring. Not sure how they'll work but well give them a shot. The fly line nail knot will wear out after a full day or two of moving the rig but I've got 30 more yards to use up. In theory, it's perfect but we'll see after trial run next Saturday

I've been using this setup for a while now and it works great. The only real downside is that you cannot quickly remove the thingamabobber if you want to fish without it. You have to remove the whole leader.

As for the nail knots, they have to have the right number of turns or wraps or else they will not ave enough bite to keep the bobber from sliding down the leader when you pickup the line on the back cast. I've also tried commercial rubber bobber stops, and they were not enough to keep a 1/2" thingamabobber in place. On the other hand, fly line nail knots tied with 5 turns and cinched very tightly kept the indicator firmly in place.

An extra benefit of the nail knot bobber stops is that they allow the thingamabobber to rotate freely around the leader rather than imparting a twist into it.


Kev

 

[krayfish]

Positive report makes me feel like it should work. I'll give it a test run next weekend. Interested to see how it performs.

 

[krayfish]

Kev,

The test run was a flop. The indi should be loose and able to spin but it twisted the crap out of my leader. I don't know if I had a bad butt section on there or what. Ended up chopping it off and went to my old 90 degree rig from the past couple of years. That one didn't give me any issues. I used heavy amnesia for butt section but it might be too soft. I'll try some Maxima on the next version. What did you use for your butt section? Mono nail knots or fly line nail knots? I think it should work great but the one I had on was a dud.

 

[PennKev]

Kray,

Here's the specifics on my rig and then I'll offer some ideas as to what went wrong. I've used the following rig 4 days this week and had zero twist problems.

Butt: 4-5' of 20lb Stren Big Game (or whatever, it is just stuff I bought at wally world).

Stops: 5 turn nail knots from an old 6 weight line.

Indicator: 3/4" Thingamabobber

Mid/bottom: 4+' of 6 or 8lb 100% fluoro P-line attached to butt via a tippet ring.

Tippet: 6 or 4lb 100% fluoro P-line.

Weight: Appropriate size and number of shot positioned just above the mid section-to-tippet connection knot.




As for your twisting problems, I think there are three possible problems that stand out:

1) The stops could be jammed against the thingamabobber too tightly and it is not turning freely around the leader. You could probably get away with leaving a 1/4" or so of play between the stops so that the TAMB moves very freely at the desired location on the butt.

2) The stops themselves are two small in diameter and are jamming into the loop on the TAMB and preventing it from spinning freely when casting or picking the line up from the water. Using a thicker piece of fly line could solve the problem.

3) The flies are twisting the leader. I've had problems with some larger rubber legs nymphs twisting up tippets in the past.

Of the three, I think #1 and #2 are the most likely . It's hard for me to say since I've had zero trouble with the rig so far except that I think i will be making some 30lb butts as the 20lb mono is a little light for casting heavier rigs with bigger flies. I think 30lb coupled with a heavier mid section will do a better job with turnover in some situations. That said, I fished all larger sized streams this past week and did well with the rig.

Like I said, I've had no trouble with the rig other than the nail knots on my first rigs sliding too easily. That was solved by adding a turn to the nail knot in order to increase grip on the butt. My suggestions are only based on educated guesses. There are a limited number of things that could be causing the twist. It's either the TAMB no turning freely or the the twist are coming from somewhere else. If it is the flies causing the problem, perhaps swapping out a small swivel for the tippet ring (or whatever connection you are using) could minimize the twist.

Kev

 

[krayfish]

Ok. I think my butt section is 24# amnesia that's 6' long. For shoppers, used old 3wt fly line. That could be the issue.

I connected the butt via big tippet ring. Went straight to 3x fluoro and had come big tungsten beaded nymphs on the line. The twist was in the 3x leading to the first fly. It was twisted like I falsed casted a #8 coffin fly for an hour.....on 7x.

The stops might have kept indi from spinning. Going from 24# right to 3x might have also contributed. I'll try bigger scraps of line to make stoppers, taper down from butt section, stiffer / slightly shorter butt section and might try micro swivel in place of tippet ring. One or all should correct the issue.

 

[PennKev]

Yeah you probably want to make your stops from something heavier than 3wt line. I did my first ones from 2wt line and if I gave the indicator a fair tug it would pop the stopper right through the thingamabobber's loop. I'm thinking the 3wt stops would probably get stuck in there.

Moving up from 3x will probably help too though I've been dragging some big conehead buggers around as my lead fly and still using 6lb fluro which is 4x if I'm not mistaken without issues. Casting is a little wonky with the heavy fly and light bottom section of the leader but no twist issues due to it.

Kev

 

[fisherboy3]

No one else uses yarn?? I hate thingamabobbers. In bigger water theyre OK but in small water they can scare fish and I've seen it. Good floating yarn like the new zealand indicator kit really is a great deal. Light when you cast, and if you get tangled with the indicator you can just pop it right off. I've had many tangles with the bobber that made me just snip it off.-Kev

 

[PennKev]

fisherboy3 wrote:
No one else uses yarn?? I hate thingamabobbers. In bigger water theyre OK but in small water they can scare fish and I've seen it. Good floating yarn like the new zealand indicator kit really is a great deal. Light when you cast, and if you get tangled with the indicator you can just pop it right off. I've had many tangles with the bobber that made me just snip it off.-Kev

Yarn is fine but many times you need an indicator that will support some weight underneath it and the thingamabobbers are pretty much the gold standard in extremely bouyant indictors. They also do not get waterlogged. When I first started fishing I used yarn almost exclusively but it becomes a pain the butt if you put in a full day of nymphing. It gets waterlogged, doesn't support much weight, etc. Also, you can use a much smaller thingamabobber compared to a yarn indicator if you need buoyancy. If you are fishing medium to larger sized water, thingamabobbers are the way to go in my opinion. I still use a small piece of yarn tied into a leader knot when I need to get stealthy, but I rarely use it if there is much weight in my rig.

Kev