Fooled by the brookies

[Mike]

Sometimes even the pros get it wrong. A few years ago while surveying wild trout streams (unassessed waters program) in Schuylkill Co that were tribs to the Schuylkill River we drove along a second order stream and I decided that due to the agricultural valley (some active, some inactive), relatively low gradient, and very limited tree cover (stream mainly lined with shrubs) it was unlikely to support a wild trout population. A few years later in Schuylkill Co we surveyed a similar stream (Keenigs Ck) and found a small population of brooks and browns. After that surprise my mind kept going back to that unnamed trib that I had passed up originally. Yesterday we finally took the opportunity to survey the stream. In an ah-ha moment, we discovered that it supported a wild brook trout population that was primarily comprised of sublegal fish in stretch that we electrofished.

In addition to that, but on a related note, we surveyed a stream with a rubble-gravel substrate that was coated with mining-related iron precipitate (as were the recently fallen leaves that had accumulated along the stream margins). One of my crew members gave me "the look," as in "are you sure you want to survey this stream?" Despite the ugly appearance, as if nothing could be alive in that creek, the pH was 6.8 and wild brookies were present. Brook trout are nothing if not resilient (in large part as long as the water is cold and pH is suitable).

Two more streams will eventually be added to the wild trout streams list and associated wetlands will then receive the Exceptional Value classification. Given their location, the streams are already classified CWF (coldwater fishes).

Just for clarification, I am on a day off. This was not written on company time.

 

[TimRobinsin]

very good to hear. Hopefully these streams will be added sooner rather than later. I believe there is a considerable back-log of streams to be added to the wild trout stream list. I think I heard a number close to 400 streams have been surveyed and are waiting to be added to the list? perhaps you know more about this.

 

[JackM]

In PA, why can't any flowing water with an average depth of 8 inches and an average width of 24 inches be presumed to have wildlife worthy of protection from pollution? Put the burden on the polluter to prove otherwise. I know it is your day off, Mike, so you don't have to toe/tow the company line.

 

[greenghost]

Thanks Mike. Your post reminds us there is always hope and possibility for the future of our environment and our sport. A positive way to bring in the new year!

 

[The_Sasquatch]

TimRobinsin wrote:
very good to hear. Hopefully these streams will be added sooner rather than later. I believe there is a considerable back-log of streams to be added to the wild trout stream list. I think I heard a number close to 400 streams have been surveyed and are waiting to be added to the list? perhaps you know more about this.

Good point. I know of a few in Lanc Lanc that have been on the waiting list a couple of years now. Once they get on the list to be added to THE list, what holds up designating a stream?

 

[SteveG]

JackM wrote:
In PA, why can't any flowing water with an average depth of 8 inches and an average width of 24 inches be presumed to have wildlife worthy of protection from pollution? Put the burden on the polluter to prove otherwise.

In a perfect world this would be the way it should be. For the heck of it, I fished behind a strip mall the other week on a small creek that does get stocked by a local club in the spring time a bit further down. It was such a delight to catch a few small wild browns, even in the face of runoff and erosion.

 

[SteveG]

Mike, do you ever allow volunteers to come along when you do these surveys? I'd be interested in helping sometime.

 

[Chaz]

I have passed many brookie streams thinking that the chances of fish surviving in them would be doubtful, still I checked them our and I'm happy to say that many had brookie populations.
One looked just as you described, and I thought I told you about it. All the trout were tiny. It was in Tremont PA.

 

[geebee]

Chaz wrote:
I have passed many brookie streams thinking that the chances of fish surviving in them would be doubtful, still I checked them our and I'm happy to say that many had brookie populations.
One looked just as you described, and I thought I told you about it. All the trout were tiny. It was in Tremont PA.

i often wonder if these streams have seasonal populations of wild fish - fall, winter & spring. perhaps fish can spawn there and their parr grows and gets washed down the watershed by run off ?

i wonder how the survey would have been if carried out in July ?

 

[lv2nymph]

Mike wrote

Just for clarification, I am on a day off. This was not written on company time.

Damn shame you felt there was a need to add this disclaimer :-(
Thanks for all your work & effort...

 

[LeTortAngler2]

Good post Mike, thanks for sharing.
"Damn shame you felt there was a need to add this disclaimer
Thanks for all your work & effort..."
Agree

 

[Mike]

Note: For the most accurate description refer to DEP's Chapter 93. I have attempted to provide some basics off the top of my head....

The root of stream protection in Pa is the federal clean water act, which I have read had its start in Pa's Schuylkill River clean-up. It is implemented at least in part through DEP's Chapter 93 (water quality standards), which through its stream classification system provides protection for designated "uses"...WARMWATER fishes WWF, trout stocked fisheries TSF, and coldwater fishes CWF.

Each can have a special protection modifier of HQ high quality or EV exceptional value in cases where extra protection based on even higher standards is warranted. PFBC designated Class A streams, for instance, receive a HQ classification in addition to the base classification of CWF. All streams and rivers have been classified under the Chapter 93 system, but relatively few receive the HQ and especially the EV modifiers. "All" includes the small streams that Jack mentioned.

While not limited to the following, the primary protective features are the discharge limits placed on point source discharges through National Pollution Discharge Elimination System (NPDES) permits. The discharge limits match those established for each stream's respective classification at a flow of Q7-10, the seven consecutive day, ten year low flow for each stream.. Total stream loads of pollutants from all point source discharges are also considered by DEP.

EV Streams are the most protected from point source discharges and are those with the best water quality. Wetlands along any wild trout stream are classified EV once the stream is officially designated as being a wild trout stream by the PFBC. This is one major reason why streams supporting wild trout populations need to be identified and documented by the PFBC or its cooperators and why I have repeatedly asked anglers on this Board to provide the PFBC with leads on such waters.

Finally, the skill in identifying the wild trout streams by PFBC crews comes in identifying the marginal ones that could fly under the radar.
Likewise, using best judgment to find the most downstream limit of the wild trout populations on each stream is also important in being efficient rather than running many sampling sites to do so.

 

[Mike]

SteveG,
We on occasion have spectators, including invited spectators or anglers or landowners who just happen to be present. In conducting the unassessed waters surveys in my region, however, we have not invited spectators because we are usually on private land and sometimes on palatial estates. We try to avoid the "caravans" due to landowner sensitivities. If we were on public land at times, spectators would not be problematic. You would most likely have better luck hooking up with the Southcentral AFM, as there is much more public land in his region.

 

[troutbert]

geebee wrote:

Chaz wrote:
I have passed many brookie streams thinking that the chances of fish surviving in them would be doubtful, still I checked them our and I'm happy to say that many had brookie populations.
One looked just as you described, and I thought I told you about it. All the trout were tiny. It was in Tremont PA.

i often wonder if these streams have seasonal populations of wild fish - fall, winter & spring. perhaps fish can spawn there and their parr grows and gets washed down the watershed by run off ?

i wonder how the survey would have been if carried out in July ?

If you walk small brook trout streams in the summer low water months, you will see that they are still there.

During drought conditions, much of the streambed is just a bare trickle, and sometimes there are stretches that are entirely dry.

But in the pools, you will see the brookies. That's where they survive the droughts. During droughts you can really see the extreme importance of pool habitat.

 

[troutbert]

Mike wrote:
A few years ago while surveying wild trout streams (unassessed waters program) in Schuylkill Co that were tribs to the Schuylkill River we drove along a second order stream and I decided that due to the agricultural valley (some active, some inactive), relatively low gradient, and very limited tree cover (stream mainly lined with shrubs) it was unlikely to support a wild trout population. A few years later in Schuylkill Co we surveyed a similar stream (Keenigs Ck) and found a small population of brooks and browns. After that surprise my mind kept going back to that unnamed trib that I had passed up originally. Yesterday we finally took the opportunity to survey the stream. In an ah-ha moment, we discovered that it supported a wild brook trout population that was primarily comprised of sublegal fish in stretch that we electrofished.

Some of the streams that are impacted by ag, poor vegetation conditions, development etc. hold trout, and others do not.

But what are the main factors are that tip a stream one way or the other? Is it mainly riparian vegetation? Or percentage of undeveloped land in the whole watershed? Or something in the geology that affects the baseflow coming out of the groundwater? Some combination of all of the above?

 

[wgmiller]

Wait.... Trout aren't fragile creatures after all?!?!!? :lol:

 

[JackM]

PH, fertility and cover.

 

[BrooksAndHooks]

I have fished them in several unlisted streams before, and have also found them flourishing in streams that supposedly had runoff from mines and or acid rain. One stream comes to mind that is classified class A, but gets sampled by local colleges for pH and acid damage regularly. I have also seen sections of the stream or puddles beside it that were completely orange. Despite this the water is crystal clear in the stream and teaming with fish. This is surprising because it is what I would classify as a freestoner. I have had my best brookie day on this stream with 17 in an afternoon. It definitely is surprising what some streams can hold. It just so happens that this is the smallest stream I have ever fished.

 

[PAgeologist]

We did an assessment of a stream in Jefferson County impacted by mine drainage. We did macros and electrofishing surveys upstream and downstream of several known mine discharges.

The results were suprising. Upstream - abundance of insects, no fish, and good water quality. Downstream of the mine drainage - not much for insect life, poor water quality (moderate pH but high in aluminum and iron), but we found numerous native brookies and a wild brown and no other fish. Not sure what these fish were doing here and what they were eating. I couldnt believe that trout are able to live in that water.

 

[pcray1231]

PH, fertility and cover.

For growing large fish and high numbers, perhaps. But fertility and cover are not necessary for merely the presence of wild fish.

1. Access to suitable water temps in late summer.
2. PH
3. Access to suitable breeding sites (gravel).

These two are all that's required. Note I said "access to", rather than cool water temps or breeding sites. For water temps, even if the stream warms, cool springs, cool feeders, etc. can do the trick. Same for breeding sites, tributaries with them will do the trick.

There are some truly tiny trickles with wild trout present. I've also seen (the presence of) fish in some extraordinarily low T_Alk value streams, so long as PH is ok. That's not to say they are "good" from a fishing perspective. But a low number of 3 and 4 inchers is still a population....