Different weight line(s) on rod

[volcanomil]

What would be the advantages/disadvantages of putting a different weight line on a rod other than it is listed as?

I have a G.Loomis GL2 7'6" 4wt and is it corrent to say that if I load and cast a normal 5wt line on this rod - the rod becomes a fuller flex or more of a medium action?

The same question for a Sage Launch in 5wt - if I try to cast a 4wt on it - does this version become a faster action?

Instead of buying different rods, can one change some casting characteristics by changing lines. I think I would like my shorter rod (the Loomis) a little softer and my bigger stream rod (Sage) somewhat faster?

Does anybody do this on a regular basis? In the end it might be a toss up - with the current price of fly line - you can almost buy a very good rod for what 2 new lines cost?

Thanks...

 

[afishinado]

volcanomil wrote:
What would be the advantages/disadvantages of putting a different weight line on a rod other than it is listed as?

I have a G.Loomis GL2 7'6" 4wt and is it corrent to say that if I load and cast a normal 5wt line on this rod - the rod becomes a fuller flex or more of a medium action?

The same question for a Sage Launch in 5wt - if I try to cast a 4wt on it - does this version become a faster action?

Instead of buying different rods, can one change some casting characteristics by changing lines. I think I would like my shorter rod (the Loomis) a little softer and my bigger stream rod (Sage) somewhat faster?

Does anybody do this on a regular basis? In the end it might be a toss up - with the current price of fly line - you can almost buy a very good rod for what 2 new lines cost?

Thanks...

Good question. My experience has been, that rods on one end of the spectrum or other (fast or slow) are the best candidates for over or underlining. Slower rods may be able to cast well with one line weight less, faster rods may cast well with one line weight heavier. It depends on the rod really.

A Loomis GL2 is a moderate/slow rod and a line weight less may be okay for longer casts but you would probably overload it with a 5wt line. The Sage Launch is a moderate action, and you can try it both ways, but I would guess the 5wt line it's rated for would cast best.

As I said, rods on either extreme usually respond best, but string 'em up and give 'em a try. Good luck.

 

[Fishidiot]

Honestly, I'm not much of a stickler for matching lines to rods. Maybe I'm just not a good enough caster to tell much of a difference. Sometimes I cast an 8WT line on my 10WT rod and it works okay (not great) for me. Certainly, lining a rod up or down changes its action and feel but, as afish said, give it a try and decide for yourself.

 

[pcray1231]

What Afish said is correct, however, he didn't mention distance. Faster rods do handle overloading better than slow rods, and a GL2 is a slow/moderate action. However, I said overloading, not overlining. The load has to take into account line weight AND distance. If you're casting distance is to be short, then overlining the rod is actually proper loading. If the casting distance is extraordinarily long, then underlining it is actually proper loading.

A rod weight rating is for x number of feet of fly line out past the rod tip, so it doesn't include the weight of the strung line, nor the leader. I think the distance is 30 feet but would have to double check, plus "proper" loading depends on opinion anyway so G Loomis's recommendation may or may not coincide with your own preferences. With, say, a 10 foot leader, thats a 40 foot cast. So your rod says a 4 wt, then a 4 wt line should, according to GLoomis, properly load it with a 40 foot cast.

Given the length of your rod I'm assuming your planning on using it as a small stream rod. My small stream casts rarely exceed 25 feet. So if that were my rod, I'd load it with 5 wt line, and it probably would be closer to "proper" loading than a 4 wt line.

 

[osprey]

Vol you can use a different line weight without much trouble you just need to adjust your cast a little, for instance i have a 6' old orvis bamboo that a dear departed friend gave me years ago (you can't afford bamboo on a steelworkers salary) the rod is old and back then they didn't make anything smaller than a 5 wt but i'm down to a 3 now (weight forward) and it's more fun than a clown on fire, the recomended weight written on the rod is a 5 wt.

 

[afishinado]

pcray1231 wrote:
What Afish said is correct, however, he didn't mention distance. Faster rods do handle overloading better than slow rods, and a GL2 is a slow/moderate action. However, I said overloading, not overlining. The load has to take into account line weight AND distance. If you're casting distance is to be short, then overlining the rod is actually proper loading. If the casting distance is extraordinarily long, then underlining it is actually proper loading.

A rod weight rating is for x number of feet of fly line out past the rod tip, so it doesn't include the weight of the strung line, nor the leader. I think the distance is 30 feet but would have to double check, plus "proper" loading depends on opinion anyway so G Loomis's recommendation may or may not coincide with your own preferences. With, say, a 10 foot leader, thats a 40 foot cast. So your rod says a 4 wt, then a 4 wt line should, according to GLoomis, properly load it with a 40 foot cast.

Given the length of your rod I'm assuming your planning on using it as a small stream rod. My small stream casts rarely exceed 25 feet. So if that were my rod, I'd load it with 5 wt line, and it probably would be closer to "proper" loading than a 4 wt line.

pcray,

The distance you mentioned, 30', is actually the benchmark for determining the weight of fly line. For example, the first 30’ of 4wt fly line weighs 120gr., and 5wt weighs 140gr., etc. These are benchmarks and not the distance where the rod loads “properly”. If that were the case, from your example, all rods would only load “properly” at 40’. A rod should perform well at all distances. And as you stated, you can tweek things with a heavier line if you are primarily fishing short, and a lighter line for distance casting. Also, some rod don’t really suit some casting styles and changing the line wt is one way of changing or tweeking the casting characteristics of a rod. Quite frankly, to me, if you test cast different rods before you bought one, you should be able to find a rod that suits your casting style and/or your fishing needs without tweeking it.

I believe you are an engineer. Here is a great, but fairly complex system for determining rod action and power. It’s very interesting.

http://www.common-cents.info/part1.pdf

I wish rod mfg gave the ERN and IP numbers for their rods. It would simplify rod selection since once you know the rod characteristics that you want, you can select the rods to test that most match what you prefer or what you need to get the job done.

 

[pcray1231]

Afish, thanks, very interesting link. Certainly some models can handle more overloading than others, or perhaps the correct way to say it is that manufacturers recommendations are squeezed into too few options (would be like rounding the length of a rod to the nearest yard), and due to marketing tactics still manage to miss on occasion.

There is little question in my mind, though, that a 5 wt line at short distances should provide similar load to a 4 wt line at long distances. A quick and easy approach would be just to compare the actual weights of those lengths of line, so if a 4 wt line weighs x grams at 30', a 5 wt line that weighs exactly the same is how long? If you want to be perfectly accurate there's more to the physics, but I don't want to get into that. Sure, a good rod should be able to handle a range of distances, but most rods can handle a range of line weights too. Just that the bigger ones will do slightly better in close and the lighter ones better at distance.

The only reason I commented on your post is that I noticed the rod in question was 7'6", and it stands to reason it was going to be a small stream rod. I rarely even approach 30' casts on such streams. Just loading it with 4 wt line for close distance work is a viable approach and the rod should handle it, and this is especially attractive since the GL2 is underpowered to begin with (i.e. perhaps should be labeled a 3 wt). But most of the time for "short distance only" rods I overline them, and if it were mine I think I'd still have to at least see how the GL2 casted with a 5 wt line.