Black/Hayes Creek

[wildtrout2]

Well, after 5 years of wondering if the "storied" (2013 Survey) upper secton of Black/Hayes Creek is worth the hike, I found out today. It isn't! I hiked up past Fourth Run from Rt 534 before even wetting a line. I started fishing when I was able to hear traffic on Rt 80. I managed two small 8" and one nice 13.5" wild brown (great fight!) before quitting 200yrds upstream of Pa 80.

The water had perfect flow, fairly clear for tannic water, and was 56F. I didn't see another soul all day. It's a shame, Hayes is a beautiful stream, it just has a very poor population of wild trout. That 2013 Survey had me believing otherwise.

Granted, it was done in August last year when the water would have been much warmer, but I still should have caught more than 3 trout today with mid 50's water temps. A really pretty day to be streamside, I just won't be fishing Hayes anymore though.

 

[Swattie87]

wt2 - I fished it a few weeks ago...parked at the lower SGL lot by the golf course and fished from Fourth Run up to I80. Did a little better than your outing, but not near as good as you'd think for that kind of water and what the PFBC report would lead you to believe.

If you use a mapping tool and know the stream you can pretty accurately figure out the stretch where they found the big biomass numbers from the RM numbers. I did and it made sense...it's very difficult to fish that stretch effectively. Primo habitat but tough to get anything to them. My guess is that biomass is very localized and a lot of that number may have even come from one spot in particular.

 

[Chaz]

You'd probably want to fish it when the water is maybe 60, but I've never done well there.
The PFBC surveyed it last years and found plenty of browns, for what that's worth.

 

[geebee]

thats a shame - what time did you fish it ?

 

[k-bob]

fwiw a few years back I fished fourth run upstream from Hayes/black more than half a mile and found only a few fish. very remote feeling tiny stream

 

[troutbert]

Do you all think it's possible that the high numbers in the survey might come from lots of trout moving up from the river, when the river gets warm? They usually do their surveys in the summer.

 

[Brownie101]

How long did you hike to get to the upper section?

 

[mikesl]

Thanks for sharing the info.
This one has been on my list for exploration.

 

[lycoflyfisher]

Not sure how this stream was sampled, but for unnassessed waters the protocol only calls for a 100m sampling section. The groups I have been around typically try to find good habitat as close to the mouth as possible. So if the survey was done as unnassessed waters close to the mouth there is a great chance that many of the fish may have came from the larger body of water. The surveys are ran in such a small section that it is very possible to affect the results just by selecting an area with above average habitat compared to the rest of the stream.

 

[Swattie87]

This stream has been surveyed many times. According to the latest report, there are two sampling sites...one close to the mouth and one upstream a ways. The one close to the mouth found a decent, but not class A population. It was the further upstream site that posted the big numbers. Given the topography it would be a heck of a swim for a large quantity of Lehigh fish to get there I think. Possible maybe, but not likely. I'd expect the Lehigh Summer transplants to be closer to the mouth and show in those numbers.

lyco - If my mapping was correct, according to the report they picked the specific absolute best habitat for the upstream site.

 

[wildtrout2]

Brownie101 wrote:
How long did you hike to get to the upper section?

From Rt 534 I hiked up a bit past Fourth Run, which is a mile. That took about an hour. Then I fished up past Rt 80, which is another mile. So, all together about a little over 2 miles total. I actually started fishing around 8:00AM.

 

[lycoflyfisher]

Ok are we talking about black creek that runs through weatherly? If so I was just there last week collecting macro samples, and have to go back later in summer to do an electro fishing survey. Right above town there is great habitat, huge boulders that form deep holes, great riffle areas and tons of cover. I can see the sample results beings skewed if that's where the survey was.

 

[Swattie87]

Black Creek near Hickory Run SP.

Although I'd be interested to know your survey results on that Black Creek too!

 

[k-bob]

re the weatherly black creek:

http://fishandboat.com/images/fisheries/afm/2006/5x10_23lehigh_tribs.htm

 

[Swattie87]

Thanks Bob. I thought I remembered reading that somewhere. From what I've gathered most of the larger western tribs to the Lehigh in the Gorge section are dead.

 

[Chaz]

As for the Black Creek in the OP it may be hard during the summer for trout to get up from the river, I think that there is a culvert that makes it hard for fish to get up over except in high water. then again it may be on Hickory Run.

 

[lycoflyfisher]

The black creek by weatherly appears to be healthy and there's solid bug life. Below the town there is a major trib coming in, I can't remember the name off the top of my head, but it is majorly amd impaired amd basically kills the creek all the way to the mouth. If that discharge is cleaned up, the habitat is there that has potential to support a wild trout population.

 

[k-bob]

this is the weatherly area/ west bank of the Lehigh black creek... (map 1-6 on page 562 of massive pdf below shows amd input from Wetzel creek.)

http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/cs/groups/public/documents/document/D_001510.pdf

"Black Creek drains an area of approximately 60.4 square miles in Luzerne and Carbon Counties and is a tributary of the Lehigh River. The source of Black Creek is located several miles west of Weatherly, and it completes a more than ten-mile journey, entering the Lehigh River in the Lehigh Gorge State Park at Penn Haven Junction. The creek has four main tributaries: Hazle Creek, Beaver Creek,Wetzel Creek, and Quakake Creek. The creek is impacted by mine drainage from two AMD discharges. The Quakake Tunnel, which drains the Jeansville Coal basin, enters Wetzel Creek. The Hazle Brook overflow enters Hazle Creek near the old beryllium plant. Pennsylvania DEP classifies the creek as a HQ-CWF from its source to Beaver Creek and a CWF from Beaver Creek to its confluence with the Lehigh River. The creek is listed on the 1998 303(d) list of impaired streams in Pennsylvania. The Black Creek has the largest discharge of the four AMD-affected streams in the study with a mean discharge of 71.64 cfs (32,078 gpm). It accounts for between 23 and 24% of the mine 116 drainage factors entering the Lehigh. The creek is the second highest contributor of AMD acidity, aluminum, iron, and sulfate. Aluminum, pH, and alkalinity fail to meet Pennsylvania Chapter 93 water quality standards at this site."

 

[lycoflyfisher]

Many of the hazel creek discharges have treatment systems in place that our greatly improving the water quality. The quekake tunnel discharge is the main problem. There are solid macro populations and the locals say they are seeing brook trout above the confluence with quekake. If the quekake discharge can be treated this stream definately has potential to be a solid fishery.

 

[RyanR]

lycoflyfisher wrote:
Ok are we talking about black creek that runs through weatherly? If so I was just there last week collecting macro samples, and have to go back later in summer to do an electro fishing survey. Right above town there is great habitat, huge boulders that form deep holes, great riffle areas and tons of cover. I can see the sample results beings skewed if that's where the survey was.

No, he's talking about Hayes Creek on the other side (eastern) of the Lehigh river bank. Hayes is also known as Black Creek but it's not the same stream that runs through Weatherly.

As far as the survey sites, 100 meters isn't a small segment to me. We're talking two sites that are each 300 feet in length. I kinda doubt that these two areas are the only stretches with good habitat and the entire rest of the stream is only marginal. I didn't do well either on the time or two I fished Hayes but I've seen the survey report and some of the photos from it and talked with a fellow that was there for the survey. It's legit.