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trout17
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ryguyfi,
I'm really surprised that you have not seen some information concerning the Marcellus Shale and its problems. While it can bring money and jobs, the environmental and safety facts aren't as well known as the technology of drilling. I attended a meeting in Pittsburgh and wrote this on the Fly Fisherman's Paradise web site:
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Marcellus Shale Moratorium meeting - Pittsburgh
Postby Jim Kearney on Sat Jul 31, 2010
I thought this an appropriate Forum for this topic since some people had suggested this Forum be used for this topic.
I attended a Marcellus Shale Moratorium meeting on Thursday evening in Pittsburgh. It dealt more with drilling in the City of Pittsburgh (yes, the City) than a statewide topic but I found it very interesting, particularly my discussion with a University of Pittsburgh professor working on the Shale issue. The Lawrenceville section of Pittsburgh has had 60 leases signed already and more than a hundred more in the works and the City of Pittsburgh has over 250 leases signed in all areas. Most leases were presented to home owners by hanging an information packet on a door knob telling the property owner of the untold wealth beneath them. People signed and mailed in leases with that information only! A representative from Cheasepeak Energy was there and told everyone that due to the 1,00o loads of water needed to frack and the logistics of getting through the city, they would not be looking to drill in the City. Of course, the obvious question was "Why are you signing leases?". Well after being pressed by the 250 or so people in attendance, he said with the new technology, they can be up to a mile away and still drill under the Lawrenceville section and recover natural gas and really wouldn't be drilling "in the City". The bulk of the meeting was this kind of banter with the standard "we have never polluted a drinking source, we never have been responsible for water wells blowing up and we strive to be as responsible as possible for our activities, the problems have been human error or unethical contractors who the industry is trying to eliminate.
After the session I spoke with the University prof and it was worth my 90 minute drive to attend. He had spent the day in Danville, PA working with others on Frack Track, a system to follow frack fluids once used, what chemicals used, methane gas identification and other related matters. He is for the moratorium but wants at least five years to do research because as he put it, we don't know enough about any phase of the drilling process. I asked him directly about the dumping of water in old wells as disposal for the fracking fluid. His comment was that; this simply means that the drillers have decided that we will need to worry about this later not today. The drillers own geologists have admitted that this water will work its way back up into the aquifers. They say 100 years, studies in Wyoming have shown less than 10 years, but the bottom line is they do come back up and pollute for the next 100 years. Even the DEP has said that frack fluid from the Clearfield County explosion are still flowing into Little Laurel Run and TDS (salt) is 3 to 5 times higher than one might suspect. This brings up another problem being worked on by the Professors group, a catalog of water quality prior to, during and after fracking to truly see the results. Additional comments concerning the storage or dumping in old wells was that water is already in high demand in PA and other states and the drillers have dumped hundreds of millions of gallons into the ground that are not accessible for use (for better or worse)for years. His concern was less water in the streams means higher levels of bacteria in summer as we all ready know from experience and the resulting fish kills and gaps in fish resources. Another concern was drilling into an old seabed (Marcellus) has its own bacteria and what is coming up with the frack, gas or simply air flows? One politician there at the meeting said that the State is very close to final environmental regulations. The professor told me later, laughingly that "we don't even know what all the problems are yet".
Did you know that fracking has caused 2 earthquakes south of Cleveland? Do you know that several small earthquakes have happened throughout the Marcellus area while doing seismic testing? Do you know that most leases are for "wet" natural gas and should the gas be "dry" once recovered, no royalties are paid, no property needs repaired and most costs are borne by the land owner? This is happening quite frequently in the Northern Tier and will happen more and more as this drilling becomes more prevelant. The advice at this meeting was to have a lawyer present before signing a lease. Road conditions are becoming more and more concern.
The professor basically said that not enough information is available at any level to truly have answers to the Marcellus Shale issue. Obviously the drillers have and did say that regulations are already hindering them and enough regulations are in place to protect people.
All in all I came away from the session even more disturbed by the events that unfolded. It is truly an us against them issue. Sorry for the long post but this only scratched the surface of information. Groups present that were for a moratorum included Pittsburgh Clean Water Action, Pitt Environmental Law Clinic, Three Rivers Coalition, two legislators present and the Pittsburgh Councilman who held the event.
If you have any questions about other things discussed, please respond.
Jim Kearney
The only problem with the Gene pool is that there is no lifeguard.
Jim Kearney
Contributing Member
Posts: 140
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2008
Location: New Castle, PA (mostly) or Mill Hall, PA
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I'm really surprised that you have not seen some information concerning the Marcellus Shale and its problems. While it can bring money and jobs, the environmental and safety facts aren't as well known as the technology of drilling. I attended a meeting in Pittsburgh and wrote this on the Fly Fisherman's Paradise web site:
* Edit post
* Report this post
* Reply with quote
Marcellus Shale Moratorium meeting - Pittsburgh
Postby Jim Kearney on Sat Jul 31, 2010
I thought this an appropriate Forum for this topic since some people had suggested this Forum be used for this topic.
I attended a Marcellus Shale Moratorium meeting on Thursday evening in Pittsburgh. It dealt more with drilling in the City of Pittsburgh (yes, the City) than a statewide topic but I found it very interesting, particularly my discussion with a University of Pittsburgh professor working on the Shale issue. The Lawrenceville section of Pittsburgh has had 60 leases signed already and more than a hundred more in the works and the City of Pittsburgh has over 250 leases signed in all areas. Most leases were presented to home owners by hanging an information packet on a door knob telling the property owner of the untold wealth beneath them. People signed and mailed in leases with that information only! A representative from Cheasepeak Energy was there and told everyone that due to the 1,00o loads of water needed to frack and the logistics of getting through the city, they would not be looking to drill in the City. Of course, the obvious question was "Why are you signing leases?". Well after being pressed by the 250 or so people in attendance, he said with the new technology, they can be up to a mile away and still drill under the Lawrenceville section and recover natural gas and really wouldn't be drilling "in the City". The bulk of the meeting was this kind of banter with the standard "we have never polluted a drinking source, we never have been responsible for water wells blowing up and we strive to be as responsible as possible for our activities, the problems have been human error or unethical contractors who the industry is trying to eliminate.
After the session I spoke with the University prof and it was worth my 90 minute drive to attend. He had spent the day in Danville, PA working with others on Frack Track, a system to follow frack fluids once used, what chemicals used, methane gas identification and other related matters. He is for the moratorium but wants at least five years to do research because as he put it, we don't know enough about any phase of the drilling process. I asked him directly about the dumping of water in old wells as disposal for the fracking fluid. His comment was that; this simply means that the drillers have decided that we will need to worry about this later not today. The drillers own geologists have admitted that this water will work its way back up into the aquifers. They say 100 years, studies in Wyoming have shown less than 10 years, but the bottom line is they do come back up and pollute for the next 100 years. Even the DEP has said that frack fluid from the Clearfield County explosion are still flowing into Little Laurel Run and TDS (salt) is 3 to 5 times higher than one might suspect. This brings up another problem being worked on by the Professors group, a catalog of water quality prior to, during and after fracking to truly see the results. Additional comments concerning the storage or dumping in old wells was that water is already in high demand in PA and other states and the drillers have dumped hundreds of millions of gallons into the ground that are not accessible for use (for better or worse)for years. His concern was less water in the streams means higher levels of bacteria in summer as we all ready know from experience and the resulting fish kills and gaps in fish resources. Another concern was drilling into an old seabed (Marcellus) has its own bacteria and what is coming up with the frack, gas or simply air flows? One politician there at the meeting said that the State is very close to final environmental regulations. The professor told me later, laughingly that "we don't even know what all the problems are yet".
Did you know that fracking has caused 2 earthquakes south of Cleveland? Do you know that several small earthquakes have happened throughout the Marcellus area while doing seismic testing? Do you know that most leases are for "wet" natural gas and should the gas be "dry" once recovered, no royalties are paid, no property needs repaired and most costs are borne by the land owner? This is happening quite frequently in the Northern Tier and will happen more and more as this drilling becomes more prevelant. The advice at this meeting was to have a lawyer present before signing a lease. Road conditions are becoming more and more concern.
The professor basically said that not enough information is available at any level to truly have answers to the Marcellus Shale issue. Obviously the drillers have and did say that regulations are already hindering them and enough regulations are in place to protect people.
All in all I came away from the session even more disturbed by the events that unfolded. It is truly an us against them issue. Sorry for the long post but this only scratched the surface of information. Groups present that were for a moratorum included Pittsburgh Clean Water Action, Pitt Environmental Law Clinic, Three Rivers Coalition, two legislators present and the Pittsburgh Councilman who held the event.
If you have any questions about other things discussed, please respond.
Jim Kearney
The only problem with the Gene pool is that there is no lifeguard.
Jim Kearney
Contributing Member
Posts: 140
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2008
Location: New Castle, PA (mostly) or Mill Hall, PA
* Private message
