UV dubbing, trout vision, etc...

KeviR

KeviR

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I have been wondering about the new "UV Enhanced" tying materials.
I've seen a few references that state that trout can see UV wavelength light.
A lot of folks claim the "UV enhanced" materials work better.
I haven't ever tried a direct comparison to see if that is true.
Have you ever done or seen a direct comparison to test this?
Can anybody describe the mechanism that is supposed to make these materials better?
Some materials fluoresce under UV light, but I think that's a different thing - a fluorescent material is converting UV light to a visible light wavelength so it appears to our eyes to "glow" because we can't see the UV, but we can see the new wavelength. If the theory is that trout can see UV wavelengths, then a material that converts UV light to a different wavelength might actually be counterproductive, depending on what wavelength it is. (If trout happen to be less sensitive to the new wavelength.)
 
KeviR said:
I have been wondering about the new "UV Enhanced" tying materials.
I've seen a few references that state that trout can see UV wavelength light.
A lot of folks claim the "UV enhanced" materials work better.
I haven't ever tried a direct comparison to see if that is true.
Have you ever done or seen a direct comparison to test this?
Can anybody describe the mechanism that is supposed to make these materials better?
Some materials fluoresce under UV light, but I think that's a different thing - a fluorescent material is converting UV light to a visible light wavelength so it appears to our eyes to "glow" because we can't see the UV, but we can see the new wavelength. If the theory is that trout can see UV wavelengths, then a material that converts UV light to a different wavelength might actually be counterproductive, depending on what wavelength it is. (If trout happen to be less sensitive to the new wavelength.)
Click to expand...
My understanding is only juvenile trout can see the UV spectrum >

"Because adult trout lose UV vision as they age, their lenses absorb UV light to protect the retina from some harmful effects of UV light. In juvenile trout, UV vision may aid in foraging for drifting plankton. They can detect delicious floating food thanks to scattered UV light in clear water."
 
afishinado said:
My understanding is only juvenile trout can see the UV spectrum >

"Because adult trout lose UV vision as they age, their lenses absorb UV light to protect the retina from some harmful effects of UV light. In juvenile trout, UV vision may aid in foraging for drifting plankton. They can detect delicious floating food thanks to scattered UV light in clear water."
Click to expand...
Wow. Perhaps "UV" qualities are a bit of a marketing ploy?
 
I think trout see UV and see colors differently than we do. However, most of the UV stuff is marketing to me, especially shine a UV light and see it glow. BTW, I think this ploy is in overdrive since most of us have UV lights to cure resins so can check UV fluorescence ourselves. 20 years ago few people had a UV light.

Sometimes different brands of dubbing that look the same color to me have different results with the trout. Maybe a UV reflection difference that we can't see? I think natural materials produce more natural reflection than dyed materials in most cases. For example, my wets and nymphs with natural black collars produce far better than ones using dyed black necks.
 
I actually fell for this fly fishing ruse (and more than a few others) almost 20 years ago, buying some UV Ice Dub when it first appeared on the market.

Maybe it's me, but I didn't like the way it looked in sunlight and it didn't fish any better in my experience so I doubted its effectiveness.

It now sits in a drawer with other secret weapons that failed their lethality tests.
 
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I have mixed feelings about ice dub in general. The newer stuff is very coarse and hard to get on the thread and the colors are very difficult for me to discern.
 
JeffK said:
However, most of the UV stuff is marketing to me, especially shine a UV light and see it glow.
Click to expand...
Yeah that drives me nuts. The glow from a "UV" material hit by a UV flashlight isn't what the trout are seeing under actual use conditions (if anything) since we can see it too and the whole premise is that they can see what we cannot. The UV flashlight is causing fluorescence. The material is actually changing the wavelength of the UV light to be within our visible spectrum. Maybe the trout eye is more sensitive to seeing fluorescence and can see that glow from the UV in natural sunlight, but that still isn't UV they are seeing and it's not how the products are being sold.

Another thing that drives me nuts is people getting flies wet and then thinking that is how they look under water. Dry, wet, and underwater and three different things.
 
salmo said:
I have mixed feelings about ice dub in general. The newer stuff is very coarse and hard to get on the thread and the colors are very difficult for me to discern.
Click to expand...

I've noticed the same thing lately. The texture and colors are just a complete crap shoot. I have 4 or 5 different shades of "peacock" and they are all the same SKU from the same company.

I've been using more and more of this stuff: https://www.flytyersdungeon.com/Materials/Chart_StarBurst_Dubbing.htm
 
salmo said:
I have mixed feelings about ice dub in general. The newer stuff is very coarse and hard to get on the thread and the colors are very difficult for me to discern.
Click to expand...

I have the tendency to buy a LOT of a material if I like because much of it gets discontinued down the road. Hearing this about Ice Dub makes me happy I have a lifetime stash that I bought close to 20 years ago.

FWIW - I never use Ice Dub without using a tacky wax on my thread. Overton's (a tube I've been using since it first appeared on the scene), or BT's Super Tacky are my favorites.
 
Those who believe that UV or UV enhanced fly tying materials might attract fish might also wish to determine whether the transmission of those same UV rays might damage or kill fish, fish eggs, beneficial waterborne bacteria or other microorganisms in the waters that they fish. ….ah hum. 🤔

On anther note, SLF Prism Fibers are superior to Ice Dubbing anyway, and good enough for my flies without any UV or UV enhanced whatchamacallits.
 
I collared some of my beaded PTs in peacock ice dub last winter, then fished them alongside my straight and hot spot PTs this last season. Straight and hot spot PTs outfished the ice dub collared ones.

I do like the ice dubs for my two main jig streamer patterns (jiggy fry and sculp snack).
 
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