two handed switch rod opinions...Sage?

[BigRedChevy11]

Hey guys iv been considering buying a two handed switch rod for swinging streamers for trout and steelhead. also i think it would work great for smallies, shad and stripers in the Delaware this spring/ summer.

iv been doing a lot of research but its tough finding an opinion that is not bias.

one thing that seems to be common is that the majority of rods seem to run "heavy". meaning a 6wt is more like a 7 and a 7wt like an 8...

am i right so far?

for what i am doing i think a 6wt should be good but if i lip into a decent striper or salmon i may wish i had the 7. what do you think?
i dont plan to target big kings or 40'' fish so anything above an 8wt is unneeded in my eyes.

my next question is with these switch rods doing skagit/scandi style casting with heavy line is it worth the extra $$ to buy grade A? obviously i will not be able to get the full potential out of an expensive rod but some day i may get to use 90% of it and i hate buying "Starter kits" only to upgrade in a year or so.

it seems like the big hype lately is the sage method. has anyone fished the 7119 or 6119?? i would be interested in knowing if it in fact is much better that say a $250 switch rod.

if not what are the better options for these switch rods in the 11-12 foot range?

thanks!

 

[krayfish2]

BRC,

I'm not a switch / spey guy but my understanding is Beulah rods are excellent at a fraction of the price. Only other rod I've heard mentioned a lot is the "death star" model (tcx).

 

[sandfly]

I use a batson 10'8" 6 wt. and love it. most of the rods in the mid price range are decent. if you want top end then Beulah. a 15' leadcore and 100' running line would work wonders on the Delaware. add a floating head for swinging surface flies.

It doesn't matter what everyone else says to get go try a few and decide which one feels right for you !!

 

[tridentfly]

Big Red,

Unfortunately, there are no hard and fast rules when it comes to spey. There's really been no one in the industry to try to get manufacturers together to standardize things.

That said, you're probably on the right track. The 7wt is by far the most common size for Spey and switch and easily covers Salmon (not kings), steelhead, and stripers. But you could probably get away with a 6 as long as nothing too big hits it.

On to the second part of your question...

I have 3 speys - a 7126 Method (which is amazing), a 4119 ONE, and a Winston 3wt.

The biggest difference between rods is going to be distance and taper. You want the bend in the rod to be in the middle rather than near the tip, which is to say you want a rod with a stiff tip.

There aren't many rods with that profile and a low price tag, but I've heard good things about the top end Beulah and Echo rods. TFO and Redington Dually are probably tops in the price category below that.

I wouldn't recommend getting a Sage unless you're going to go with a ONE or Method (preferred).

 

[sandfly]

The biggest difference between rods is going to be distance and taper. You want the bend in the rod to be in the middle rather than near the tip, which is to say you want a rod with a stiff tip.

wouldn't it be a mid flex not tip. thats how its been done for years.

A slow rod is defined as one in which the rod flexes more evenly along most of its length (see Progressive Taper below). A medium rod has a greater percentage of its flex in the upper 1/2 of the rod while the lower 1/2 is more stiff. A fast action has more flex in the upper 1/4 to 1/3 of the rod and begins to stiffen sooner along it's length.

 

[whheff]

I have always wanted to get a switch rod but all the different lines and things just got too confusing. Then my friend told me about the Redington Dually and the Rio Switch chucker lines.
I bought the 7wt and matched it to a 7wt switch chucker, these lines are made to match the rod, and really like this set up. Since I plan to use it for Steelhead and on the Delaware I figured the 7wt was the perfect size.
I have only cast it a few times but after watching a few videos I was doing pretty good with this set up.
Bill

 

[tridentfly]

sandfly wrote:
wouldn't it be a mid flex not tip. thats how its been done for years.

A slow rod is defined as one in which the rod flexes more evenly along most of its length (see Progressive Taper below). A medium rod has a greater percentage of its flex in the upper 1/2 of the rod while the lower 1/2 is more stiff. A fast action has more flex in the upper 1/4 to 1/3 of the rod and begins to stiffen sooner along it's length.

sandfly,

That's why I avoided using any of those terms. IMO better spey rods don't conform to the single-hand definition of slow-mid-tip/fast. If you were to divide a rod in 3 (tip-mid-butt), my favorite speys flex something like fast-mid-mid or fast-mid-fast. The reason this works well, is that the first part of the spey cast is the 'lift' and if the tip gives, it makes it much tougher to get the line off the water (particularly for skagit + sink tips).

Unfortunately, it's one of those things that's tough to explain, easy to experience.

 

[MBJRL]

Meiser switch rods are very nice and Bob has been doing it a long time.
Go to his web site and give him a call, tell him what you want to fish and he can set you up with the rod and any line combo you may need.

 

[808transplant]

As with any 2 handed question posed anywhere, you will get a lot of different results and opinions because, like tridentfly said, a lot of this information hasn't been codified yet. There are a plethora of rods out there that have different properties, behaviors, flex patterns, whatever. You won't truly know what you like for what until you've cast and fished a number of them.

*THIS ISN'T A REASON TO BUY AN ENTRY LEVEL ROD IF 2 HANDERS INTEREST YOU*

If this is something that truly has your interest piqued, but a better rod with a good line. It will make your life easier just like buying better materials makes tying flies easier.

The truth is, it's always a guessing game until you find your happy place. It took me years before I found my magic trout rod. I'm still in the process of finding my magic spey rod.

To give you an example, I ordered a 12'8 7 weight Scott T3H and learned how to cast and fish with it. Once I became comfortable, I wished I had bought the 12'8 6 weight for the fishing I was doing. Instead of repurchasing, I got ordered a 13'6 7 T3H so I could learn how to cast a midbelly. THE NEXT DAY, Scott announced the 13'6 6 weight. -_____-

Here's the kicker, the T3H isn't overly fast by any means, but yet it still has the ability to throw a Scandi head which is really my cup of tea.

Like most people have said here, call someone who has messed with a number of these rods and talk through the options and offerings that are out there. They'll at least be able to get you pointed in the right direction.

I'll be in the shop at TCO-Bryn Mawr tomorrow if you want to give me a call.

(610) 527-3388 x2..

-Jared

 

[TDB]

I love the switch rod craze. They are really cool for getting in some different style of fishing from time to time on the right water with the right conditions. I had the Scott T2H and T3H and got rid of both. Now I have 2 of the Orvis Helios - love them. I'm selling my 6weight, like new - posted in the Swap Forum if interested.

Whatever you buy or try, it will bring a new interesting twist to your experience. I love the 6 or 7 - with both you can nymph out west, swing streamers on a larger eastern river, or fish the great lake tribs for steel...

 

[geebee]

OP - how long have you been spey or skagit casting ?

i would suggest some lessons and a casting demo day at a fly store to try out some rods and lines.

there is no 'one' rod and line for you - unless you're already a good caster, its a trial and error process - hence the dozens of lines and heads on sale every week on speypages.

i also think that unless you are already an excellent spey caster then buying a Loop, Hardy or Sage skagit rod is not going to help you any - you're better off putting the practice and fishing hours in with an T&T, Redington, Echo, Meiser, Guideline etc off Ebay or speypages - but check the Rio line guides produced by Rio on their for the grainweight for your rod, and save a ton of hassle and buy the versitip pack for that grain weight.

once you become a better caster, you can always mess about with different heads and mono shooting lines etc.

by spring i should have a second Skagit set up together (along with my spey setups), i'd be happy to let you have a cast with it to let you get a feel of it - who knows, maybe we could have a little delaware skagit clave if anyone else is interested ? LOL

cheers

Mark

 

[geebee]

this rio's spey line recommendations page - also covers skagit & scandi lines.

http://www.rioproducts.com/spey-central/spey-line-recommendations/

i find it a good starting place to match a rod to grain weight of the head.