To the Army Corps of Engineers at Blue Marsh Lake

[timmyt]

Couldn't you have just left the stream fishable for one day, one stinkin day, we finally get some rain, you blow the dam open to 200 for day then wind it back to 60!

A couple days at 100 would have been just fine thanks

Its a real shame to see such a great trout stream completely mis-managed by the powers that be

 

[sandfly]

remember they are built for flood control not recreation......

 

[vcregular]

TimmyT...it appears you do have a gripe, however it is very doubtful the Corps reads PaFlyFish.com. Look for me to send you a pm with two email addresses that you can contact if you are interested in finding out the rational for this sort of release.

We all must realize that the Corps is good at building dams, but when it comes to mgmt, they are well behind the curve. And Yes, Sandfly is correct, the dam was built with a primary purpose of flood control...but, the lake level only rose a few tenths of a foot from the rain. Surely, this is no reason to open the gates like they did.

Pasted below is the chart for Blue Marsh - and 'normal' summer pool-level is 290'.

 

[timmyt]

Supposedly that dam wasn't built for flood control...there is a gentleman who works for the fish and game in that area who posts on here, I think his handle is Mike or Mike-something, but I could be totally wrong on that...

I digress, this guy said that the reason for that dam is to keep the salt line in the del river below where the philly takes their drinking water

I was a little upset when I posted this thread because I was planning to go fish there tomorrow, sorry if I came off like a jerk

I would like to email someone actually and see if we could improve the situation there fishing wise. Obviously there are other priorities besides fishing, but perhaps something could be done to make everyone happy.

I'll give it a try and let you all know how I make out

happy fishing and GO REDSKINS

 

[afishinado]

Timmy,

The Tully is now at 61cfs. Actually, I think it fishes best at 150-200 cfs. The water temperature below the dam is high, at around 70* F+/-. At his time of year, there is no cold water left in the lower levels of the lake, and the release from the lake actually increases the water temperature. The Tully above the dam at Bernville is 4-5*F cooler since the water temperature follows the air temperature.

(Click on the temp and discaharge parameter for a reading)

http://waterdata.usgs.gov/pa/nwis/uv/?site_no=01470960&PARAmeter_cd=00065,00060,00010

http://waterdata.usgs.gov/pa/nwis/uv/?site_no=01470779&PARAmeter_cd=00065,00060,00010

Good luck tomorrow.......

 

[ian_brown]

Jay and I fished the Tully yesterday, and it was bathwater temp. We caught rock bass, but no trout.

 

[jayL]

Save your time man.

Seriously. Beautiful stream, but that's about it right now. Caddis are everywhere, but it's just too warm. It was running at a real good clip, but It felt like a hot tub.

 

[TimMurphy]

Dear timmy,

I credit the Tulpehocken for making me the trout fisherman that I am.

I grew up in Bucks County in the 1960's and 70's and thought that the Neshaminy Creek at Playwicki Park was the wilderness. I didn't know any better.

In 1987 my brother Terry and I set out to the wild's of Berks County and a day on the Tulpehocken. We didn't fish for a half an hour before we realized it was the Neshaminy Creek and hour and a half away from home. We skedaddled to the Pocono's and never once looked back.

Get out of town and go find a real trout stream. You'll know one when you see one and it won't look anything like the Carpehocken.

Are the refrigerator and '47 Chevy hood still stuck in the clay on the bank just below the bridge below the dam at the Carpy like they were in 1987?

Regards,
Tim Murphy

 

[afishinado]

C’mon Tim, the Tulpy ain’t the Madison, but it’s a decent place to catch some easy fish when all the other stocked streams are fished out or too warm. It will cool down and be decent in a few weeks, and it will be fishable throughout the fall and winter.

 

[TimMurphy]

Dear afishinado,

You're right, I'm being much too harsh in my judgement of the Carpehocken. I simply hate the place, but I never cared much for Reading anyway so maybe my judgement is faulty?

I have to say that it played a huge role in making me the fisherman and fishing buddy that I have become and for that I suppose I should be grateful?

I know it sounds like a line of BS, but if I had never gone there fishing with my brother in 1987 I'd have never met any of the people from the Pocono's who have gone on to become my best and dearest friends.

The Tulpehocken gave me the stuff that money cannot buy, for that reason only it will always be one of my favorite cricks even if I never fish it.

Regards,
Tim Murphy

 

[LehighRegular]

Timmy T
For the record, BM was built for flood control FIRST and foremost. Recreation is a by-product and has been incorporated into the lakes operational mandate. Flood control will always be the basis for managment of the lake. The downstream fishery is a 2ndry by product too, which does get some consideration but not much.

As VC said, you need to take your gripe to the Corps and the Fish Commission, specially Mike Kauffman. Mike should be able to help you out if you explain why current mgmt is not beneficial to the down stream "resource". He can't keep track of everything.

I think the point here is that the Corps did not need to dump, 180 cfs for 24 hrs, then cut it back to 110 cfs for 8 hours, then cut it back again to 61 cfs where it is right now (Sept 15). The idea would be, in this instance to have a steadier release of 120 cfs (+/-) over an extended period of time. This would benefit the downstream resource. The "Less is More" theory...Less of a release over a longer period of time.

THe underlying question is did a .35 ft rise in lake elevation create a flood risk??? The decision makers at the Corps may have felt it did or did the lake level encroach on recreational facilities in BM (ie - boat ramps?). I don't know?

But the question should be presented to the Corp and Mike K. IMO - the water could have been managed better. But like VC said, the Corps is not very good at doing that, but if you don't ask them they won't ever know???

So my recommendation is to send the Corps and Mike an email with your complaints. I think they are very valid.

 

[JackM]

For what it's worth, and I have no idea if this applied in this case, but releases often also account for the forecast. If more rain is expected in the near future, they may release more than you think they "needed to" based upon hindsight rather than the foresight that they relied upon when making the release decision.

 

[flyfishermanj]

To extend what JackM was saying, high water events are also good for stream habitat and for spawning of native species. Though there were plenty of high water events this year, maybe there still was a silt build-up, which makes for poor spawning. I've never fished there, so I don't know. There are many scenerios to this, hopefully the anwser can be provided.
JH

 

[jayL]

I don't think there's any spawning going on in there. Except for carp (I hate to encourage Tim... but it's true )

 

[flyfishermanj]

jayL,

As I mentioned, I've never been there, but I'm sure there are other fish present other than trout and carp. The point I was trying to make was that there are many reasons for them to "open the gates". As a flyrodder, I have come to appreciate the wonders of all life in our streams. From the stuff that we can't even see to those damn suckers and chubs and I've seen silt turn streams into underwater deserts.. Maybe they were flushing out some silt or testing a repair on the dam itself. Hopefully timmy can get an answer from someone in the know.
JH

 

[jayL]

I understand. I was just supplementing your comment a bit. I know it encompassed more than just trout and carp, I was just taking a chance to give a little info and to take the needle to Tim, the tully's biggest anti-fan.

 

[2bonthewater]

there is no such animal in the commowealth as the fish and game...we need to know who we are talking about...........or who we need to talk to................

the PA fish and boat commission
the PA game commission

2 totally different organizations

 

[vcregular]

2bonthewater -

You are 100% correct.