Stocking is done already!

[Wallyfish]

I normally don't fish open water however I have some health issues that prevent me from flyfishing my favorite project waters.

I really wanted to hit some local unregulated water hard this year. However high water has limited this. I fish a lot in Westmoreland and Somerset counties and the inseason stocking is already done for the spring and its only May 13th.

I also like to fish Oil Creek in Venango County and that stream had only one in season stocking that occurred in late April.

Some of the streams in these counties are quality streams and instead of 2-3 inseason stockings like happened in the past, they only saw one inseason stocking this year.

I don't keep fish but I do respect those that keep fish legally. So I am not out killing fish.

I really liked the old days where the trout stocking season lasted from the opener to Memorial Day.

Compounding the short season is an apparent cut back in the number of fish released. My wife and I took a ride last week to see two Westmoreland County streams being stocked. My health prevented me from helping them stock and fishing. But I was very surprised to see how few fish that were stocked in quality water. One very large and popular hole had only one bucket of fish released

Does anyone else share my frustration?

In days gone by, I would run out to the State College and Bedford County areas to flyfish project water. So I didn't fish close by open water frequently.

I don't know if it is a combination of global warming and budgetary cutbacks that have caused this. But something has changed.

 

[moon1284]

80 percent global warming 20 percent budget cutbacks.

 

[timbow]

moon1284 wrote:
80 percent global warming 20 percent budget cutbacks.

Fake news

 

[lycoflyfisher]

with the water conditions last year, there were stocked trout all over the place all summer long. Given the current weather I would anticipate more of the same for this year... Unless the stream is very small it is unlikely that it gets "fished out".

 

[Bamboozle]

I personally would rather the PFBC doesn't waste money stocking streams when the viability of the fish is as short as it would be in many streams at the end of May, just to appease a handful of anglers who need a 100 stockers in every hole.

It's really nothing new that the majority of Stocked Trout waters aren't exactly the ideal environment for trout with many getting up into 70-80 degree water temps as early as Memorial Day for years. The creation of the Regional Opening days and cutting back on in-season stocking was a good idea IMHO.

In the meantime...I only fish two stocked streams, mostly because one holds some wild trout while the other holds fond memories. Based on the rain we had last year and the reports I heard about holdovers in many SEPA Stocked Trout Waters I hit the "fond memory" stream in October and had a great day.

In other words, get out and fish and don't blame your catch rate or lack thereof on the stocking schedule.

 

[PennKev]

Wallyfish wrote:


I really liked the old days where the trout stocking season lasted from the opener to Memorial Day.

I like the new days when the stocking is done early and the morons leave the streams as early as possible. As many fish should be stocked as early as possible IMO.

 

[maxima12]

Pennkev, who you calling Moron. That is why you will never get it!

You will always be a second best at fishing, thinking that way!

Maxima12

 

[silverfox]

This thread is going places.

 

[Swattie87]

I have the answer! It's simple, and everyone should be happy with it!

Take the stocked fish allocated for the small, forested, wild Trout freestoners, and stock them into these larger, marginal streams (like Oil Creek) with increased numbers and increased frequency during the season, like the OP is suggesting. Best of both worlds, everybody's happy. Lock the thread.

 

[Mike]

It sounds as though in your assessment of the stocking situation you are reviewing perhaps 20 years of past history. The reduction in hatchery production that occurred began with the closure of a major PFBC hatchery (Big Spring). Other hatcheries had to reduce production in order to meet water quality standards associated with their discharges. Finally anglers were asked if they preferred that the PFBC raise larger trout or more trout and the result was that the majority (I think 60-70%) preferred 11 inch avg trout vs 9.5-10 inch avg trout (averaged over an entire stocking season). Raising larger trout naturally reduced the number that could be raised if the agency was to keep the biomass, and thus the water quality, the same in the hatchery discharges. Across time the production dropped from about 5.1 million trout down to 3.1 million.

From my standpoint, I am glad that most stocking occurs in April and perhaps very early May in many waters because this is when stocked trout anglers are primarily fishing. Inseason angler use drops considerably as spring progresses. In addition, despite the earlier termination of stocking I find plenty of fish remaining in the stocked trout streams that I frequent in the SE and very light pressure in the last half or three weeks of May. This is almost too ideal and certainly does not suggest a that there is a need for more restricted waters to make sure that stocked trout are available in later spring. Given the frequently high water conditions this spring, I am expecting a bonanza of fish and very few anglers when the water finally returns to more fishable levels and clarity. Financially speaking, that's a shame, but it does provide a grand opportunity for wise anglers to have the kind of fishing that many anglers desire, but quit too soon to experience...low angler use and high catch rates.

Swattie, add the words "documented lowest use" to your above comment about the freestoners, or other waters for that matter, and you are really headed in the right direction from my viewpoint. I suspect that statistically speaking there is probably some overlap between your preference and mine when it comes to the waters that would be involved if some were ever removed.

Wallyfish, I just read about your wading difficulty mentioned below. If you were in the SE I could point you to more than a few meadow or agricultural streams where you could readily fish without wading. Perhaps there are some similar streams in your region. A call to your local Area Fisheries Manager's office in Somerset might be helpful in locating some additional waters in your general region that might meet your needs.

 

[Wallyfish]

Just to clarify. Due to chemo nuerapathy, I can't feel my feet which makes wading very difficult. What little stream fishing I have done is on local water and in areas where I don't have to wade.

I don't think it makes much sense for late May stockings where fish will perish in weeks due to high water temperatures. I would advocate starting the season in late March/early April in the southern counties thus extending the season.

I also believe what Swattie87 said about higher fish allocations to high quality streams such as Oil Creek and Laurel Hill Creek and fewer fish in streams with native trout.

I normally don't fish open streams as I am addicted to high quality fly fishing only streams. But this year, my health issues has forced me to fish locally.

My low fish catching rate this year is solely based on my inability to wade. My original post was based on 25 year old observations of stocking of local streams. Then after not fishing those streams for 25 years, the stark difference in today's stocking rate.

Living in Westmoreland county puts me in the center of a metropolitan are of 2.3 million people. Eaisily accessible streams such as Loyalhanna, Four Mile and Laurel Hill Creek to name a few gets absolutely hammered with bait fishermen. I just hope my health returns so I can get back to my beloved project waters.

 

[pcray1231]

Yes, they stock about half the fish they used to.

I also believe, from observing the bigger, stocked waters, that the number of stocking points has been reduced, or at least far fewer fish in the less popular spots, but they still load up what are seen as popular fishing spots. Goes along with the "put them where most likely to be utilized" philosophy.

In other words, if they used to put 10 buckets in 5 different spots in a stretch, for 50 buckets. Now they have maybe 25. They'll put 10 buckets in the 2 most popular spots. Get rid of a spot. Put 2 or 3 in the other 2 spots.

Then observe that most anglers only fish the 2 most popular spots. Drop to 2 spots and split 25 buckets between them. Making the most of the fish.

 

[afishinado]

pcray1231 wrote:
Yes, they stock about half the fish they used to.

I also believe, from observing the bigger, stocked waters, that the number of stocking points has been reduced, or at least far fewer fish in the less popular spots, but they still load up what are seen as popular fishing spots. Goes along with the "put them where most likely to be utilized" philosophy.

In other words, if they used to put 10 buckets in 5 different spots in a stretch, for 50 buckets. Now they have maybe 25. They'll put 10 buckets in the 2 most popular spots. Get rid of a spot. Put 2 or 3 in the other 2 spots.

Then observe that most anglers only fish the 2 most popular spots. Drop to 2 spots and split 25 buckets between them. Making the most of the fish.

All true above ^

Also, stocking trips from the hatchery have been consolidated for economy and efficiency, therefore the drivers have more streams to stock in their run. Less time spent stocking on each stream means less stocking points.

I think it's a good thing that stocking streams is done early since, as Mike posted above, the interest in trout fishing wanes by many anglers by mid May or so. It doesn't make a lot of sense to stock fish too close to the time when the waters warm to temps too high for the survival of trout in many streams.

 

[gfoledc]

Wallyfish the good news from my experience is by next spring the numbness should go away by the fall you should be back to normal
Good luck

 

[PALongbow]

I don't think the timing of when they stock matters. Stocking by the state has dramatically decreased over the years to the point where local sportsman clubs and land owners do more for the trout stocking program than Fish and Boat. I guess it has to do with decreasing number in licenses sold and participation levels. People are just not hunting and fishing like years ago....other priorities have taken it's place.

 

[troutbert]

PALongbow wrote:

Stocking by the state has dramatically decreased over the years to the point where local sportsman clubs and land owners do more for the trout stocking program than Fish and Boat.

The PFBC stocks about 3.1 million trout.

And the PFBC provides a lot of support for the coop nurseries which stock about 1 million trout.

The number of trout stocked by all other parties is probably less than 1 million.

And much of the stocking by private parties is on stream mileage closed to the public.

 

[Mike]

I documented the general history of the decrease and the reasons behind it earlier in this thread. Some of the decrease was supported by a majority of stocked trout anglers who, based on stream-side interviews statewide, preferred that larger fish rather than more fish be stocked. A large portion of the decrease was required to meet water quality standards in streams to which the hatcheries discharged.

 

[troutbert]

afishinado wrote:

pcray1231 wrote:
Yes, they stock about half the fish they used to.

All true above ^

I think the number of trout stocked by PFBC + coops combined has dropped by about 1/3, not 1/2.

That's using Mike's numbers for PFBC stocking, and the coops holding steady at about 1 million per year.

 

[PALongbow]

Troutbert - You do realize the 'private party' fish do swim upstream and downstream of private property where they are proudly creeled and seldom released to be caught again.

Thanks,
Ron

 

[maxima12]

Mike, let's go toe to toe on what you wrote. 1. Stocking based on angler survey?
2. water quality standards?

When I was active at a higher level, over 20 years ago. Stocking was decreased because of no money. Hatcheries closed because of no money. One year loss of 80,000 plus license sales. 8 trout limit, lowered to 5, again no money

Commission promised larger stocked trout, not from a survey but appealing to angler trust, in a trust us, you will like what we do!

We trusted! Fish were a lot larger the next year and gradually their size decreased.

At the meetings, I disagreed, I wanted limit raised to 14 trout. Wanted streams close to town or in towns, stocked heavily, so youth could walk or ride bikes not having to have parents drive them to go fishing. This also included locals, who would like to harvest tout to eat and an easy access for the elderly. Almost was in until T.U. stopped it in its tracks, stating water was too warm.

Stocking close would have had an impact on Wild fish. Less pressure. Stocking close would have an impact on license sales.


Unfortunately, from bad decisions the money spiral is just about finished. Not only at the tackle shops, stores, gas stations, and everywhere else fishing has brought in Millions and Millions. It has hit home in Hbg. Get better, no! Worse, not quite yet. But tilting towards disaster.


Now, this wild trout big talk, regs, notions and potions! You need Money for programs like this in a big way. Another program that will be limited due to funding.


Put your faith close to home, in towns, state parks then work outward.

Last! Women fishermen, Youth fishermen. Women will boost your bottom line in license sales now! Youth will boost license sales in the future over a period of time. When you get the women you will get the children. Don't know of many men that have custody of children in todays world.

Maxima12