Solar Roadways

This is just another "gimmick". I posted about this when my cousin linked it on Facebook. I'll try and find it. I had all the numbers calculated and it just doesn't pay. It has to do with sun angles, solar cell efficiency, etc. Might make for nice driveway though.
 
Agreed. If someone comes up with a wild idea that's just not feasible, then the proponents blame "big oil" for squashing it. Just the way it is. Truth be told "big oil" is one and the same as "big energy" and they are the leaders regarding alternative energies like solar, wind, biofuels, and the like.

Kinda like the zero point energy/perpetual motion folks. Yep, big oil squashed that one. Hey, I know, lets make cars that run on rainbows and unicorn farts! Let a few years pass, and when it doesn't come to fruition we'll blame big oil for squashing another. After all, some dude out there is still studying it and "has proven" it will work. Simply send him a check to invest in this great opportunity.

Anyway, this one is a cool idea. But the economics aren't there. And I can't imagine it being safe. Something to keep an eye on and encourage. But I'd foresee uses on more the local scale. Like a driveway, parking lot, etc. That could perhaps expand to public roadways in unique situations where the benefit/cost equation looks better. Say, the desert SW, where sun angles are better year round, clouds are less common, there's no shade from trees, corrosion is less likely, snow removal and other foul weather phenomena less troublesome, etc.

Of course, then I'd presume lining the right of way next to the road with traditional solar panels would likely yield more energy (based on better efficiency of single purpose solar panels, and the ability to angle the panels to face the sun), and do so at a far lower cost than tearing up an existing roadway to lay a new one with special materials.
 
Stevie-B wrote:
This is just another "gimmick". I posted about this when my cousin linked it on Facebook. I'll try and find it. I had all the numbers calculated and it just doesn't pay. It has to do with sun angles, solar cell efficiency, etc. Might make for nice driveway though.

I went on the WEB site of one of the solar road proponents. I reviewed their math on the amount of power they could produce and found many errors. To the tune of about 1.5 orders of magnitude. Even with that there are still more unanswered questions such as traction, loss of efficiency for surface abrasion, road dirt, etc. I can just imagine the damage a snow plow does after a winter like we just had. Notice they don't discuss cost.

 
It seems very impractical. Too expensive, too many complications.

There are many other options that are much more practical. There are solar panels going up on the flat roofs of big box stores, office buildings, warehouses, etc.

But the percentage of that big roof real estate that currently has solar panels is very, very low. It must surely be far less than 1%.

So why would you undertake solar in a very difficult and expensive situation, when there are such huge opportunities to do it where things are far simpler and cheaper?

There are also big opportunities to add hydro units to existing dams. For example, the dam at Bald Eagle State Park. Stop by there sometime and see and hear the water roaring out of the tailrace. There's a lot of energy there that could be tapped into by adding a turbine and generator.
 
troutbert wrote:
It seems very impractical. Too expensive, too many complications.

There are many other options that are much more practical. There are solar panels going up on the flat roofs of big box stores, office buildings, warehouses, etc.

But the percentage of that big roof real estate that currently has solar panels is very, very low. It must surely be far less than 1%.

So why would you undertake solar in a very difficult and expensive situation, when there are such huge opportunities to do it where things are far simpler and cheaper?

There are also big opportunities to add hydro units to existing dams. For example, the dam at Bald Eagle State Park. Stop by there sometime and see and hear the water roaring out of the tailrace. There's a lot of energy there that could be tapped into by adding a turbine and generator.

Wonder if anyone has done a cost analysis on something like that?

Spent last week on that lake bass fishing. Stayed at the campground there. Bugs aren't out yet this year. Great area for a fishing/camping vacation. Didn't even get down to Spring Creek.
 
There was an article in the local paper about some company proposing to install a turbine there. They've done similar installations at other sites and think it would work financially here. Haven't heard lately of further developments.



 
But guys, seriously. Big Oil! They killed the Unicorn Fart Car.

 
 
I tell you what. If some oil company comes and drills a well on my property, I'll put in an in-ground pool and surround it with those things but heat the water with gas.

There goes your theory that oil companies will kill it.

They are damn cool, but no way they would be cost effective any time soon. No way they are more cost effective than solar shingles and the payoff on those (last I checked for my region) is longer than the life expectancy.

But to some people and many politicians this just doesn't matter because it isn't their money.

Would be cool on small scale and private sector though.

 
Franklin,

Per the article, the panels would melt the snow so there would be no need to plow. Not sure how that would work since it is usually cloudy when it snows and snow tends to limit the amount of light the panel receives.

If I remember correctly, most commercially available solar panels are about 18% efficient. There are some laboratory models that get up to 44% but even that puts us at magnitudes of 100's short of what the US consumes every year.

If we are truly serious about the energy issues of the world, I think we should ALL be talking about thorium and LFTR reactors. My opinion, take as you may.
 
I couldn't decide which one to post. P.S. use headphones.





 
Stevie-B wrote:
Franklin,

Per the article, the panels would melt the snow so there would be no need to plow. Not sure how that would work since it is usually cloudy when it snows and snow tends to limit the amount of light the panel receives.

If I remember correctly, most commercially available solar panels are about 18% efficient. There are some laboratory models that get up to 44% but even that puts us at magnitudes of 100's short of what the US consumes every year.

If we are truly serious about the energy issues of the world, I think we should ALL be talking about thorium and LFTR reactors. My opinion, take as you may.

Guess they never have seen it snow at night.

We have discussed this in many other threads on this site but when working up the numbers on solar most of the calculations involved multiplying fractions less than 1 by many other fractions less than 1. The number gets small real fast.

The 18% they use is one of the realistic parts of their analysis. 25% is about the top end of PV cells available today for industrial use. The major mistake is that many people use the power rating of the panel as the output level. In Pa it is very rare to achieve 70% of the published rating on the peak day of the year. And efficiency degrades as they age. Figure 20% degradation over 20 years.
 
How slick would these suckers get when they're wet?
 
The_Sasquatch wrote:
How slick would these suckers get when they're wet?

Good question. Traction usually means a rough surface. Light transmission usually means a smooth surface. Anyone drive winter tires with studs?
 
I'm glad you guys had fun with this one. I didn't post it because I thought that it was practical or even feasible. I merely thought some people would enjoy outside the box thinking. This may not be the answer to some of the environmental issues that we discuss on here such as water quality degridation due storm water runoff, or our concerns about fraking due to our dependence on fossil fuels but you all sit on here and demand that our politicians do somthing to curb the negitive impact that "Big OiL" or more locally, the marcellus shale fracking initiative in Pennsylvania has on our precious streams, rivers and lakes.

How is that working out for you?

 
I for one appreciate you posting it. I find this type of subject to be interesting and had never heard of the solar roadways. Although not cost effective especially if retrofitting to an existing house, still quite interesting.

I may be building a new house in the next 6 to 10 years at which point I will be revisiting the solar shingles. Will also revisit these for the driveway or patio since if I do build, the location is way more sunny than NE-Ohio. Southern exposure, too.
 
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