Reel and Rod Balance

[MD_Gene]

Gene Cyprych

I know it's perosonal preference but question- I have a cane rod which I like but is a little heavier than glass rods. I think the reel should be at a weight that balances the rod somewhere on the handle. In other words one should be able to balance the rod and reel combo on their finger somewhere on the rod handle. People agree?

 

[SBecker]

I agree. I have been trying to find a reel to balance my 10'6 3 wt. Only reels that are balancing it at the end of the handle is 7,8,9wt reels. This is normally not the reel that other European nymphing fishermen are using though.

 

[TimMurphy]

Dear Gene,

Generally yes but sometimes it's not always that simple.

I've read of people putting 6 or 8 ounces of lead shot into a Pflueger Medalist and winding up with a reel spooled with fly line and backing that weighed 20 ounces plus to balance a rod.

That's absolutely absurd. I have Penn 650 spinning reels that hold 250 yards of 17 pound test and are used on 10 foot surf spinning rods and they barely break the 20 ounce barrier when spooled with line.

Personally, I think if you have a rod that you can carry with the tip facing forward and you aren't having to watch for the tip digging into the ground as walk then your outfit is reasonably balanced.

There is a lot made about nothing at times, and balancing your outfit like a fulcrum is one of those things that means nothing to me. If I can fish with it it's usable, period, end of story.

Regards,

Tim Murphy

 

[BobS]

Static balance in the middle of the hand on the grip is acceptable to me, but I prefer a balance point farther forward. This is never a problem for me with bamboo.

What I positively do not like is a butt-heavy rod, where the tip always seems to be up and bobbing around. Had this problem with short, light graphite rods.

Adding weight to a reel to make it balance a rod is just a matter of compounding bad choices.

All in all, the balance thing isn't a big deal. What feels right to you is right for you.

 

[pete41]

Well, if you hold your hand out the way you hold it for most fishing it would appear that 10;30 till 11;00 is the natural position.

 

[MD_Gene]

Tim., Thanks for the insights. My concern is would the lack of balance make one work harder thereby increasing the possiblity of fatigue. ?

 

[TimMurphy]

Dear Gene,

Unless the rod and reel is horribly tip heavy to the point where you have to consciously think about locking your wrist when you cast I doubt it will be much of an issue.

Think about how much time you actually spend waving the rod around in the air and go from there. If you do a great deal of false casting balance might be more of an issue for you.

I try hard to follow the advice of my late friend Tony Gabriel Sr. He watched me false casting too much and said, "Hey Fatso, you won't catch **** with your fly in the air."

Since then I've taken great care to reduce my false casting. ;-)

Regards,

Tim Murphy

 

[Maurice]

SBecker wrote:
I agree. I have been trying to find a reel to balance my 10'6 3 wt. Only reels that are balancing it at the end of the handle is 7,8,9wt reels. This is normally not the reel that other European nymphing fishermen are using though.

10'6 3 wt. Baffling!

I just cannot seem to wrap my head around those two numbers being used in the same sentence. Please explain....

Are you fishing drys from a kayak on the LL?

 

[Rolf]

MD_Gene wrote:
Tim., Thanks for the insights. My concern is would the lack of balance make one work harder thereby increasing the possiblity of fatigue. ?

As much as I hate to ever agree with him, Tim is right. I have a few bamboo rods and I can’t think of a one that balances in the middle of the grip. Most of mine balance one to four inches forward of the grip. I’m an old skinny guy and have never got tired because of that. Relax, its fishing.

Good Luck,
Rolf

 

[SBecker]

Maurice wrote:

SBecker wrote:
I agree. I have been trying to find a reel to balance my 10'6 3 wt. Only reels that are balancing it at the end of the handle is 7,8,9wt reels. This is normally not the reel that other European nymphing fishermen are using though.

10'6 3 wt. Baffling!

I just cannot seem to wrap my head around those two numbers being used in the same sentence. Please explain....

Are you fishing drys from a kayak on the LL?

I am not sure if you are trying to poke me with your comment, but I think my last sentence tells you what I am using it for.

 

[MD_Gene]

I too noticed that I was once false casting too much. I was fishing Penns with a guide and he pointed that out to me. Now I try to keep it to a minimum.

 

[afishinado]

I'm a balanced rod guy. Not for casting, but for fishing. Fighting a tip-heavy or butt-heavy rod all day is miserable for me. Not really necessary though...personal preference.

Mo, 3 or 4wt, 10'+ rods are all the rage for Euro nymphing.

 

[pcray1231]

It is an issue. I have an 8 ft, 5 wt boo. It is VERY front heavy. And yes, it leads to premature fatigue and an undesirable action when not properly balanced. But when you balance it, as was said, it feels a lot sweeter. It's not the overall weight of the rig that leads to fatigue, it's the "misbalanced weight". You can have a very heavy rig that's balanced right and it'll do just fine.

I'm not saying it has to be "perfectly" balanced. All in all, a few inches difference on the balance point isn't a huge deal. If it's just in front of, instead of on, the cork, that'll do. You just don't want it way out, like approaching the first guide.

On all my rods, graphite or otherwise, I actually prefer a slight front bias. I try to balance it at the front end of the cork, plus or minus an inch or two. The rods I've casted where the fulcrum is on the hand seem backheavy to me, like the reel is controlling things rather than the rod.

Unfortunately, almost all modern reels are made for graphite sticks. You can either put a bigger size of reel on, say, a reel meant for a 7 wt on a 5 wt. You can search for ancient models, such as the medalist. Or sometimes, the super cheap reels of today are considerably heavier. You can also put weights in the reel.

 

[gulfgreyhound]

Find a butt cap or use a crutch tip,the rubber ones that will fit the rod butt. Flatten some lead and put it inside the cap and put it on the rod butt. Add lead till it balances the rod with your reel and where it is comfortable.

 

[Grey]

My preference is a balanced outfit because it really is more enjoyable to fish with ... for me.

It isn't about the false casting. I doubt that many of us do so much false casting that an unbalanced outfit would cause much fatigue. It's about what happens at the end of the cast, and during the drift as we are leading the flies. Dries or nymphs or streamers, we usually have the rod extended forward to some point and that is when fatigue can take it's toll. For me, it's mostly on the forearm muscles which have to work to counteract that tip weight.

But, if you add a little weight behind where you grip the rod, then that weight takes the strain off of your forearm muscles. The best way I found to add weight was some lead-core trolling line on the spool before the backing. It usually doesn't take much.

One other thing to consider is the weight of the fly line in the guides. Do you want the rod balanced with or without the fly line in the guides. It takes a lot more weight behind the grip to balance the rig with the fly line out.

Obviously, rod balance doesn't matter to everyone, but MD_Gene if it's something that bothers you, I'd try to balance it and see what you like best.

 

[ConMan]

TimMurphy wrote:
Dear Gene,

Unless the rod and reel is horribly tip heavy to the point where you have to consciously think about locking your wrist when you cast I doubt it will be much of an issue.

Think about how much time you actually spend waving the rod around in the air and go from there. If you do a great deal of false casting balance might be more of an issue for you.

I try hard to follow the advice of my late friend Tony Gabriel Sr. He watched me false casting too much and said, "Hey Fatso, you won't catch **** with your fly in the air."

Since then I've taken great care to reduce my false casting. ;-)

Regards,

Tim Murphy

LOL That made me laugh

 

[brain]

i like a well balanced rig.

 

[Tiltaxp]

gulfgreyhound wrote:
Find a butt cap or use a crutch tip,the rubber ones that will fit the rod butt. Flatten some lead and put it inside the cap and put it on the rod butt. Add lead till it balances the rod with your reel and where it is comfortable.

Definitely great advice. placing weight on the butt cap will give you the most effect for the least amount of weight. Adding it at the reel is a solution but not the best. On a long graphite rod that is hollow it's much easier then a cane pole though.