Question - Installing Studs into Felt Soles

[Skook]

I apologize if this question has been discussed before. I just purchased a pair of Orvis Encounter felt sole bootfoot breathable waders for my son (currently on sale: $279 for $149). He's in college and doesn't fish very often but needed waders. I opted for these because of the price and the fact that I would not have to shell out for separate wading boots. He can always upgrade later if he starts getting out more often.

Anyway, I'm familiar with the pros/cons of felt vs. studded rubber vs. aluminum bars, etc., having fished using all of these types myself. However, I have never installed studs into any boots that were not specifically designed to accept them.

Assuming that I would use only studs that had a shorter length than the depth of the felt sole, is it a good idea to install studs into felt soles that do not appear to be specifically designed to accept them?

I just don't want to have the studs penetrate through the felt and into the boot bottom.

Thank you, and Happy New Year!

 

[PennKev]

Skook wrote:


Assuming that I would use only studs that had a shorter length than the depth of the felt sole, is it a good idea to install studs into felt soles that do not appear to be specifically designed to accept them?

In my experience you need the screws to be seated in the firm material of the sole to have any chance of them staying in. If you are thinking that you can just screw them into the felt, you will probably be disappointed by how poorly they stay attached. That said, the sole under the felt may be too thin to hold onto the screws also.

The boots should provide good traction with just felt though, so I don't think there is too much to worry about if you can't get the screws in firmly. Since these are boot foots and not designed to accept studs, I'd worry about the screws piercing the bottom of the boot. Even if they are not embedded in the sole, the felt will compress and the points of the screws will start to poke into the bottom of the boot.

 

[dryflyguy]

I recently did this on a pair of Patagonia Ultralight wading shoes, with no problems

These boots have a thick sole. And I could tell the stud tips weren't even close to coming through inside.
They also have a removable insole, giving further leeway.

And after I screwed the studs in for the first time, I removed them and ground the sharp pointy tip off. before reinstalling.
That should also help keep them from poking further into the sole than I want.

But I do agree with Pennkev about not doing it in boot foot waders.
Be pretty hard to get down inside that kind of boot to see what you're working with

 

[DGC]

Agree with above. I bought some Aquaz felt bootfoots and the grip is superb, very much on par with my bar boots, and much warmer in cold conditions. Aquaz further advises against installing studs and doing so invalidates the warranty.

 

[afishinado]

The thickness of the midsole (the layer between the sole and the bottom of the boot) determines what length studs or even if studs can be installed at all into the boots.

As a side note, many anglers complain that their studs fall out all the time, while others have studs their studs remain intact for the life of the boot. For studs to stay attached the boots need to have both a thick midsole to allow using longer stud threads and a midsole that is made of hard material. A soft midsole will likely never allow the studs to remain in place for very long.

Back to the OP's question. Encounter bootfoots have a thick midsole section at the heel but is very thin from the arch area to the toe.

And if you chose to use shorter studs which just penetrate through the felt, they would not be secure and come out very easily.

Since these are waders with attached boots, I would avoid putting studs in the front area of the boots altogether to avoid piercing the through the boot and causing a leak.

As was posted above, your best choice may very be to not install studs in these bootfoot waders. The boots should be fine for wading without studs.

 

[RLeep2]

I'd agree that the adding studs to felted bootfoots sounds iffy..

Too many things that either flat out might not work or could destroy the waders.

If your son is not fishing a lot at present, you/he might consider a removable system that can be used if and when wading conditions are potentially more than the felts can handle. Google "ice chains for boots and waders" and see if you find anything you like. I've done it this way when I was using bootfoot waders or hippers. Generally, they aren't real durable, but used judiciously (don't hike long distances in them, etc.) they can last a while and can offer some additional traction when needed. And they aren't very expensive

 

[ColdBore]

Spend the money that you'd invest in studs and buy a good wading staff.

If I find water that I can't safely navigate in felt soles (sans studs) and a good staff, I wouldn't be trying it with studded boots anyway.

 

[Bamboozle]

These studs DON'T fall out of plain felt and there is a size for every and any application:

https://www.gripstuds.com/

 

[bigjohn58]

Bamboozle wrote:
These studs DON'T fall out of plain felt and there is a size for every and any application:

https://www.gripstuds.com/

IF I ever buy a pair of boots again that need the studs installed I believe these are what I'll be going with. I've had horrible experience with screw in style studs. They just can't handle the torque put on them while walking a stream.

 

[Skook]

Thank you all for the good advice. I haven't yet decided exactly what I will do, but I appreciate the thoughts and suggestions.

 

[afishinado]

Skook wrote:
Thank you all for the good advice. I haven't yet decided exactly what I will do, but I appreciate the thoughts and suggestions.

I know everyone is trying to help, but remember guys, these are molded rubber boots attached to waders, not wading boots.

Just a word of advice from someone that worked for Orvis, sold many of these waders, own a pair of my own Encounter bootfoots, plus saw what happened when folks tried to add studs.

On the molded rubber boots there are no thick portion of rubber to run studs into in the area from the arch to the toe. Plus it's soft rubber not a hard material like found in wading boots.

If you install studs you may think you're okay but when wearing the boots but your weight compresses the soft rubber and the studs pierce the bottom of the boot. Puncturing holes into attached bootfoot waders will cause them to leak into the boot rendering them useless. And they are almost impossible to repair since the boots are attached and you cannot easily reach in and Aquaseal the holes. This is not a problem for wading boots that are worn on the outside of stocking foot waders since they need not to be waterproof.

I would hate to see you waste the money that you spent for the waders and studs and/or have to repair a brand new pair of perfectly fine waders.

Felts alone work fine, as they have for many decades of use by anglers. If there are issues, the advice above about buying and attaching removable ice cleats or chains on the outside of the boots could be a solution.

Good luck.

 

[Skook]

OK. I'm a little thick-headed sometime, but I've read the last post (twice) from afishinado, and I have decided to leave well enough alone and scrap the idea of adding studs to the felt-soled bootfoot waders.

 

[dryflyguy]

Skook wrote:
OK. I'm a little thick-headed sometime, but I've read the last post (twice) from afishinado, and I have decided to leave well enough alone and scrap the idea of adding studs to the felt-soled bootfoot waders.

Good move